To those who slander others candidates

I'd just like to say you all make me incrediably sick. I come to this place to leave the world of hate that has been created by the current administration but all I see now is petty arguements and down right children whinning because things might not be going the way they had hoped it would. Well guys, suck it up. What happened to the sentiment on this board of what, not even 6 months ago? What happened to "Ill support whoever gets the nomination!" Was it all a lie? Did you really mean "if its my person!" and just forget to post that side note? Are you all just as bad of liars as the repukes that we are fighting against? What is wrong with you people!?!
I see tons of you now saying you dont know if youll actually support the democratic candidate if its not yours...that is SAD. You are selfish and unwanted in this party if you cant think beyond your personal wants and needs to help the bigger picture. I have a candidate Id like to see win, Im no different from the rest of you in that respect. I will say this though, Ill be damned if ill idly sit by and watch another 4 years of this right wing goof and the slow and painful distruction of our country. Its already happening people. Things have already been changed. Theyve already put things into motion for years to come! What have we done? What do we have to show for our struggle against this administration? Not a damn thing. I think you can come here and read the posts about the primaries and figure out why. Grow up people. Dont be a sheeple to your candidate like most of the nation is to our commander and thief.

Come on guys. Lets pull together. Even you people who lean towards the green party, for the love of everything sacred, get this administration out of office! Sometimes you must sacrifice for the greater good! Dont be so stuck in your ideaology that youll let the worst happen just for the sake of feeling better about yourself. Dont do only what feels right for you, do whats right for this country. As long as their is a republican in charge we will all suffer. dems and greens alike.

Time to stop acting like kids fighting for a swing on the playground guys. Its almost 2004. If you people are already starting to give up hope, then we truely are screwed.

Lieberman uses Gore and Saddam in the same sentences like that warmonger puke bush used saddam and 911 in the same sentence to begile simple Americans to believe saddam had something to do with 911. It disgusts me.

personally i am a kucinich kid, he inspires me! i will support ANY democrat in the general election, but i'd like it to be the one that wants to make it legal for my mother who is suffering from massive chemo treatments to not be afraid to smoke marijuauna because that's the only thing that would help her maintain an appetite, she won't break the law, and this conviction to an archaic and insane law may kill her...

enough is enough...

it is possible to talk up the positives of your candidate with flinging dung like a drunken monkey!

ahhh politics, i love it!

ABB!
spike

(edit because i spelled marywanna wrong...we get enough of a bad rap)

;)

It's pretty much a showdown between the people who want to stick to the best principles of the party- social justice and government in the common interest- first and those who prioritize getting possession of power.

If the latter get control of the Party- via the nominee- the Right will already have won the election. (And they know it.) People won't see enough difference and vote for the evil they know.

Unfortunately you need possession of power to invoke social justice or change.
So winning must be the priority. Then we can sort out what exactly we want as individuals from our party(primaries are a good time for this also, but once someone is picked we must rally behind them). If the opposition wins, none of us will get anything remotely close to ideaology. Atleast with any democrat in office, they will be open to my ideas. With a repub, my ideas would get laughed at and thrown in a garbage can without making it past the title.

then why bother having principles at all? I won't vote for someone just because they have a (D) next to their name on the ballot. There may be worse things then four more years of bush.

I didnt say principles didnt matter. I know for a fact though that none of my ideas or principles will be recognised by a republican. All I'm saying is, come general election time, why doom you and your ideas to laying dormat in your head or on a forum such as this. what is that accomplishing? we need our ideas heard and that wont happen with a sitting republican president.

im not saying throw out what you believe in for the pure sake of the party, hardly. i think its obvious in my other posts that i dont mean that. for the sake of being heard though, yes. people are sometimes overally hostile on here to each other. I think its stupid to fight each other. you know who you like, and you should stick by that person if you believe in them, why the need to argue and bicker? Do you honestly think you're going to change anybody whos made up their minds decision? honestly? i just dont understand how people could actually say they wouldnt vote against bush. Ive even heard some people suggest theyd vote FOR him if their person didnt get nominated. how does that go with their personal principles? seems like a punch to their own face. A harder blow than not getting everything they wanted for the sake of the country as a whole.

