This is what can happen once citizens are denied freedom and the use of firearms

Pretty neat video I just found.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=reCpV1YHuYs&feature=related



this could be anyone...

Protesters...

Gay and Lesbians...

Gun owners who do not comply with new gun laws..hopefully they would be smart enough to go down fighting.

Thoughts??

There isn't enough :eyes: in the world to respond to this post.

just in case.

Of course you do realize that the Nazis enacted very strict gun laws. Those same gun laws obviously made it easier for the Nazis to impose their will. Of course it takes an honest look at history to admit that.

David

Of course you do realize that the Nazis enacted very strict gun laws.

?

Or do you want it demonstrated by me that YET AGAIN that you are retailing false nonsense?

I'm bored with the demonstrating. This time, you can

(a) substantiate
(b) retract
(c) look dishonest

Your choice.

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

Proceed to support your premise. I, too, would like to see some evidence.

http://www.nationalreview.com/kopel/kopel052203.asp

I think the Nazis feared gun owners...

Hear are a few parts of the article...

Significantly, the Weimar law required the registration of most lawfully owned firearms, as do the laws of some American states. In Germany, the Weimar registration program law provided the information which the Nazis needed to disarm the Jews and others considered untrustworthy.



On November 9, 1938, the Nazis launched the Kristallnacht, pogrom, and unarmed Jews all over Germany were attacked by government-sponsored mobs. In conjunction with Kristallnacht, the government used the administrative authority of the 1938 Weapons Law to require immediate Jewish surrender of all firearms and edged weapons, and to mandate a sentence of death or 20 years in a concentration camp for any violation.



Despite having an extremely powerful army, the Nazis still feared the civilian possession of firearms by hostile civilians.

Events in 1943 proved that the fear was not mere paranoia. As knowledge of the death camps leaked out, determined Jews rose up in arms in Tuchin, Warsaw, Bialystok, Vilna, and elsewhere. Jews also joined partisan armies in Eastern Europe in large numbers, and amazingly, even organized escapes and revolts in the killing centers of Treblinka and Auschwitz. There are many books which recount these heroic stories of resistance. Yuri Suhl's They Fought Back (1967) is a good summary showing that hundreds of thousands of Jews did fight. The book Escape from Sobibor and the eponymous movie (1987) tell the amazing story how Russian Jewish prisoners of war organized a revolt that permanently destroyed one of the main death camps.

It took the Nazis months to destroy the Jews who rose up in the Warsaw ghetto, who at first were armed with only a few firearms that had been purchased on the black market, stolen or obtained from the Polish underground.

"Significantly, the Weimar law required the registration of most lawfully owned firearms, as do the laws of some American states."

Now maybe you can look up the difference between WEIMAR and NAZI, and then explain it to Dave.


By the way, next time I want news and views from a filthy right-wing source, I'll be sure to say.

You swallow the National Review's shit if you like. Don't expect anybody at a LIBERAL/PROGRESSIVE/DEMOCRATIC website to be goose-stepping along behind.

On November 11, 1938, the Minister of the Interior, Wilhelm Frick, passed Regulations Against Jews' Possession of Weapons. This regulation effectively deprived all Jews of the right to possess firearms or other weapons.

from Halbrook, Stephen P. (2000) "Nazi Firearms Law and the Disarming of the German Jews." Arizona Journal of International and Comparative Law, Vol 17. No. 3. p.494.

It seems that the Nazis had very strict gun control laws in regards to the Jews and in regards to newly occupied territories.

David

that some Nazis were very fond of dogs ...


Now, there's always this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_Weapons_Law
(my emphases)

The 1938 German Weapons Act

The 1938 German Weapons Act, the precursor of the current weapons law, superseded the 1928 law. As under the 1928 law, citizens were required to have a permit to carry a firearm and a separate permit to acquire a firearm. Furthermore, the law restricted ownership of firearms to "...persons whose trustworthiness is not in question and who can show a need for a (gun) permit." Under the new law:

* Gun restriction laws applied only to handguns, not to long guns or ammunition. Writes Prof. Bernard Harcourt of the University of Chicago, "The 1938 revisions completely deregulated the acquisition and transfer of rifles and shotguns, as well as ammunition."<4>

