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gottaB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-17-04 08:37 AM
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How Did Darfur Happen?
By SCOTT ANDERSON, The New York Times

Oct 17, 2004 -- He sat warily on the very edge of his chair, his mouth set in a steady, nervous grin. He would not use his real name -- Bashom, he called himself -- out of fear that he would be arrested for crimes he had committed as a janjaweed in his native state of West Darfur. Not that he used the word janjaweed, either. "Ever since I was a young boy," he said, "I wanted to be a knight. We all did, my friends and I. So when I came of age -- about 14 or 15 -- I became a knight."

In Bashom's telling, this initially consisted of guarding his tribal village against intruders: thieves, cattle rustlers, the "knights" of rival tribes.

It was only when he was a bit older that he went out on raids himself.

"We would travel at night on our horses, so as to be outside the villages of our enemies very early in the morning," he said. "Normally, we would spread out along one edge of the village -- because we didn't want a battle; we wanted them to run -- and then our leader would give the signal and we would attack."

How Did Darfur Happen?

Alternative link: http://www.sudantribune.com/article.php3?id_article=6003
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reorg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-17-04 08:57 AM
Response to Original message
1. they recruit the young ones
Rebelling at Gunpoint in Darfur

Many Darfuris were forced to join the rebels

By Hamdy Al Husseini, IOL Correspondent

DARFUR, October 13 (IslamOnline.net) - Many Sudanese say they were abducted by rebel groups in the troubled region of Darfur and forced, at gunpoint, to fight government troops.

"I used to help my family cultivate our land. One morning in September a jeep stopped by and two armed men jumped on me,"19 -year-old Othman, told IslamOnloine.net.

"They pushed me into their jeep at gunpoint and three hours later stopped in an area near the city of Kabkabiya," said Othman, who hails from Al-Fasher, the capital of North Darfur province.

(...)

Othman said that after two weeks of training he was taken to another area near Jebel Marra "where I met two fellows from Al-Fasher who said they were also abducted by the rebels."

He further added they were all trained on attacking the Sudanese army and police posts.

...

http://www.islam-online.net/English/News/2004-10/13/article08.shtml


and support is provided by experienced people:

US Contractors to Support African Forces in Sudan

Voice Of America
Nick Simeone - Pentagon
15 Oct 2004

The United States is using private contractors rather than sending American troops to provide logistical support for African forces headed to Sudan's troubled western region of Darfur.
The U.S. government has awarded contracts worth more than $20 million to two companies, the PAE Group and Dyncorp. They will support the anticipated arrival of some 3,500 troops from the African Union in Sudan's Darfur region.

(...)

... When asked about the company's role in Sudan, a spokesman said Dyncorp is constrained by what it can say about its work in Sudan because of its contracts with the State Department.

http://www.sudan.net/news/posted/10059.html


I'm wondering if these people are supposed to do what MPRI did in Yugoslavia?



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gottaB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-17-04 09:40 AM
Response to Reply #1
2. Too bad Milosevic's locked up in the Hague
I'm sure he'd have a plan to deal with the situation.
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reorg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-17-04 12:58 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. well, Milosevic's "plan", whatever it may have been,
didn't seem to work out too well in Yugoslavia.

Obviously, you cannot just copy the methods of the world's brightest torch of freedom, like, say, in Vietnam, or in Afghanistan, or in Falluja or Abu Ghraib, when your turf is just a tiny republic in the Balkans or an impoverished state in sub-Saharan Africa.

But I'm sure you know someone who has a plan.


"When war becomes the most profitable course of action, we can certainly expect more of it."

Chalmers Johnson in Harper's Magazine, Nov. 2003

http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m1111/is_1842_307/ai_112358039/pg_4



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gottaB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-17-04 04:27 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. Obviously, Milosevic's models were much closer to home
But I'm sure you know that.
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reorg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-17-04 10:18 PM
Response to Reply #4
5. leaving aside for a moment your current obsession with Milosevic
I propose to rally around the presidential hopeful from the Democratic side and listen once again to his historic speech:

... at times, they had personally raped, cut off ears, cut off heads, taped wires from portable telephones to human genitals and turned up the power, cut off limbs, blown up bodies, randomly shot at civilians, razed villages in fashion reminiscent of Ghengis Khan, shot cattle and dogs for fun, poisoned food stocks, and generally ravaged the countryside of South Vietnam,in addition to the normal ravage of war and the normal and very particular ravaging which is done by the applied bombing power of this country.