Heck, maybe Im the only person who feels this way. Maybe Im a weirdo.... or maybe the drugs havent kicked in yet. Id hate to have to swallow my whole bottle of klonopin after another Bush victory. If I make it through that, Ill be off to Canada.

;)

will be as harmful in the long run. If we rally behind someone who can't handle the job and they prove to be as miserable a failure as Bush, albeit in different ways, we've probably thrown away the next midterms and the next two presidential races. That means we're screwed for a very, very, very long time. This election could set the stage, one way or another, for vast sweeping changes in the landscape and consciousness of this country.

It is all about principles and who best represents the peoples' issues not just their anger. It's time people stop looking for instant gratification and start looking farther down the road.

I could believe what you say. I can support most of our candidates - but, sadly, there are some that, I feel, will not give a rat's a#@ about me or my needs or feelings at all. Sadly, that feeling has just been reinforced here on this board by such posts as "Forget the South!" and "You might as well face it - your candidate doesn't have a chance". Add to that, various other posts pointing out negative things about every single candidate except the poster's. These kinds of things make me afraid of any old Democrat as much as the Republicans.

I see that something has happened here in my two weeks of absence that has resulted in more civility - at least on the surface. I am glad b/c, frankly, I was finished with hearing repeatedly that my ideas and opinions were stupid or just didn't matter. I was even told that my vote does not count since my state's primary is not until May. Maybe it doesn't have as much influence as someone's in Iowa, but, by Golly, my vote DOES COUNT.

How in the world can I swear to uphold ABB when faced with candidate supporters who try to push me out of the political process unless I blindly follow their candidate? The simple fact is that the actions of these supporters predispose me to view their candidate and his actions/words negatively and I just can't help that.

I will continue to support my candidate in any way that I can until after the primary. At that time, I will decide if the nominee is someone that I can whole-heartedly support. Thankfully, that could be several of the ones we have to choose from.

...to take a vote. When the party decides on a candidate, it will be time to band together behind that candidate.

It is always the time to run a positive campaign, whether you're on a candidate's staff or just representing him or her unofficially. Support your candidate until we vote. Then support our candidate. Support Bush, and you'll have to live with yourself for four years if he wins. Support Nader, and you'll have to live with yourself for four years if Bush wins, just like the past four years.

Attacking those who disagree with you...that's what Republicans do.

The reason I support a candidate in the primaries is to support the person who most aligns with my concerns, but also who has a chance to win. I can’t imagine not supporting the eventual candidate, and I agree that we have to stop taking shots at each other. We give the other side ammo when we do, and divide ourselves as well. Let’s work together and find ways to debate this issue with respect for our party and with a goal not only of winning but of unity, despite our differences. We do have more that holds us together than separates us, let’s focus on that. peace. R

I haven't given up hope. I support the candidate in the primaries who I believe holds the most hope for a better America. I have never suggested that I would not vote for whatever dem is nominated. The difference would be whether I vote for that person with hope and enthusiasm, or begrudgingly. There are a few of the 9 I would not be enthusiastic about. And that, my friend, is not slander. It's a fact about the way I feel.

Slander: 1. the utterance of false charges or misrepresentations which defame and damage another's reputation 2. a false and defamatory oral statement about a person--compare libel.
--Webster's 10th Collegiate Dictionary

At what point does discussing/debating a candidate's platform, words, record, etc. become slander or libel? When the assertions are false. It is not "selfish" to bring potential problems with candidates to the light of day. It is looking at "the big picture." What is selfish, and short-sighted, is to claim that every problem discussed about a particular candidate is "false" or "slander." The inability to look at each candidate realistically does not do the party any good. It also does not do the party any good to tell people you don't agree with that they are not welcome in the party. Not exactly a good plan for getting out the vote.