* The groups of people who were exempt from the acquisition permit requirement expanded. Holders of annual hunting permits, government workers, and Nazi party members were no longer subject to gun ownership restrictions. Prior to the 1938 law, only officials of the central government, the states, and employees of the German Reichsbahn Railways were exempted.<5>

* The age at which persons could own guns was lowered from 20 to 18.<5>
* The firearms carry permit was valid for three years instead of one year.<5>
* Jews were forbidden from the manufacturing of firearms and ammunition.<6>

Under both the 1928 and 1938 acts, gun manufacturers and dealers were required to maintain records with information about who purchased guns and the guns' serial numbers. These records were to be delivered to a police authority for inspection at the end of each year.

On November 11, 1938, the Minister of the Interior, Wilhelm Frick, passed Regulations Against Jews' Possession of Weapons. This regulation effectively deprived all Jews of the right to possess firearms or other weapons.

Now, the statement of yours I addressed was this:

Of course you do realize that the Nazis enacted very strict gun laws. Those same gun laws obviously made it easier for the Nazis to impose their will.

The FACT is that the Nazis enacted LESS RESTRICTIVE firearms laws than those that were in effect when they came to power, in all regards except the possession of firearms by Jews.

Now, use that for your case if you can.

Without asserting that ALL Germans other than Jews supported the Nazis, I don't actually think you can.

I also brought up the newly occupied territories since those are the people that the Nazis imposed their will upon. Of course they made the laws less restrictive for those who were helping impose their will, I'm guessing that was part of the plan.

David

I just did a google search for it.

If the truth hurts get a tylenol.

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

and it was authored by DAVE KOPEL.

Do you really imagine that everyone reading this forum is a total moron??

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

On November 11, 1938, the Minister of the Interior, Wilhelm Frick, passed Regulations Against Jews' Possession of Weapons. This regulation effectively deprived all Jews of the right to possess firearms or other weapons.

from Halbrook, Stephen P. (2000) "Nazi Firearms Law and the Disarming of the German Jews." Arizona Journal of International and Comparative Law, Vol 17. No. 3. p.494.

It seems that the Nazis had very strict gun control laws in regards to the Jews and in regards to newly occupied territories.

David

and exhibiting some decency.

The source you took that passage from -- not that you bothered to cite it on either occasion -- is the same source from which I took the material quoted in my other post.

(You see, you provide your sources so that other people can investigate them. One reason other people might want to do that is to determine whether what was quoted was taken out of context, thus distorting its meaning or putting it to use to support a claim it does not support.)

The one that says things, in the paragraphs directly preceding the one you quoted, that the Nazis ENACTED LESS RESTRICTIVE FIREARMS LAWS than the ones that existed when they came to power.

Why would you enact stricter gun control over those doing your dirty work?

David

They enacted stricter gun control over those they wished to destroy.

Roman Catholics, and trade unionists, and communists, and homosexuals, and Roma ... they were all forbidden by law to possess firearms?

Yeah, I didn't think so.

The prohibition on Jews possessing firearms was quite obviously no more than one part of the parcel of oppressive measures visited on Jews.

http://www.wzaponline.com/WhowasaJewinNaziGermany.pdf

... At the Nuremberg Party Congress on September 15, 1935, Hitler, announced three new laws that were to be cornerstones of German racist policies and the suppression of Jews and other non-Aryans. These decrees became known as the Nuremberg Laws. They were decrees which in Nazi Germany had the force of law forbidding contacts between Aryan Germans and Jews, especially marriage and stripping Jews of German citizenship.
The first 1935 decree established the swastika as the official emblem of the German state.
The second established special conditions for German citizenship that excluded all Jews.
The third titled "The Law for the Protection of German Blood and German Honor" prohibited marriage between German citizens and Jews. Marriages violating this law were voided and extra-marital relations prohibited.
Jews were prohibited from hiring female Germans under 45 years of age. Jews were also prohibited from flying the national flag.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuremberg_Laws

While the Nuremberg Laws established for the first time very clearly who was defined as a Jew, legal discrimination against Jews had come into being earlier and steadily grew as time went on. Among other things, Jews were banned from working for the state or being employed as lawyers, doctors or journalists. Jews were prohibited from using hospitals and could not be educated past the age of 14. Public parks, libraries, beaches were closed to Jews. War memorials were to have Jewish names expunged. Even the lottery could not award winnings to Jews.<14>

Jews were required to adopt a middle name: "Sara" for women and "Israel" for men. Their identification cards were required to have a large "J" stamped on them.<15>

Some Nazi allies in Europe also emulated the Nuremberg laws, passing similar legislation.

