Kiss or Nirvana: Which is more overrated?

Whose more overrated, Kiss or Nirvana?

Kiss: Essentially a one-hit wonder (Rock and roll all night) yet they've not only toured for thirty years but somehow they've managed to get lots of credit for being good. God alone knows how. Saw them in 2000 on the "Farewell" tour and came away shaking my head. The performance was alright, considering the age, but the music just sucked. How can people put them in the same lexicon as a Led Zeppelin or a Rush? Not every band who put makeup on and dressed up was good. Case in point, hair bands. Gene Simmons couldn't string Geddy Lee's bass, let alone hang with him.

Nirvana: The lead singer was a mediocre (at very best) musician who was lucky enough to kill himself. See, when you die in music everyone automatically elevates you to the status of a god. Kobain, quite frankly, sucked. The very first time I heard "smells like teen spirit," instead of feeling this great swell of angst that was grunge, I felt like taking a long bath to rid myself of the smell of that crap. The lyrics (or lack thereof), were some of the worst I've heard, and I've heard a ton of bad lyrics. Every time I hear that song as #1 on some list I simply feeling like bitch-slapping all involved. The other two are fairly good, and Grol and Foo Fighters are decent, but Nirvana is simply okay at best and horrid at worst. Plus, because of Kobain now were stuck with Courtney Love. Oh joy.

So, which is more overrated? A simple binary poll for a Saturday night/Sunday morning.

Nirvana was actually talented. Kurt Cobain didn't need no stinking pyrotechnics to look good. Nirvana was all about the music. Kiss was about merchandising.

yes, Nirvana was about the music. Unfortunately, the music absolutely blew.

Bleach ROCKED THE HOUSE.

Nevermind SUCKED. It was just ROCK/POP.

Incesticide ROCKED THE HOUSE SOME MORE.

In Utero was all right. Some good, some bad.

Unplugged In New York FUCKING BLEW NUT CHUNKS. That wasn't even Nirvana playing on stage. That was the fucking RAINCOATS (Cobain's favourite band) playing.

And most of the rare songs were pretty good.

In the end, I will say that Nirvana received some unwarranted extra publicity, and to an extent, they were overrated. But it doesn't mean they weren't generally a good band.

however, the question was whether or not Nirvana was more overrated then Kiss. See, in my eyes, both are pretty bad, but I lean toward Nirvana being more overrated. No one says Kiss's best song is the best song of the past quarter century, but lots say that Smells like Teen spirit is the best. Smells like overrated to me.

For the record, the best song of the past quarter century was Rush's Tom Sawyer of the moving Pictures album.

You seriously don't think Kiss was more musically talented, do you???

I like Nirvana. Never been a big fan of Kiss though.

I think Nirvana are INFINITELY more overrated than Kiss -- and this is coming from someone whose musical taste includes the Stooges, Buzzcocks, Husker Du, My Bloody Valentine, Stereolab, Sleater-Kinney, Lee "Scratch" Perry, and Kruder & Dorfmeister among others.

Nirvana was absolutely revered by tons of critics and fans as being "the voice of Generation X," and Cobain is regarded by many people as a true musical visionary and genius. I'm not one of those people, however, and there are way too many other grunge, punk, indie and alternative rock bands that I found far more compelling than Nirvana.

On the other hand, Kiss has never pretended to be anything other than a cheesy but fun rock band. For the kind of music they played, I thought they were just as good as most other '70s/'80s hard rockers. And even though they and Rush shared the same fan base, I don't think most people thought the two bands were really all that comparable. Rush consciously emphasized technical chops, intellectual lyrics, and complex songwriting, whereas Kiss has never concerned itself with any of those things. If you're going to compare Kiss with other bands, a better choice of peers would be, say, Motley Crue or Guns N' Roses.

And I disagree with your statement that Kiss was essentially a one-hit wonder. Okay, it's true that much of the general public only knows about "Rock'N'Roll All Night," but they had a pretty long string of hits that a lot of people who listened to hard rock and metal in the '70s still remember, like "Calling Dr. Love," or "Cold Gin Time Again," or "Strutter."

I like what you said about Rush. I can pop in 2112 and listen to it over and over again. The album and song are superb. As a drummer(?) you gotta love Neil Pert on the title track.

My thoughts exactly on Nirvana, drumwolf.

Oh, and by the way, there's a thread about underappreciated bands at:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=105x856309

One interesting thing I've noticed from reading both of these threads is that many people confuse mainstream popularity with respect. They think that a lame band with excessive mainstream popularity is "overrated," and that if a band makes good music but doesn't get airplay on Clear Channel and doesn't sell to Moron-Americans in the suburban mall, that band is "underappreciated." Neither of which is true.

Your post mirrored my feelings perfectly. Why do so many otherwise intelligent music fans fall for the Nirvana hype? Were they horrible? No. Were they musical revolutionaries? No.

because I've never known the memebrs of KISS or anyone else to take them really seriously - even the members admit that the band is a really fun, rock and roll band, but that they aren't out to do heavy, serious stuff. They jammed and rocked, and I really like the early KISS, but I never took them truly seriously, and I never had the sense that they took themselves seriously, either.