...

It is part and parcel of everything that we are trying, as human beings, to communicate to people in this country--the question of racism, which is rampant in the military, and so many other questions, such as the use of weapons: the hypocrisy in our taking umbrage at the Geneva Conventions and using that as justification for a continuation of this war, when we are more guilty than any other body of violations of those Geneva Conventions; in the use of free-fire zones; harassment-interdiction fire, search-and-destroy missions; the bombings; the torture of prisoners; all accepted policy by many units in South Vietnam. That is what we are trying to say. It is part and parcel of everything. ...

http://www.pbs.org/greatspeeches/timeline/j_kerry_s.html

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gottaB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-18-04 06:45 AM
Response to Reply #5
6. okay, let's listen to Kerry
This is a press release from October 17th:

Statement by John Kerry on the Deteriorating Situation in Darfur, Sudan



“Months ago, I urged the president to call the crisis in Darfur, Sudan, by its rightful name: genocide. The Bush Administration finally did so in September, but shamefully it has done nothing effective to halt this genocide. Words without deeds are meaningless – especially when people are dying every day.

“Rarely have the costs of the Bush Administration’s inaction and failed leadership been clearer. Attacks on innocent civilians continue. The death toll in Darfur is quickly mounting. At least 70,000 civilians are already dead. Close to 1.5 million people have been displaced, and nearly 300,000 have been forced to flee to refugee camps in neighboring Chad. More than 200,000 people were forced from their homes last month alone. This week, the deteriorating security situation forced the United Nations’ World Food Program to scale back its critical relief operation. A senior USAID official recently warned that ‘the crisis has not yet peaked. We have not yet seen the worst,’ and acknowledged that another 250,000 innocent civilians may die before the end of the year.

“What has been President Bush’s response? Toothless U.S.-sponsored UN Security Council resolutions. These empty threats serve mainly to embolden the Khartoum government and underscore the Administration’s loss of international moral authority. The Bush Administration’s lofty praise for the African Union amounts to little without providing it the financial and other support it needs, right now, to deploy more troops to Darfur. The Bush administration has also contributed needed humanitarian assistance, but it is not enough to put a band-aid on genocide.

“As president, I will hold the Sudanese government accountable for this genocide. Either the Khartoum regime relents, or I will work with our European allies and others in the UN Security Council, to immediately impose tough sanctions on that government. These measures should include freezing the assets of the Sudanese Government, its leaders and business affiliates, prohibiting arms sales or transfers to Sudan, and banning the purchase of Sudanese oil. If the UN refuses to act, we will lead our partners outside the Security Council to sanction Khartoum, just as we did the apartheid government of South Africa. I will also work with Congress to strengthen existing U.S. sanctions on Sudan by prohibiting foreign companies doing business in Sudan from trading on U.S. public stock exchanges. At the same time, my Administration will swiftly provide robust logistical, financial and other support to the African Union to enable it to disarm militias, protect civilians and help humanitarian agencies reach those at risk."

“As President, I will restore U.S. moral authority and leadership in the international community. I will not substitute words for deeds in the face of genocide. I will do what is necessary to halt the genocide and punish its perpetrators.”

http://www.johnkerry.com/pressroom/releases/pr_2004_1017c.html


If you want to talk about Dyncorp, reorg, maybe we have something to talk about, because on the question of what should be done about Darfur I'm inclined to agree that Dyncorp is not the answer. If you want to talk about child soldiers, I'll talk about that too. But it's not clear to me that either a critique of private military contractors or a concern for the welfare of children are central to your agenda. What I see is that I posted a substantial piece of journalism about the path to crisis in Darfur, and you used the occasion to raise some tangential points about the SLA and about the Pentagon. Anderson's article makes several observations and explores arguments that I would of thought even you would be happy to see acknowledged. If you don't want to discuss it, if you would rather talk about something else, perhaps you should consider starting a thread about what really matters to you.
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reorg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-19-04 05:39 PM
Response to Original message
7. very astute observation
and I don't see it as cynicism, but as a statement of fact, on more than one level, and central to the issue at hand, not just tangential (from your article):

"bandits and police, they're very similar, and if they're good at the one profession, they'll probably be good at the other"


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