But yes, not being allowed to possess firearms, that was what was just the most godawful thing that could have happened to German Jews.

You mentioned catholics they were largely targeted in Poland which would have been an occupied country in which the Nazis had enacted very strict gun control regulations. It should also be noted that many of the leaders of German leftist groups were Jews. I'll leave it to you to say the Jews in Germany were better off without firearms.

David

But yes, not being allowed to possess firearms, that was what was just the most godawful thing that could have happened to German Jews.


Firearms possession saved countless lives when it came to the Warsaw ghettos. Ever think for one moment that firearms possession could've saved the lives of the German Jews?

I'll entertain it.

Pretty good, but sativa, so might not produce the correct effect to enable me to imagine a meaning for post 57.

I wanted the indica, but the c-v did the farming and planted mainly sativa, and the bit of indica he did plant he didn't differentiate, and mashed it all together when he harvested ...

Ah, I do love the smell of freedom in a pipe.

on the part of the ad creators, that is. Bizarre and moronic execution, but good intentions.

This seems to be trying to connect with the Gedenk movement:

http://gedenkmovement.org

A humanitarian campaign to raise youth awareness about genocide through art and education.

Gedenk is a word that means, “remember” in Yiddish. Gedenk is a movement that was established in 2006 as a humanitarian campaign. The Gedenk Movement promotes youth education about anti-Semitism and the Jewish Holocaust.

Gedenk will use commercial outlets, i.e. music, dance, billboards and celebrities, to communicate its message and to make the lessons of the Jewish Holocaust and other mass atrocities relevant to today’s youth. Those that do not speak up are as guilty as the criminals themselves!

But of course in the hands of Hollywood, and designed for the self-absorbed airheads of the generation in question in the US, it became nonsense like that ad.

And then somebody decided it was worthy of being twisted and exploited in the gun militant agenda ... all racist and misogynist and right-wing as it is ... just like everything and everybody else, no exploiting of anyone's suffering anywhere anytime being too low for them.

Since when is MTV right wing??

Since when is MTV right wing??

Why don't you as WHOEVER THE FUCK SAID IT WAS?????

Not the language of educated people, I really tire of hearing it.

And if you aren't familiar with the oeuvre of Redd Foxx, you'll need to be educating yourself in that regard too.


Not the language of educated people

Really? Has someone revoked my degrees without me noticing?


I really tire of hearing it.

And I just don't give a fuck. Eh?

Fuckin eh!

I hope you have a fucking master degree to justify your fucking post so you can fucking feel good at night.

I hope you fucking hate guns..

I love the fact I own guns and it fucking pisses you off to no end that I fucking enjoy my fucking freedom and my fucking guns.

See how stupid one sounds using that word???

I agree with the above statements, but leave the fucking word out.

I would never speak to a lady like that, I was brought up better.

I am just trying to make a point.

Keep posting, I really look forward to your responses, as it keeps the post challenging/interesting.

And believe me I would never use the word fuck in front of a Lady.

I hope you have a fucking master degree to justify your fucking post so you can fucking feel good at night.
I hope you fucking hate guns..
I love the fact I own guns and it fucking pisses you off to no end that I fucking enjoy my fucking freedom and my fucking guns.
See how stupid one sounds using that word???

It's what they're saying.

I don't need anything to "justify" my post. I do happen to have a BA and a half, and an LLB, and to have taught at both levels as well.

I don't hate guns, so your hope will be unrequited. I don't have emotional responses to inanimate objects, generally. Although I do really hate the colour orange.

It doesn't piss me off to any end that you enjoy either your freedom or your guns. I really don't give a crap.

See how stupid one sounds saying stupid things?


I would never speak to a lady like that, I was brought up better.

Am I speaking to a lady? I don't care, I was just curious.

I was reared to treat all human beings equally, myself.