So, Nirvana has to be the overhyped band because they thought they were serious and offering a "truthful" rock and roll ouevre, when in fact they weren't. I liked "Smells Like Teen Spirit" musicologically, because it rocked, but I never understood the words, and can only assume it's Kurt Cobainish faux-poetry that was really popular to "grunge" kids on trust funds or who were trying to be hip without having a clue about how things like, for instance, diction worked.

I hope you understand my point - I can't vote KISS because I don't think anyone, even them, took themselves truly seriously as "artistes" whereas Cobain felt he was the master of the entire generation and inherently grokked the sensitivity and aesthetic of the young crowd, when in fact he was nothing but a mediocre quarter-sized Jim Morrison with a stupidly non-creative herion addiction who put out what was basically half-assed twit-whirling insignificance.

put everything I've felt about Cobain in words. Thanks.

it was an inspired moment.

And as I said, I really like "Smells Like Teen Spirit" just in terms of the jam potential and the musical part of it. But lyric-wise - assuming I've ever actually understood the lyrics - is shit and sophomoric.

I'm a little too young to be part of the grunge movement (born in 1984, so I was like 8 when Nevermind came out), but even at the young age I first heard Nirvana I knew they were really not very good.

You're basing your opinion on your feelings when you were 8? So by the time your musical tastes were really developing, say 12ish, Cobain and 'grunge' were already dead. Actually, Cobain was dead when you were 10.

Nirvana isn't my favorite band, but I still listen to them now and then. Over-hyped? Maybe. Over-rated? Depends on who's doing the rating. Worthy of the worship some fans have? Probably not, but that could be said of Elvis.

Damn punk kids. This, from the generation that popularized Sublime and the Goo Goo Dolls. Oy vey. :evilgrin:

Kiss: sophomoric, derivative three-chord rock with a few decent hooks and the gimmick of wearing makeup and acting the part of bad boys.

Nirvana: became popular by ripping off the Pixies' wide dynamics and Black Francis' eccentric stream-of-consciousness lyrical style, and wrapping the whole thing up in angst.

I'd say each of them earns a prize as the most overrated bands of their respective eras.

It was even lame in the 1970's... sorry but that was my experience.

Just remember, I'm not saying there wasn't any unwarranted over-hype towards Cobain and Nirvana. I think they were on par with Alice In Chains, Soundgarden and Pearl Jam musically, but Nirvana recieved a LOT more undeserved credit than any of those bands, at least until "Jeremy" came out, and then he music industry tried to create some sort of Nirvana/Pearl Jam rivalry.

But I guess it is all subjective or just personal taste. I could never handle Rush (with the horrendous shrill vocals) and Foo Fighters is just plain boring to me. I saw Kiss in concert when I was real young and they just suck suck sucked. Nirvana's Bleach used to be one of my favorites.

Kiss ofcourse

Now, I would have to say that Nirvana was incredibly overrated, and therefore more overrated than KISS.

But I just want to say that even though I think Nirvana wins this one (being more overrated) I must reiterate that KISS really really really sucks.

both are hideous, but nirvana isn't anywhere near the level people put them on. Based on what I've read, Kiss essentially never took themselves seriously, so it might have been okay if they weren't very good. Nirvana regarded themselves as the saviors of music.

Nirvana was completely overrated. A very large group of people have mistaken some amazing right-place-right-time record company A&R with profundity and musical virtue.

Oh listen. A sloppily strummed semi-acoustic verse, a loud distorted chorus, and obtuse, meaningless lyrics sung in the exact same whiny voice every time. Repeat ad-nauseum in some variation on this theme.

And I'm someone who grew up with and still listens to punk, indie rock, hardcore, and any variations on the music scene Nirvana supposedly came from.

Thanks but no thanks. The only good thing that came of Nirvana was the death of the hair bands. But I'm not sure what they replaced them with (faux earnest whiny bands) was any better.

Their music sounds flat to me.

with $16 MILLION in the bank. Just goes to show depression knows no bounds.

And no matter what you think about Nirvana, you won't be seeing Kris Novoselic and Dave Grohl putting a roadie on stage with a guitar in his hand dressed up like Kurt Cobain. They moved on and made new music with new bands. As opposed to Chaim Witz and Stanley Eisen (a.k.a. Gene & Paul) who just keep on milking the same old shit

For Kiss to put some hack on the road in Ace's makeup was the absolutely last straw for any credibility they ever had.

I don't like Rush. I mean seriously, let's be pretentious and sing in a really annoying voice. There's one song of theirs I like, but I can never remember it until I hear it, which is once every few years. The rest of the time it's Tom Sawyer and Spirit of Radio. The way he sings "salesmen" cracks me up.

costume rock does'nt get anymore cartoonish than GWAR....great shows, standard 3 chord power rock...they would feed kiss to the human flytrap they carry onstage . and soundgarden was pretty under-rated in the nineties, having to live in pearl jam's and nirvana's shadows. soundgarden was recording and putting out good music well before either.

hey, how about a nod to the original seattle band..... queensryche!!!

hell... jimi hendrix for that matter......