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OKIsItJustMe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-28-08 07:18 PM
Original message
Xcel Energy to store wind power with new battery
http://www.reuters.com/article/rbssIndustryMaterialsUtilitiesNews/idUSN2862440020080228

Xcel Energy to store wind power with new battery

Thu Feb 28, 2008 5:30pm EST

By Nichola Groom

LOS ANGELES, Feb 28 (Reuters) - Utility company Xcel Energy (XEL.N: Quote, Profile, Research) said on Thursday it will begin testing a battery to store wind energy so it can be distributed consistently, no matter if the wind comes in strong gales or light breezes.

The one-megawatt (MW) battery, when fully charged, could power 500 homes for over 7 hours, Xcel said.

"We are going to use it to shape the output of the wind farm," Xcel Director of Corporate Planning Frank Novacheck said in an interview, adding the battery would serve as a sort of "shock absorber" that will charge when the wind blows and supplement power flows when there is little or no wind.

Wind generation in the United States has been growing at a rapid pace as utilities seek to reduce greenhouse gas emissions, in some cases because states are requiring more renewable power.

...
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ben_meyers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-28-08 07:23 PM
Response to Original message
1. Now that's what I'm talking about,
Edited on Thu Feb-28-08 08:15 PM by ben_meyers
For both wind and solar, to make it viable.
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hunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-28-08 08:25 PM
Response to Original message
2. More clueless reporting
What the heck is a "one-megawatt (MW) battery?"

You could get one megawatt out of a car battery. You just couldn't do it for very long.
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ben_meyers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-28-08 08:53 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. A megawatt (MW) is one million watts!
Pretty big Die Hard you have there.
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Ready4Change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-28-08 10:24 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. No, he's right.
Connect a car batterys terminals with a fork and you'll get a megawatt for a split second, plus get a face full of sparks and molten terminal lead. Maybe even get a fork that's glowing bright red/yellow.

I'm weak on the terminology. But his objection is that a battery doesn't store watts. It stores watts over time. For example, you might say it stores 1 megawatt/minute. or maybe 60 megawatt/seconds.

(Did I get that right?)

What's outside his point, however, is that this battery technology, if it pans out, may solve one of the problems of wind and solar power: How to efficiently store excess energy to cover times when the wind doesn't blow and the sun isn't shining.
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ben_meyers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-28-08 10:46 PM
Response to Reply #4
5. I'm thinking of an article I read a while back
Edited on Thu Feb-28-08 10:50 PM by ben_meyers
The example used was a 1 megawatt battery could power a small shopping center for about 7 hours. It seemed terribly expensive though.

Edit: Now I found it.

Utility Will Use Batteries to Store Wind Power


At least at this stage, saving money by storing a windmill’s production for peak-price hours will be difficult. The cost is very high, $27 million for six megawatts of capacity, or about $4,500 a kilowatt, including the price of substation improvements. Building a gas turbine of that size to meet peak needs would cost substantially less. But the battery system would be able to store power made from wind, a form of generation that does not produce any carbon dioxide.

The batteries can each deliver one megawatt of power — enough to run a medium-size shopping center — for a little more than seven hours. Replenished nightly, they give back about 80 percent of the electricity put into them. Each is the size of a double-decker bus, and installation is not permanent; they can be moved to another site as the need arises.

The batteries will be built by NGK Insulators Ltd. of Japan. They use a sodium sulfur chemistry and operate at temperatures of more than 800 degrees Fahrenheit.


http://www.nytimes.com/2007/09/11/business/11battery.html?_r=1&oref=slogin

I think that there might be some difference in how the terms are defined.

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amandabeech Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-01-08 04:40 PM
Response to Reply #5
9. I would be a lot happier if at least some of these batteries were to be built here.
These things will undoubtedly be heavy and expensive to ship. Also, the U.S. dollar isn't doing well against the yen, and importing them from Japan may become more and more expensive.
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electropop Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-29-08 10:45 AM
Response to Reply #4
7. You got it almost right: it's "megawatt*hours" (multiply, not divide)
Electrical engineers (and others in science and engineering) do a "units analysis" to see whether a number makes sense in context. That's pretty much what you have posted.