And believe me I would never use the word fuck in front of a Lady.

I neither believe nor disbelieve you. I simply don't care.

But, how about a Lord?

I must admit to kind of having done that. Standing in a govt library, shooting the shit with an ex colleague, not realizing there was a federal court judge whose work our work involved standing on the other side of the stacks being enormously amused by us. Back then, male superior court judges were referred to as "m'lord". So I guess I used the word fuck in front of a Lord.

Now, one of my direct ancestors' great-grandsons (i.e. a cousin of some degree and level of removal of mine) was a Law Lord and also the Lord Chancellor of Great Britain in the Labour govt of some decades ago. And it's possible that one of my gr-grfathers in another line was the son of a brother of a Viscount. So, well, you could govern yourself accordingly, I guess.

Me, I'll just do what I want.

Alrighty then.

DAvid

No sarcasm meant, it was a good reply and I respect what you said.

I appreciate the well spoken and honest response.

jgraz, it's been hashed out here many times before. Learn some history, start in 1919 with the Weimar Admin, they incorporated an ABSOLUTE TOTAL BAN.

They then relaxed it slightly a few years later only to tighten it all back up again in the late 30's (when you-know-who was rising to power) to virtually outlaw firearm ownership by anyone of Jewish descent.

And so it's just as jgraz said:

Yeah, that's exactly why the Nazis came to power: restrictive gun laws.

I mean, you just proved that, right?

:rofl: x 58

And so it's just as jgraz said:

Yeah, that's exactly why the Nazis came to power: restrictive gun laws.

I mean, you just proved that, right?



1938 is when the hammer fell, 4-5 years after Hitler came to power, 20 years or so after the Nazi party itself was formed.

The Nazis didn't come to power because of gun laws, they were already in power, they just sealed the deal in 1938 (concerning the Jews, which is the actual subject at hand).

The "actual subject at hand" is the subject of this thread:

This is what can happen once citizens are denied freedom and the use of firearms

See?

:rofl:



Hint: those people on the trains etc......well, they were disarmed by their government.

Tejas, I'm guessing you never gave two shits about The Holocaust, its victims or any other genocide in history until some gun industry hack showed you how to (mis)use it in RKBA arguments.

Same goes for the OP.

The anti-choice brigade is quite fond of exploiting the Holocaust for its own purposes. Not to mention the murders of African-Americans.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genocide_Awareness_Project

I'm not sure how that thing has managed to stay up at wiki, given its rather obvious bias, but you get the idea.

Better:

http://www.prochoiceactionnetwork-canada.org/articles/gap.shtml

Personally, Erin Kaiser was deeply offended and angered by the display. She emphasized that she does not object to debate on the issue of abortion, but that the GAP display constituted hate propaganda that she felt was targeted at her personally. As she explained on CKNW's Rafe Mair show (Nov. 23): "Not only am I a woman who had an abortion last month, but I'm also a Jewish woman. If my grandfather were alive today, as a Holocaust survivor, to see the Holocaust being exploited so that his granddaughter would be accused of being a murderer, on her own campus, there would have been more than overturning tables. They're calling me a murderer. I'm the same as the Nazis who killed the Jews? I'm the same as the KKK who killed the black people in the United States? I'm the same as them because I chose to have an abortion? I don't think it's a matter of freedom of expression. I consider this hate. I consider it hate literature."

Rational people of goodwill feel quite the same way about the gun militant brigade's attempt to exploit the Holocaust to shove its own agenda, and the blatant equivalency being asserted, between Nazis and firearms control advocates.


typo fixed

"Rational people of goodwill feel quite the same way about the gun militant brigade's attempt to exploit the Holocaust to shove its own agenda, and the blatant equivalency being asserted, between Nazis and firearms control advocates."


Confiscation, the topic concerns confiscation.

It's more an issue of sophistry, poor logic and bad-faith debate. If it was really a civil rights issue, you wouldn't have to rely on references to The Holocaust to make your case.

no different than antis copy/pasting the latest Bradyism. So take what is presented and either dispell it or get out of the way.

My State Constitution:

"The right of the individual citizen to bear arms in defense of himself, or the state, shall not be impaired, but nothing in this section shall be construed as authorizing individuals or corporations to organize, maintain or employ an armed body of men."

