So far, hydrogen-powered cars are fuel for future thoughts

Taken your hydrogen-powered FreedomCAR out for a spin lately? Nope? Well, there is plenty of time to sign up for one, suggests a National Research Council report that pegs 2020 for the arrival of the mass-market fuel cell vehicle.

That's the best case scenario, of course, assuming technology, government, industry and the public all cooperate on bringing hydrogen cars to the nation's highways.

"The use of hydrogen fuel cell vehicles can achieve large and sustained reductions in U.S. oil consumption and CO2 emissions, but several decades will be needed to realize these potential long-term benefits," says the NRC report.

Fuel cells combine hydrogen with a chemical catalyst to make electricity and water exhaust. In contrast, the nation's 235 million cars and light trucks burn about 44% of the country's oil and release about 20% of its industrial carbon dioxide emissions. All told, transportation represents about 5% of the U.S. contribution to global warming, but spikes in the price of gas have sharpened interest in alternatives to gasoline, such as biofuels and hydrogen.

http://www.abcnews.go.com/Technology/AheadoftheCurve/story?id=5414748&page=1

http://www.hybridcars.com/hydrogen/honda-production-fuel-cell-car-2008.html

Published October 29, 2007
Honda to Launch Production Hydrogen Fuel Cell Car in 2008



Honda President Takeo Fukui with the Honda FCX. Fukui said, “When the demand is there, the hydrogen economy will happen.”

Honda surprised many at the 2007 Tokyo Motor Show with the announcement that they will be putting a hydrogen fuel cell car into production next year for general sale. The company will produce fewer than 1,000 units. And though it makes perfect sense that Honda, over anyone else, would be the one to hit the production line first with this technology, most didn’t see this move coming for another five to seven years.

On edit to add link: http://world.honda.com/FuelCell/

I first became aware of this over 25 years ago when I worked for an organization dedicated to alternative forms of energy. The joke amongst my co-workers was, you know how you can spot a hydrogen-powered car? By the mushroom cloud coming out of the tail pipe.

I know--not too funny! The point is, hydrogen as an alternative to fossil fuels was under consideration way back in the early 80s, and it's good to see it back on the drawing board, so to speak. The time is right--let's go for it!

Tired Old Cynic

HHO or hydrogen treating of your fuel... there were a few naysayers in there who were less than polite. I think you will find this article uplifting.


Sunday, July 13, 2008
FORD Motor Company is Investigating Hydrogen on Demand



If HHO Gas is so great, why aren't the large automotive companies researching it? They are! According to Jennnifer Moore from Ford Motor Company Communications, Ford Motor company is researching hho gas or hydrogen on demand systems for installation in Ford Vehicles. They have nothing to report in terms of specifics at this point but stay tuned!

This is another step in the right direction for this technology, which as it's viability becomes more apparent, could have a tremendous impact on our energy needs moving forward.

http://aquygen.blogspot.com/

Ford has been investigating sodium borohydride cells since 2001. "Hydrogen on Demand" is a trademark of Millenium Cells, which makes such cells. This has nothing to do with "HHO".

plans to it or anything so you can see for yourself if it really works. I seem to remember back through the years, especially soon after the oil embargo of the early '70s that this has been hawked under varios names. I got a reply from you the other day that I still haven't figured out what it was you were saying to me but whatever. I can forward the plans for one if you want them, pm me an email addy and I'll sent it to you, its a pdf file that someone probably paid good money for somewhere down the line.

units... but the gorilla might be what I am looking for.



http://gethydropower.com/press.html

Gorilla Development LLC Raises the Bar in the Hydrogen Fuel Technologies Race.
01.29.2006

Gorilla Development LLC, producers of Hydrogen Based Fuel Supplement Electrolyzers sent shockwaves through the renewable fuel research community at the end of 2006 with low-load/high-production units set to hit the market in 2007.

The Gorilla family of electrolyzers boasts 2 - 16 L per minute electrolytic conversion based on model size and a hybrid gaseous product. Using a specially formulized electrolytic solution, and an advanced cell, bank, array stacking method; gorilla electrolyzers produce a higher concentration of hydrogen (83.33%) in larger quantities than ever reported.

The units are designed to retrofit any production combustion engines tapping into their electrical charging circuit, and compressor pump feeding into the vacuum lines. Units vary in size depending on the engine displacement to deliver a 0.07% produced gas : 0.05% fuel : 99.88% atmosphere ratio. Units are designed to produce gas on-demand with no storage, and no operation when the engine is turned off. The fluid lasts for 100 hrs of operation.

Gorilla Development has performed a series of emissions tests with the following results:
Idle Tests
7.2 L Caterpillar 6 cyl Heavy Duty Diesel
CO 100% reduction
CO2 0.88% reduction
NOx 33.93% reduction
Hydrocarbons 100% reduction

7.3 L Ford 8 cyl Heavy Duty Diesel
CO 40% reduction
CO2 7.33% reduction
NOx 5.56% reduction
Hydrocarbons 100% reduction

4.0 L Ford Explorer (Unleaded Gasoline)
CO 100% reduction
CO2 2.38% reduction
NOx 100% reduction
Hydrocarbons 100% reduction

Operations Tests
Fuel Consumption 30% Average Reduction


Trojes Trash Pickup Service in St Paul, MN tested the Silverback unit on one vehicle for three months. At the end of the trial period, the owners decided to outfit their entire fleet with Silverbacks, and to purchase distribution rights.

