Think about this before you eat your next steak

Who says animals don't have emotions?

<http://www.ananova.com/news/story/sm_905463.html?menu=news.quirkies.animaltales>

Bull finds way to dead owner's grave

A bull that pined for its owner has been led away from his grave after a vigil lasting a number of days.

Barnaby the bull left his field in the German town of Roedental and found his way to the cemetery where owner Alfred Gruenemeyer was buried.

The eccentric farmer is said to have treated his animals likes pets, allowing several to have the run of his home.

The bull found his way one mile to cemetery and then jumped a wall before locating his owner's grave. He stayed there for two days despite numerous efforts to coax him away.

Vets said it was common for dogs to pine for their lost owners, but they had never heard of a bull doing so.

"It shows an acute level of intelligence. It seems incredible that a bull could find the exact spot where his master was buried, but he did it," said Klaus Mueller.

:evilgrin:

But I appreciate you being honest with your prejudice.

It was based on something you said.

I have no compassion?

That is prejudiced and wrong.

We have to eat, I know. This is starting to bother me alot. You know they did experiments and concluded that fish feel pain. I really think I have to go vegetarian. I don't see how I can work this out any other way.

Have you ever thought about how we'd feel if we weren't at the top of the food chain?

It's easy :)

About the time that study came out I was reading a book
about the life of Dr. Albert Schweitzer. As a child he had
gone fishing with friends. As he pulled his first trout from the
river he realized the fish was suffering.
Throwing it back in (still quite alive) he vowed never to fish again.
This was to be an early milestone in his journey as
a humanitarian.

I mean if it wasn't for us trying to dodge it with cremation and embalming, we would all end up as food for insects and bacteria too.

In fact, isn't that what the food chain is all about? Who are we to mess with nature?

Have a interrelation ship we never bother to observe,
Yes on the first observation the predators look like 'bad guys' get the weak and sick ones of the herd..Darwin was an idiot but that's another post)
But if you observe closely before a kill is made there are subtle signals going on between the animals.
When we speak to our animals they understand us without language.So what on Earth makes you think other animals cannot relay information to each other between species too?
The Native Americans asked the spirits to give them permission to hunt prey to eat and they thanked the spirit of the slain animal,and didn't waste his bodyparts..They tried to communicate and relate to the animals as an equals.They framed the relationship in a more balanced way that is not so self centered(anthropocentric) .I grew up around animals.I have seen positive human animal relationships.
Even ones with death involved. My mom remembers her entire neighborhood coming out mourning for a cow named Goldie who was eaten.They walked with her for a quarter mile as she went to die saying her name..She didn't need to be forced.She was old.And what I find interesting here is alot folks in my mom's town related to Goldie as a friend ,They took treats to her,worried about her,took care of her ,talked to her.She was a notorious cow!

When she died it was quick and merciful ,done around people she loved. It was almost like if She was a human who went to Dr.Kevorkian because she had terminal cancer>It was like she died looking at all the people who loved her all her relations, saying goodbye remembering good times with her saying her name in love as she went away..and she knew her body was used to do something positive for them.
It can be an act of love.

You can tell when an animal is consenting to die,just like when you can tell a person is wanting to go.But we fear death and we are taught to pursue eternal life in this world as if eternal life can be possible here without becoming death.
Maybe it can't.Maybe death is vital to this place even existing..
Call me nuts all you want but there is a form of consent animals like cows,chickens,pigs will give you, if you ask..there is an understanding possible where there is a relationship..



Cells in our body have a "programmed cell death" apoptosis.They also have a rest state where they do not divide.This rest state and apoptosis keeps excess cell reproduction and growth under control,so we do not get cells with corrupted DNA and get cancer.Cancer kills it's host with life neverending..And this is what we are behaving like to this Earth.WE are killing our hostess.
An animal that is not ready or wiling to die has to be tricked,he fights,bites and resists you. Sometimes other animals will fight with him to stop you.He will not walk with you.
And you might not ever witness this deeper relationship going on if you do not step out of yourself long enough to relate to the animals as equals,as brothers.

Factory farming is not about relationship it has no concern for consent or quality of life of the animals or people working there,it's murderous,it's sick,immoral and it is systematized abuse.Factory farming will harm all of us because it is so out of balance,and uncontrolled in it's production.The farms stretch the bodies and minds of the animals to the breaking limits..It leaches more sustenance from the Earth than it gives back,it pollutes like crazy.There is only abuse and murder in that way of raising animals for profit.You can taste the adrenalin and insanity sickness and corruption in the meat.You can tell by taste and by the emotions wafting off the meat the animal's life was horrific and they did not consent. I avoid factory farmed meat.