The 9th and 10th Amendments to the Federal Constitution:

9th: "The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people."

10th: "The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people."


This is a Civil Rights issue. I do agree, leveraging the Holocaust in this debate is poor taste, as well as a useless comparison.

Yes, and as the OP shows, the Holocaust is an excellent example of what has happened when Civil Rights are trampled.

As far as "taste", that's a matter of opinion.

cause and effect is muddled. It's not as clean cut as 'the nazi's disarmed the Jews, and then were able to kill them'. (I'm paraphrasing the argument from earlier in this thread)

The German government started that process prior to the rise of the Nazi's, for one thing. For another, while the possession of firearms helps, It's not enough. A resistance mindset does not start or end with Firearms. This is a pretty complex issue, and I don't believe I can do it justice, off the cuff like this. There are many historical accounts of what happened, prior to, and after the rise of the Nazi's, background on why some Jews fought back, and some did not. But this information fills entire books, and you will be better served by your public library, than a quick internet search, or arguement about it in this forum.

Oversimplifying to the point of a comparison between the conclusion that the Nazi's disarmed Jews, and the Warsaw Ghetto uprising, to somehow prove if they only had a few guns they could have fought back and survived, is simplistic to the point of, in some people's eyes, insult.


Then there's the sidelong implication that attempts to enable some forms of gun control (such as registration) is leading or will lead to the rise of a group like the nazi's here. Also insulting. Throwing out the nazi bomb is pretty much the ultimate diversionary tactic.

While I'm off reading history, perhaps you could help me out with something. Is 1933 before or after 1938? If your answer is before, then perhaps you can explain how the Nazis used a 1938 law to rise to power.

And what happened when Hitler became dictator? Oh yeah... HE was the one who relaxed those nasty gun laws. And why did he do it? Hmmm... could it perhaps be due to the fact that the main aim of the 1928 Law on Firearms and Ammunition was to crack down on private armies like ... wait for it ... the NAZIS??

Y'know I'm all in favor of reading history. But maybe you should read some history that doesn't come from the web site of the NRA. I'd suggest starting here: http://www.amazon.com/Rise-Third-Reich-William-Shirer/dp/0671728687

that subject being the 1938 decree forbidding firearm ownership by Jews.

A little cut and dry, but from one of the zillions of webpages dedicated to the subject:

"On November 11, 1938, the Minister of the Interior, Wilhelm Frick, passed Regulations Against Jews' Possession of Weapons."




And the rest is history.

Apparently, it is. :eyes:

and your point concerning the subject at hand?


Look, you can't keep up that's understandable. Lose the extra weight, maybe it's that anklebiter that's following you (and me) around.

:rofl:

the citizenry can't hurt, but a willingness to fight well before it gets to the point of being drug out of our houses is a much better solution. Something about draining the swamp before you are up to your ass in alligators...

The auteur of the masterpiece in question:

http://www.youtube.com/user/ezekiel316

ezekiel316
Style: Variety
Joined: April 15, 2007
Last Sign In: 2 days ago
Videos Watched: 4,538
Subscribers: 534
Channel Views: 18,406
The times we live in, are unlike any the world has ever seen.

Never has humanity had the chance to stare into the face of its own destruction. We do not have the luxury of denial, as so many other generations have. It does not require faith to believe it is real, but the exact opposite. It requires faith to believe that it will not happen.

I do not ask you to believe the end is near...

It stands at the gate and knocks.

Generations past have spoken of the end of the world, but we are face to face with it. The difference between past generations and ours, is the fact that we have the capability to end life as we know it ourselves.

The hand of God, fire from heaven, plagues poured out by angels, are not even necessary. We have devised multiple ways to exterminate all life on this planet. There are people sitting around concocting ever more tools, and plans, to bring about utter devastation.
Name: Trevor

Not content with spewing Dave Kopel all over the thread, you have to give us Ezekiel too. Have you really no shame?

"One of the furst thangs that A-dolph Hitler did when he came to power was to take away the civilians' right to bear arms".

As we have seen, that's just a big ol' barefaced lie ...

The stupidity of the "director" is rivalled only by the stupidity of this fans in the comments section. Give us a break. Members of this here site really are not illiterate teenagers.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YZ24YWOTVrs#

And here it is broken down for us less educated people...