One of my pet peeves is science writers and TV shows talking about "megawatts per hour" - this doesn't make sense, unless you are talking about a rate of increase in available power.
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Ordr Donating Member (699 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-29-08 09:36 AM
Response to Original message
6. Interesting.
That seems to be a pretty good way to increase the efficiency and viability of wind turbines.
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OKIsItJustMe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-29-08 04:23 PM
Response to Original message
8. U of M teams up with Xcel Energy in groundbreaking wind-to-battery project
http://www1.umn.edu/umnnews/news_details.php?release=080229_3790&page=UMNN

U of M teams up with Xcel Energy in groundbreaking wind-to-battery project

Contacts: Todd Reubold, Initative for Renewable Energy and the Environment, (612) 624-6140, reub0002@umn.edu

Luisa Badaracco, University News Service, (612) 624-1690, luisab@umn.edu

MINNEAPOLIS / ST. PAUL ( 2/29/2008 ) -- Xcel Energy, in partnership with the University of Minnesota, the National Renewable Energy Laboratory and the Great Plains Institute, will soon begin testing a cutting-edge technology to store wind energy in batteries.

The research partners will test a one-megawatt battery storage technology to demonstrate its ability to store wind energy and move it to the electricity grid when needed. Fully charged, the battery could power 500 homes for six and one-half hours. Xcel Energy will purchase a sodium-sulfur battery from NGK Insulators, Ltd. that will be an integral part of the project.

"Energy storage is key to expanding the use of renewable energy," said Dick Kelly, Xcel Energy chairman, president and CEO. "This technology has the potential to reduce the impact caused by the variability and limited predictability of wind energy generation."

The 50-kilowatt battery modules, 20 in total, will be roughly the size of two semi trailers and weigh approximately 60 tons. They will be able to store about 6.5 megawatt-hours of electricity, with a charge/discharge capacity of one megawatt. When the wind blows, the batteries are charged. When the wind calms down, the batteries supplement the power flow.

...
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NNadir Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-01-08 06:06 PM
Response to Original message
10. You mean the big hydrogen plant on Utsira didn't solve this problem?
I don't hear much about Utsira these days, or the 59 brazillion exajoule scale hydrogen wind plants in Norway.

I used to hear about it nearly every damn day.
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skids Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-02-08 09:53 AM
Response to Original message
11. Also, looks like beacon power on track for 08 install...
...though initially it looks like they will be concentrating on smoothing smaller bumps caused by conventional sources going on/off line...



Beacon recently completed the first phase of its manufacturing facility build-out in its new facility in Tyngsboro, Massachusetts, which will allow production of up to 600 flywheels per year. The Company has plans for a phase two build-out, with an annual production capacity exceeding 1,000 units.

...

The Company is aggressively pursuing the required interconnection processes in New York. There have been hearings in the local community regarding the necessary building and environmental permits, and the process is moving forward as expected. The revised schedule is that five to ten megawatts of capacity will be in place in New York by the end of 2008, and the plant would reach its full 20-megawatt capacity in the first half of 2009.



http://phx.corporate-ir.net/phoenix.zhtml?c=123367&p=irol-newsArticle&ID=1111934&highlight=

...these systems have a very large aperture (they can deliver a lot of their power in a very short time) so they aren't deep pools like the flow batteries, but still interesting, especially since they have very high round trip efficiency.

Speaking of flow batteries checking in on VRB systems shows they are still selling mostly small systems -- 20Kwh with a 5MW aperture. Hopefully their business will pick up soon.

And I have to wonder if EESTOR actually manages to make product, whether they will remain focused on automotive uses or start eying grid regulation.
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