Gorilla Development LLC is currently in the process of testing for EPA Certification under the Voluntary Diesel Retrofit Program.

and you promise that you'll install in or have it installed and then report back to us the facts as they are on your vehicle.

I toyed with the thought of an on-demand hydrogen generator years ago but for some reason I never took it to the next stage so there is a little bit of me that is curious. Look at the numbers there and explain or at least check it out, why is some of the engines having a 100% reduction in anything while in others its only say 40%. When it comes right down to it there is not a hill of beans of difference between a Caterpillar diesel engine and a ford diesel engine, in fact I believe that ford uses a caterpillar engine in their trucks actually, I may be wrong there but I believe thats right, other than what the shapes of the parts are and the operation of both is exactly the same. Whats the deal with hydrocarbons 100% reduction??? all machines whether it be a space shuttle or an automatic transmission in one of our cars or the compressor in your air conditioner is made of three basic things, the wheel, the lever and the wedge, thats all there is, three basic machines. If this is on the up and up then all the engines would be getting similar results. I know you don't want to hear it but I say save your money

its saying that the 4.0 L ford explorer engine which is what is in our explorer has a 100% reduction in CO, NOx and hydrocarbons. this is pure d oh bullshit and nothing more and I can say that with some certainty due to the numbers posted there

On the example there with Trojes trash, If true I suspect the reasoning for them to purchase distribution rights, if true mind you, is to try to recoup the money they wasted on the one they purchased, as someone said long ago theres a fool born every minute.

Have you actually checked one of these apparatus's out and compared any of this or are you just working from what you read in some magazines and on the internet, my suspicions is that is the case.

I'm hesitant to click on the link because these folks are selling snake oil and I wouldn't put it past them to have a less than secure site, by design or by default

Nothing personal mind you but this has been debunked so many times spread out over so many years that its laughable at best, a fraud at worst.

I would like to see you post some real numbers from one of these gizmos on your own auto actually doing what its says. It won't happen is my guess.

As of yet, I in all these years since jimmy carters presidency when I first remember reading about these have yet to actually talk to someone who has one installed and its doing what it says. Its always a cousins brothers best friends girlfriends dads little brothers sons friend who has one. never the neighbor next door. Theres lots to be sold but not much to be purchased. Keep your money is again my advice if not then educate with facts, your facts us who are sceptically.

highly intelligent and it was a pleasure to speak with him. He said (Let me get this as correct as I can remember it) that they put a triple pack on a Ford 7.3 liter diesel and managed to get carbon monoxide from 14% to less than 1%. If I recall correctly he stated that mileage went from 18 to 32 on one diesel truck they outfitted.

Another point, he said that he put a teaspoon of gas in a fourwheeler and poured the hydrogen to it. 20 minutes later he got tired of seeing it run and shut it down. Thing is according to this fellow, you NEED fossil fuels to get ignition and get started but after that it is possible to run on as little as 20 or even 10 percent fossil fuel and the rest hydrogen.

I wasn't going to stop but I spoke to a relative and he asked me to check the guy out and he seemed very much on the up and up. Again, I have been branded a sucker but the emission ratings shouldn't lie, and if you are getting emissions down your power must go up due to more complete and efficient combustion.


http://www.hhoforums.com/archive/index.php/t-148.html
h-power
07-05-2008, 07:31 PM
I'm a certified ASE tech and have run emissions tests on my vehicle with and without HHO. The HHO does lower HC and CO2 emissions considerably.


http://hydrogenperformance.blogspot.com/2008/04/hho-according-to-wikipedia.html
As a fuel supplement

* Oxyhydrogen gas is effective at improving emissions and efficiency in internal combustion engines when used as a fuel supplement. See Hydrogen fuel enhancement; hydrogen affects the burn rate of fuels and lean combustion capabilities of internal combustion engines.<12><13><14> Fuel Enhancement systems are designed "to feed the hydrogen and oxygen gases directly to an internal combustion engine without intermediate storage".<15>

* For diesel applications, it is claimed that "When the hydrogen enriched air is compressed, the diesel fuel is introduced with a resulting improvement in fuel efficiency and maximized combustion of the fuel".<16> Fuel enhancement has the potential to substantially reduce pollution emissions of internal combustion engines; research in 2004 concluded that "HC-emissions as well as NOx-emissions could be reduced to near zero".<17> A 50% reduction in gasoline consumption, at idle, was reported by numerically analyzing "the effect of hydrogen enriched gasoline on the performance, emissions and fuel consumption of a small spark-ignition engine".<18> Hydrogen "addition can guarantee a regular running", of the engine "with many advantages in terms of emissions levels and fuel consumption reduction".<17> Hydrogen fuel enhancement can be optimized by implementing established lean burn concepts, and at minimum to achieve an actual increase in gas mileage the air/fuel ratio needs appropriate modification.<13><12><17><19> Although such claims do not consider the emissions formed in generating the oxyhydrogen. "Overall, increases in engine efficiency are more dominant than the energy loss incurred in generating hydrogen, resulting in improved fuel economy for the system as a whole".<13> This is supported by computational analysis that "has marked the possibility of operating with high air overabundance (lean or ultra-lean mixtures) without a performance decrease, but with great advantages on pollution emissions and fuel consumption".<18>

fairly dangerous man, err, I mean intelligent person,:-) always seemed to be on the up and up so I say to this news, good. Let us know how it goes. I wish you lived close so I could help with the install when you do get one. good luck with it.

Peace