Jewish people once disarmed were eventually taken to concentration camps and murdered.

So what we are trying to say is... don't allow yourselves to be disarmed or you may end up like the Jewish people during WW2.

Once guns are registered they will eventually be confiscated..(Canada..handguns, Britain/Australia all guns, and Jewish gun owners during WW2).

Once the population is unarmed, the Government can do as they please..i.e the Jewish Holocaust of WW2.

and very sad.


Jewish people once disarmed were eventually taken to concentration camps and murdered.

Is there some evidence that at some time German Jews owned large numbers of firearms?

No? I didn't think so.

So in what sense is your allegation that German Jews were "disarmed" not FALSE?


So what we are trying to say is... don't allow yourselves to be disarmed or you may end up like the Jewish people during WW2.

And what I am saying is ... you're spewing right-wing horseshit.

And you're still posting unspeakably ignorant right-wing crap consisting of the same horseshit.


How do you even FIND crap like that latest youtube crap? Posted 6 months ago by a nobody, 1000 views, and you're a fan.

So much worthwhile stuff to find on the internet, so much crap, such a limited lifetime we all have, and you spend yours on the crap. It's sad.

This is the title of your latest stinking bit of video (the one viewed by just over 1000 people in six months):

Jewish Task Force: Gun Control Works!

And this is the Jewish Task Force:

http://www.jtf.org/

You don't have to be a Jew to join Jews Against Obama.

(photo title: Obama is not American)

Why Jews Against Obama?

The Jewish Task Force (JTF.org) is an organization of right wing Jews and righteous gentiles who follow the teachings of the late Rabbi Meir Kahane. Thus we are opposed to Israel surrendering land for “peace.” We are also opposed to Islamic terrorism, which we believe is an integral part of Islam.

Unfortunately America has refused to win every single war she has fought after World War II. Our leaders have been more concerned about world opinion, sparing “innocent civilians” and “winning hearts and minds.” Israel has done the equivalent in her recent battle with Hezbollah in Lebanon.Obama in Muslim Dress

This refusal to win wars is all due to the pernicious influence of the Left, which has gained a major foothold in the Democrat party in the U.S., as well as the European Union and Israel. Therefore, JTF is also opposed to domestic fifth columnists who attempt to undermine America’s and Israel’s will to defend themselves and to properly fight their wars. Barack Hussein Obama is an example of a fifth columnist. We have started Jews Against Obama to expose him as being just that.

* Obama’s father, Barack Hussein Obama Sr., was a Muslim from Nyangoma-Kogel, Kenya and his step father was a Muslim from Indonesia. Obama and Sharpton
* Obama’s childhood mentor was a communist.
* Obama attended Muslim Basuki School and a Catholic school in Indonesia and his religion was registered as Muslim in both schools. Despite this overwhelming evidence, Obama insists he was never a Muslim.
* Obama has promised that in his first year of office, he will invite Iranian terrorist dictator Mahmoud Ahmadinejad to the White House in order improve relations and relax trade restrictions with Iran. This would certainly lead to the sale of advanced American technology, which would enable Iran to develop nuclear bombs much more quickly.
* Obama is a supporter of Kenyan Muslim Raila Odinga, who recently lost in that country’s election, and who wants to institute Islamic Sharia law as the law of that land. Raila claims to be Obama’s first cousin.
* Obama wants Muslim terrorists in Guantanamo to have access to the American legal system. Note that these Guantanamo attorneys are supporting Obama.
* Obama’s foreign policy advisors from the Carter Administration are notoriously anti-Israel and antisemitic.
* A non-profit organization with Obama on its board gave money to the terrorist-supporting Arab American Action Network, which favors Israel's destruction and is completely against America enforcing any of her immigration laws.
* Obama helped raise money for Muslim terrorist refugee camps in the Middle East.
* Obama has been endorsed by communist Daniel Ortega (former head of the Weather Underground organization), communist Tom Hayden, Jesse Jackson, and Muslim racist and antisemite Louis Farrakhan.
* Obama’s National Campaign Cochairman is congressman Jesse Jackson Jr., a notorious racist and antisemite.
* Obama’s Pastor, who Obama claims is his mentor, traveled with Muslim racist and antisemite Louis Farrakhan to Libya in 1984 to visit Col. Muammar el-Qaddafi.