That said, I've seen tons of "misrepresentations" here on DU; usually leveled by one supporter against another, but also offered by a candidate's supporters. It's the political "spin."

"Even you people who lean towards the green party?" I am a democrat. I like the greens. I agree with much of their platform. I guess that means I "lean" toward them? When you say "Even you people" it smacks of condescension. I'm sorry. But it does. It could just as easily be "Even you brown people; Even you liberal people; Even you peaceniks; Even you tree-huggers;" etc., etc., etc... Get the picture there?

I'll be working to take out Bush next november. With hope, or without it. That doesn't mean that I will shove a candidate's dirty laundry under the rug to keep it hidden until after the general election. That, in my book, would be unethical.

Well, itd be hard to be condescending to myself since i am infact one of 'those people' too. how should i have stated that to fit your overally PC world exactly? please fill me as so i dont offend those of the green party. Lord knows I dont wanna offend myself.
I mean how overally sensative can we get people?
Would I be wrong If i went up to a group of friends at a golf course and said "Wow, you people look like you are having fun!" ? Would I be wrong to tell a group of random people infront of the establishment i work for that specifically says no loitering to "Would you people please move on"? Should I say 'you guys'? Cause then im descriminating against the girls in the group. When does being PC go to far guys? seriously? I could understand if I was being racist or a bigot, but I wasnt. You are right though about the word slander, it does involve lies. You can honestly say nobody on here has made up stuff? I cant say that , thats for sure. If something is fact, then so be it, share it, but why add your two cents? just to rub things in peoples faces? whats the point? All it does it make people upset and either give more support for their person or want to leave the system all together. Nobody said politics was nice, lord knows its not, but surely we can all be civilised in the way we act towards each other. We have a common goal. If we dont put aside petty differences, we will always be the the party that is plotting how to defeat the sitting republican.

So, Im sorry if the phrase 'you people' wasnt appropriate for the context in which I used it. I dont think so, but whatever floats your boat. I think its just proof that we like to argue or disagree with each other just for the sake of doing so.

Someone earlier in the thread asked who I supported, but I will not be saying who. Thats not with this thread is about. This is about all of us a whole. As Americans. Cause I know there are green party supporters out there lurking on the board cause we are all very like minded in social and environmental issues. Thats why I say we need their help. You hafta ban together for the greater good and not be so stuck and selfish in your ways. Thats just another form of closed mindedness and we are no better than the radicle right that controls this country if thats the case.

Im just giving another rally call guys. Whether you decide to run with it or not is on you.

Im glad to see people re-affirming their commitment to support the eventual candidate. Im not saying everyone give up what you believe and fall in line, thats what repukes do to their constituants, but there does come a time when you have to think in the larger picture and whats ultimately better for this country and not just you alone. It just saddens me to the nth degree to hear someone say theyd rather vote for Bush than the nominee that they didnt support in the primaries. That literally makes me want to be sick.

At any rate, goodluck to you and whoever you support and enjoy this beautiful thing that we are given. The right to vote.

"Democracy is coming, to the U.S.A." - Leonard Cohen

I will enjoy this beautiful thing that we are given: the right to vote.

:toast:

And say that you may be able to understand the "you people" reaction a little better if you realize that I've read twice in the last two days here on DU that we ought to elect a progressive candidate just so he can fail and we can kick the progressives out of the party. And that, my friend, makes me sick.

and I know I'm sounding like a broken record here, but the candidate bashers are relatively few in number but are prolific posters. Trying to debate with them is a complete waste of time. I'm really glad that the Administrators saw fit to open up a second GD. I lurk there occasionally but, for the most part, stay out of it. I don't go to FreeRepublic either for the same reason. I put the chronic bashers on ignore.

I think part of it is a concerted effort from one particular candidate's blogs to swarm DU. I think part of it is that we have a lot of people new to politics and, for some reason, they see this as some sort of sports event, never seeing the real danger that is lurking.