A deer that is consenting,hunted and killed fast so it does not suffer much does not have all those stress hormones in it's body.
It tastes different does not have sickness and the meat does not carry that spiritual nausea with it that abuse and murder imprints into flesh.


But stress levels for animals are changing as humans refuse to curb their reproduction,will not share homes instead they buy big houses for 2 or 3 people that could house 6 or 7 fine. Because of this manufactured need,greedy developers take over the lands and forests an plow down every tree so that no animal could find food or shelter there.We are robbing them all of a place to exist.
I feel a bit differently about vegetarianism and eating animals.,I think some people can do it and be OK some can't.It depends on your body. I eat meat, because I have to,My sister is vegetarian for ethical reasons and her body is paying for it.Nerve damage,bad moods constant tiredness.She's been vegetarian for over 20 years.I believe animals are more like us and us like them than anyone is willing to consider.

Our world,this reality is horribly flawed.Life must live upon the living.I myself believe anyone who would create a world where we must destroy what is beautiful and alive to exist is wrong.The "balance" in nature" is not good.It's only necessary.And This world is Very,Very,out of balance.We have forgotten the Animals are our kin in a relationship with us in a world that requires death to exist in here.What could be more tragic?And so,because the world is flawed it reflects that flaw in it's designer,even in the molecules on the cellular level in relationships between animals and people,and between nations of people.

Some flaws are Death and birth itself.. life feeding on the living,destruction being required to curb uncontrolled growth,Uncontrolled growth bringing destruction,and death required to support life.. and ironically stop overgrowth of life. Death is as necessary to balancing this world as life is.
The Animals know this,and they respect each other when their populations are kept in balance..If the animals are forced out of balance ,if you observe them,they act just like sick humans do,raping,killing,terrorizing and bullying each other.They are downright abusive,sociopaths,cancerous to relate to.

So couldn't the animals know how to do "life control" by themselves and offer them self up to predators for the sake of their loved ones to have balance in their community? Humans sure can't relate to each other anymore..they can't control themselves anymore Alot of humans are bullies,they are rude and greedy.We pop babies nobody wants,and because we fear death so much we do not focus on quality of life,just that it breathes,we let the state place kids in abusive homes. We force others to live.Old folks life on and on,when our families can barely admit to themselves grandma may want death after her memories and health are gone and may even SAY she wants death,but we force her to live.because we are THAT selfish and scared of death..When we die we do not offer our bodies to feed predators,or even bugs and worms without poisoning it first.WE don't offer animals or even other people the excess food we have,from our kitchens we throw it away in plastic bags in cans inaccessible to rabbits or whatever other animals may be scrounging outside and fighting each other to eat. Our greedy selfish lust for OUR own kind of life is killing this world like a cancer.We will not control our population willingly,and so to get space we control the Animals.

Wars and murders are symptoms of being out of balance but how else in our crazy way of thinking is balance possible in a species that wants to live forever using up everything for itself in a finite world it must share and be in a balanced relationship with?
But we play pretend and ignore the effects when we throw things out of balance ,and our relations and the animal's relations to each other suffer and we deny this fact and do not offer what we have and take care of all our relations..

Try asking permission to an animal before you kill it for food. ASK,respect and think beyond your own wants..Thank it.
This isn't easy to accept in this consumer culture where people are brought up to take for themselves like they are entitled,without considering the impact and the effects on the relationship..

But if you observe closely before a kill is made there are subtle signals going on between the animals.
When we speak to our animals they understand us without language.So what on Earth makes you think other animals cannot relay information to each other between species too?

Oh, bollocks.

I have watched plenty of wild life programs, and I have watched my pet cats kill mice and birds, and I have NEVER seen some sort of communication going on between predator and prey.

In fact the opposite is true - if the prey realises it is about to become food, then there is nothing but an instant fight or flight reaction. The predator goes out of its way to NOT be seen, heard or smelled by its prey, and the prey does everything in its power to detect and avoid predators.

Nothing on this planet LIKES to die, and nothing willingly gives its life. Even the sick and infirm TRY to escape. That is ALSO natural. Without the overpowering desire to live, life wouldn't last long.