These are only a few of many, many issues. Please join us in our fight against Barack Hussein Obama and help save America and Israel.

So where did you happen to hear about Democratic Underground, then?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BtLa9Q6xW-8

JTF demands: Ron Paul supporters should be put to death

;)

But no. I have consistently disagreed with the enemy of my enemy is my friend idiocy.

Hmm.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mQpV2sN-FRQ&feature=related

This may explain why I got a "no longer available" message in the middle of one of the videos you linked to. I figured it was my ISP which has been fucking up all weekend.


Odds and ends ...

http://jtf.org/forum_english/

Jews Against Obama Headquarters
This is the place to discuss The 2008 Presidential Elections, especially on how to defeat the black Muslim Nazi Presidential candidate Barack Hussein Osama!

I think we can call this a hat trick.

Not a single opinion source can you people produce to agree with that is not dredged from the right-wing cesspool. This is about the deepest I've seen in a while.

I should have checked, my mistake.

I just did a search for Nazi gun laws and watched the video.

The video had all the facts, that citizens once disarmed can be murdered by their government.

You can't sit here and tell me that the Nazis didn't disarm and murder the Jewish people??

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_Weapons_Law



You were right..the laws got better, unless you were a Jewish Citizen....

Gun ownership was great for the Nazis...

The 1938 German Weapons Act

The 1938 German Weapons Act, the precursor of the current weapons law, superseded the 1928 law. As under the 1928 law, citizens were required to have a permit to carry a firearm and a separate permit to acquire a firearm. Furthermore, the law restricted ownership of firearms to "...persons whose trustworthiness is not in question and who can show a need for a (gun) permit." Under the new law:

* Gun restriction laws applied only to handguns, not to long guns or ammunition. Writes Prof. Bernard Harcourt of the University of Chicago, "The 1938 revisions completely deregulated the acquisition and transfer of rifles and shotguns, as well as ammunition."<4>
* The groups of people who were exempt from the acquisition permit requirement expanded. Holders of annual hunting permits, government workers, and Nazi party members were no longer subject to gun ownership restrictions. Prior to the 1938 law, only officials of the central government, the states, and employees of the German Reichsbahn Railways were exempted.<5>
* The age at which persons could own guns was lowered from 20 to 18.<5>
* The firearms carry permit was valid for three years instead of one year.<5>
* Jews were forbidden from the manufacturing of firearms and ammunition.

Under both the 1928 and 1938 acts, gun manufacturers and dealers were required to maintain records with information about who purchased guns and the guns' serial numbers. These records were to be delivered to a police authority for inspection at the end of each year.

On November 11, 1938, the Minister of the Interior, Wilhelm Frick, passed Regulations Against Jews' Possession of Weapons. This regulation effectively deprived all Jews of the right to possess firearms or other weapons.

Once the Jewish people registered ther weapons, they had to turn them in.

Isn't registration great??

Nazis, on the other hand, are somewhat problematic.

You planning to elect any anytime soon?

Why do you ask...are you looking for a new job??

we elected one twice already.

Most of my life the thought of "burying guns in the back yard" was laughable for most of the reasons written about in this forum, but after watching those fascist clowns in the White House for the last eight years there has been enough idiocy to give me pause. I'm not ready to build an arsenal just yet, but it does make me wonder if the people of the United States wouldn't put another monster in power if they thought they couldn't keep their IPods.

I just read that shit.

Obama has been endorsed by communist Daniel Ortega (former head of the Weather Underground organization)

Okay, I'm not even going to explain that joke.


:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

I hate those idiotfacies, but sometimes, nothing else will do.

I spent a rainy afternoon in Athens, Ohio, drinking a couple of beers with an elderly gentleman who had a number tatooed on his arm. It never really hit me as true until then what he and his brethren suffered.