Besides not venturing into the second GD much and putting posters on Ignore, I find that going out and registering new voters, working for the Dean, Boxer and Castillo (local city councilperson) campaigns keeps me focused in much more positive ways.

i may be putting my head on the proverbial chopping block, but i was never a 'pretend i know things' kind of guy...the question implys only my lack of knowledge on the subject...if i do not ask, how else will i know?

i no not the origin of the term 'freepers' either, but i am thinking it may have something to do with 'free republic'???

help me out, flam me if you must, but please answer!

thanks in advance!

happy holidays!
regime change in '04
spike

is www.freerepublic.com. I've been there on maybe 3 occasions and the idiocy that takes place there is no different than the idiocy that takes places with candidate bashing.

And just for the record, I rarely flame anyone. Not my style. B-)

things seem to be calming down re: candidate bashing..shhhh...

one love
spike

that is one frightening place, and i will not be going back there...

*shudder*

that's what i get for being curious...i hope it washes off in the shower...

they are obsessed with us from the little i read...

i'm gonna go puke now

The big corporations are controlling the country today. They took over the Republican Party decades ago. They took over the Democratic Party now also, and with Clinton, we elected our first closit Republican - with NAFTA and all. Senator John McCain said it, "We are all corrupt!"

The in-fighting you are referring to is the democratic wing of the Democratic Party trying to rescue the Party from the right. The voters are yearning for a Presidential candidate with sufficient guts to challenge the Corporate Military Empire we have. Those in power (beholden to the corporations) are fighting back the pressure from the people who want justice.

There are core issues that the American people need resolved. that what elections are about. Each of us have a list of issues that must be addressed to motivate us to do something.
You are not bahsing someone when you stick to issues and show how adequate or inadequate he/she is.
After the convention, I see not point is pointing out those defficiencies. But, if a candidate wants our energy that candidate will have to deserve it.. I might not hit on my parties nominee once the person is elected. However, if issues that are core to me are not a part of the parties agenda, then that candidate can only expect what he/she deserves.

When the Bush machine unleashes it's $200 million on the Democratic nominee.

That candidate will have to stand up to a lot more "bashing" then you're seeing right now. When Dean stops raging, he will not have the qualifications, patience, or temperment necessary to win the general election.

If you really care about removing Bush, you'll want to put the best Democratic candidate up against him.

Clark is the only who can can beat Bush - period.

I beg of Democrats to get off the wayward train. It reminds me of the great mastadons which were herded off high cliffs by the first humans.

Obviously, in both cases the end result is very bad.

See, its people like you im talking about.
this thread has nothing to do with any kind of supporting of any person and yet here you are DEAN CANT DO THIS BUT CLARK CAN!

God, you people are all the same. We cant just talk about something can we? We gotta advertise. See what this country has done to us?

the lack of focus on the issues. people are busy bashing candidates because they are not prepared for debate. this is frustrating. for example, i posted a thread a few months ago, i asked the DUers to coment on their candidate's stance on the issue of civil liberties (or the lack there of). this issue is very important to me and should be to all who care about the idea of america, but i did not get more than one or two honest points( only dean supporters, to their credit). it seems to me that inbetween good inteligent debate posters are flooded with bashing and (equaly frustrating) baseless cheerleading. get back to the issues and the attacks will thin out.

This time we MUST be united....and, we must all enthusiastically work for our nominee. It is just TOO important not to. I hope and pray that all of those who oppose the current administration will rally behind whomever we nominate in Boston.

Do we?

Have have to support whomever the Democratic nominee is!

But, now is the big decision making time for us to determine our direction for the future. Whom we pick now is going to make all the difference in the campaign and in our futures.

Frankly, I believe - truly - that Bush cannot win next year after the people realize what is going on. It is the Democrats job to tell the people "what is going on". If they do their job, WE WILL WIN!