Ballance comes not from animals sacrificing themselves for the good of their species, but from the simple fact that there are far more prey than predators, and being a predator is a far harder life than being prey. Do you think its harder to catch and kill a cow, or to stand around in a field eating grass?

But nature sometimes gets out of balance (without any human help) and then you get swarms of locusts, or plagues of mice. In fact species have been going extinct for far longer than humans have been around. What do you think causes that? It sure wasn't us.

Sure we are responsible for the extinction of many species, but SO were those species. Think about it. If nature has special slots that animals fit into and must live in balance with other species to survive, what came before cows, and what happened to them? It's pretty obvious - the cow came along and was better at filling that niche and drove the previous occupant of it to extinction.

It's called evolution.

Now trying to turn this all into some spiritual quest for balance is nothing but trying to deny the very nature of nature itself. The world is a harsh unforgiving environment. Species adapt or die, and we are no different. We may be driving some species to extinction, but we are also ensuring the survival of others.

If evolution is about selecting stronger and stronger species that are better able to survive than the species that came before, what do you think the natural outcome will be? Well obviously (to me at least), it is that species will be come more and more adaptable and capable of adapting to many niches, resulting in fewer and fewer species and the less adaptable species are forced out.

It's only natural.

Does any of this mean I think we should drive any species to extinction? No. It simply means that when we do, we are simply fulfilling our role in nature.

Here is something for you to think about: If we DIDN'T kill and eat cows, how could cows possibly avoid extinction given the world they live in?

They would have practically ZERO habitat. After all we wouldn't just turn all the cattle farms into wildlands, we would have to use them for growing vegetables or something to eat, and cows would then be pests destroying our food sources.

So if you think about it, the very fact we eat cows is the only thing ensuring their survival. Have you ever considered that cows are actually the LUCKY species? That cows were only able to survive humans (as a species) because they adapted to the predator/prey model and became indispensible to us?

In fact a valid slogan could be: Save the cows! Eat One!

Why is eating animal (or even human) flesh bad or wrong exactly? Health reasons? Environmental reasons? Animal rights issues?

Imagine we had Star Trek matter replication technology and after cooking up the perfect steak you imaged its' molecular and atomic makeup right down to the sub-atomic level. From that point on, any time you wanted, you could have your replicator make a perfect copy of that steak.

Would it still be wrong to eat the steak?

What if the replicator used an algorithm to "construct" a steak without having ever imaged one?

What if it was a replicated human steak? Soylent Green?

Please, I don't mean to offend here. I just get off on thinking and talking about these kinds of things.

Nothing wrong with eating animal flesh per se, but the inhumane treatment of animals in factory farms (tiny cages, never see the sun, many strapped in) is immoral; so, the answer to the first is "animal rights issues".

The Star Trek thingy is a pretty neat trick. No, I don't think that would be unethical.

I'm not sure what you mean by constructing a steak without imaging one, but it sounds okay. No inhumane treatment necessarily involved.

Even a replicated human steak, if it were found to be nutritious and didn't involve inhumane treatment of humans, is fine. But if the only way to make a prototype is to use a real human steak, we have a problem.

"Canadians who are shocked at the thought that they may have eaten human flesh should think about the fact that there appears not to be a difference in taste between pig flesh and human flesh," said Friedrich.

"A corpse is a corpse, whether it formerly belonged to a pig, a cow, a chicken, or a human."

http://www.canada.com/national/story.html?id=D3C339B8-D360-4132-B582-828F7AFC3DBC

have intelligence (yes, even PsyDuck).

You never see just plain "animals" wandering around. Every non-human is some form of Pokemon.

Intelligence, self-awareness. Hmm.

Now the weird question.

Where do the hot dogs and meat come from? Even the "cattle" Pokemon have intelligence.

it makes me truly sad when i think about what a huge fucking minority vegetarians are.

It seems as if so few care about animals. As the saying goes, "Animals are my friends and I don't eat my friends."

Doesn't this sound fishy to anyone else?

It seems incredible that a bull could find the exact spot where his master was buried

Yes, yes it does. Was this be by smell or was he reading the headstones?

why should we doubt that a bullock
headstones can read
by the roses, by the scents
in the morning
by the dew
covered geraniums
somehow more attractive
than blood-drenched
craniums?

one to minimize meat eating.

The environmental cost of growing grain to feed beef is enormous.

Meat eating is an enormously environmentally expensive practice. My own reasons for not eating meat involve animal cruelty, but aesthetics and environmental awareness are right up there.

i smell bullshit. lots of it.