The gist of the talk was that nothing, absolutely nothing, could have prevented the Jews from going to the camps once the Nazis chose their plan of action. They held all the cards by then. Since most of the Jews were law-abiding citizens it wasn't really in their nature to go to the hills and fight. I won't get into a discussion as to why since I'm a non-Jew and it might come off as a harsh criticism and I certainly don't wish to be seen that way. Given the same set of circumstances, I wonder how many keyboard commandos would be willing to leave their family and go to the hills and fight? Don't blame the victims for what they did or didn't do. I suspect most of us would be herded into the cattle cars rather than leave our loved-ones sides.

Anyway, I never really saw the 2nd Amendment as some kind of bulwark against being sent to the gas chambers. What I do see it as is the recognition by the state that the citizens have ownership of their country are are to be trusted. When the government no longer trusts it's own citizens it's doomed to fail.

... it's doomed to fail.


Funny how those citizens don't seem to think the trust should be reciprocated.

But, just is case I have a spare.

I have life/Medical/Auto insurance just in case also.

Firearms and the 2nd amendment are just insurance against a tyrannical government.

Hopefully we will never have to use them.

Firearms and the 2nd amendment are just insurance against a tyrannical government.

And firearms control measures are just insurance against vicious and/or stupid and/or unbalanced "citizens" then, I guess.


Of course, that leaves us with the crap about "the government" trusting "its citizens", the government being nothing more nor less than the people elected by those citizens to make governance decisions and the apparatus put in place to execute those decisions. Not some giant green alien squatting in the capital city ... So how it even makes sense to talk about a government trusting a population, I just don't know.

But then, it's not the first or last time such silly noise has left me scratching my head.

I wouldn't lose any sleep over it.

local LEO's infiltrating your marches.


trust eh?

I wish I had some vague idea of what you're talking about.

Most of the time I don't give a shit.

I posted links to articles about how your LEO's were "there to help you". Alas, never did get to see that nifty sweater you bragged about.


selective memory eh?

A couple of decades ago, I was on the steering committee organizing a rather major international kind of event. My responsibility was security and the demonstration.

I liaised regularly with the RCMP. I conveyed our desire that the CPC-ML (Communist Party of Canada - Marxist-Leninist) not be part of our demonstration. We were a broadbased coalition of labour, political, religious and other credible and highly visible organizations and had no interest in having our activities hijacked by the loony and highly untrustworthy and very loud-mouthed "left". CPC-ML basically consisted of a half-dozen people who showed up at other people's events and shouted their own slogans non-stop for the duration.

At one meeting, we discussed these concerns with Sgt. Larry. As we were getting ready to go, Sgt. Larry leaned back in his chair and put his boot up on the table and mused perplexedly, "Who are those people, anyway?" Well of course I replied, looking equally perplexed, "We always thought they were you people!"

Was I wearing my famous sweater? I have no idea, because I have no idea what sweater that was. We did have Tshirts made up for the steering committee and the marshalls. I must still have that somewhere.

I don't expect my police services (this "LEO" business is just soooo 'murican) to trust CPC-ML, or the black bandana gang, any more than I do or any rational person does. I don't expect them to trust biker gangs or drunks with car keys or corrupt prime ministers, either. What use would they be if they did??

I'm sure you had a point. And I'm just about as sure that I'll never know what it was.


typo fixed

worst Presidents ever, "Trust, but verify."

We have the First Amendment, and it has been our first and best defense against government getting the best of the public. I'm sure that's why the Founding Fathers made it number one on the Bill of Rights.

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Particularly ugly propaganda.

Do read my posts about the source of it.

Due to them losing their gun ownership right???

Let me break it down to you Barney style...

Jewish people loose gun ownership rights

Jewish people have no weapons to fight the Germans...

Jewish people get rounded up and murdered.

If only they had been armed/still had their guns, they could have went down fighting/escaped instead of being led to the gas chambers naked and murdered.

Are you still saying the Jewish people didnt die..
Due to them losing their gun ownership right???


Allow me to laugh at you really loudly now.

No, no, it's too sad for laughter ... that anybody can be this ignorant ...

It showed a group of Jewish people that ran away to the woods and fought off the Germans.

They were smart enough to keep/secure firearms, thus allowing most of them to survive the war.

The ones that didn't fight/join them were simply herded into the cattle cars and killed.

This was a wonderful movie showing how by choosing to use guns and fight allowed them to survive.

They were proud freedom fighters and by their courage and use of firearms they lived!!!