ATF to propose new regulations on importation of shotguns.

http://www.atf.gov/publications/firearms/012611-study-on-importality-of-certain-shotguns.pdf

The whole aim is to only allow shotguns to be imported that have a "legitimate sporting use".

The problem is we only go one direction: To The Worse.

If a gun made in Italy were banned for importation under this law, and it were made in the US instead, it would be legal to own.

Utter bullshit.

I have hope that the Heller decision will destroy this obvious anti-2nd amendment law.

Why else would it be legal to buy an SKS made in eastern Europe, but illegal to buy one made in China? It's because they were flooding the market with cheap weapons, and US manufacturers didn't want to compete.

Russian, Yugo, etc SKS come in as Curio and Relics under the "at least 50 year old rule."

Importations of most Norinco firearms and ammunition into the United States were blocked during the Clinton Administration in 1993 under new trade rules when China's Most Favored Nation status was renewed. The prohibition did not apply to sporting shotguns or shotgun ammunition however.

The clones of the Remington 870 and the Ithaca 37 came in as the IAC/Hawk and a couple other trade names. I know the Norinco copy of the 1897 trench gun was banned although it is readily available in Canada. Beats me why the 1887 lever action was banned.

Here, make sense of this. Canucks can buy a Norinco M-14S or a clone of the StG-44 but both are banned in the US.

When you have clueless morons writing laws interpreted by unprincipled political appointees enforced by unimaginative bureaucratic drones, a blizzard of conflicting ATF decision letters is what you get.

which could be challenged. I doubt there would be if there were an overall prohibition against a class of product, but simply a prohibition on imported versions of a domestically produced product would seem to fall into the trade area.

...smell test, though.

So put em in sporting clothing, and offer a line of accessories.

If they're going to act anti-gun, my opinion is they should be made to look it.


The atf is operating on borrowed time anyway. The Brian Terry thing may just be their undoing.

But I think in the end that this will be another useless act by the ATFE.

If the shotgun is magazine fed, pretty much every feature that they describe,with the possible exception of a grenade launcher, can be added aftermarket.

BTW, not doubting someone, somewhere has ever put a bayonet lug on a shotgun, but honestly. What the heck?

And a JATO bottle .

Mossberg 590


In the close confines of a house, this would likely be useful.

It is the AK-47 design from the orginal Russian company, adapted as a shotgun. The picture below has a drum magazine, but box magazines of 20 and 30 rounds are available.



Makes a great home defense gun.

12rds is largest mag available for Saiga shotguns. ;)

own are 12's, a .410 Saiga is probably fun to shoot, will have to see what I've been missing.

I bet she is all crossways over this one huh ? The sporting provision and maximum width and height specs are aimed at SAIGA . 4" tall = limited capacity and 3" in width=no drum . The 10lbs could be measured with a loaded magazine to limit the capacity using the weight

It's still a worthless measure and will work 99.999% of the time against freedom in the USA .
I suppose that self defense is not a sporting purpose in their world and the word infringe isn't in their vocabulary.

It is clear that the 2nd amendment was intended for self defense and offensive use against enemies of our Constitution, yet I cannot think of any instance that the BATFE has ever mentioned or commented on what features of firearms should citizens use for self defense against criminals,foreign invaders, and against enemies of the Constitution. Perhaps the same guns that the military and police use ?

Who is the chairman of this ATF think-group, Helmke?


IDPA = International Defensive Pistol Association

reassess that position.

In particular, the working group examined participation in and popularity of practical shooting
events as governed by formal rules, such as those of the United States Practical Shooting
Association (USPSA) and International Practical Shooting Confederation (IPSC), to determine
whether it was appropriate to consider these events a “sporting purpose” under § 925(d)(3).
While the number of members reported for USPSA is similar to the membership for other
shotgun shooting organizations,6 the working group ultimately determined that it was not
appropriate to use this shotgun study to determine whether practical shooting is “sporting” under
§ 925(d)(3). A change in ATF’s position on practical shooting has potential implications for rifle
and handgun classifications as well. Therefore, the working group believes that a more thorough
and complete assessment is necessary before ATF can consider practical shooting as a generally
recognized sporting purpose.

Throughout the Fifties and Sixties WW2 surplus rifles were readily available. It was not uncommon to walk into a mass retailer of the era like Sears or Western Auto and find the ubiquitous paper barrel full of "Lee-Enfield Jungle Carbines, your choice $15.00" or "Spanish Mauser, 7 mm 9.95"

When the senior hypocrite from Connecticut, Senator Dodd was pushing through Congress what became the Gun Control Act of 1968, High Power rifle competition, for example, was still dominated by bolt action rifles. He had this to say:



In 1968, ALL military surplus arms were banned from importation. This did not change until 1986 when the ATF ruled that military surplus arms that were at least 50 years old could be imported as "curios and relics" provided they had a sporting use.



As you point out, a change in the ATF's position has implications for rifles, handguns as well as shotguns. In the past the ATF has banned the importation of rifles which would be suitable for IPSC competition. Try to buy an AUG, H&K 94 or a CAL lately?

By using the Federal rules for hunting migratory waterfowl the ATF could imply easily no "sporting shotgun" need be capable of firing more than three rounds without reloading. By similar token, the traditional clay pigeon games of skeet, trap or sporting clays are all structured around a double barrel shotgun. Never are more than two shots required without an opportunity to reload.

Dodd refused to accept traditional "bullseye" high power rifle competition as "sporting" 60 years ago and the ATF has never recognized any form of handgun or rifle competition as sporting.

In fact, certain highly specialized target pistols were classified as "assault weapons" under the '94 ban because their magazine was not contained in the pistol grip.



Neither the US Olympic team nor anyone else was able to purchase or import these pistols from 1994 to 2004. (Apparently it has worked as no 7-11 has ever been held up by a gang banger using a limited production $5,000 custom Olympic free pistol in .22 short.)

has nothing to do with "legitimate sporting use", I would like to see the NRA or other 2nd .orgs challenge the constitutionality of regulation based on this criteria.

I like the idea of application of importation rules on most manufactured goods from a standpoint of parity of labor, not based on some abstract perception of need.

Like "Lord Bensten" did when ATF was under treasury, he declared two 12 gauge shotguns to be "destructive devices" because of "other factors." He made a unilateral decision unencumbered by any legal stricture since the law, as written, gives him unfettered discretion as to what is "sporting."

This is similar to a back door grab proposed first by Carolyn McCarthy in her perennial attempts to push a new assault weapons ban. After a laundry list of the usual AK's and AR's comes the bottom line definition "...any firearm that has been used or adopted by the military or any law enforcement agency is PRESUMED TO BE AN ASSAULT WEAPON." The list of firearms never used by any military or police would be a lot shorter, maybe even approaching zero.

Is there any reason to trust the integrity of an organization that has given written guidance to individuals on the legality of an action, then prosecuted them for following the published guidance saying, "We changed our mind?"

there's nothing sporting abut using a shotgun for home defense, but there is no doubt that it is effective.

I personally prefer a 12 gauge coach gun.

There is shotgun which is NOT semi automatic and does not have a detachable box or rotary magazine. It is a shoulder fired pump shotgun of bull-pup design. The barrel length is 18.1 inches and the overall length is 26.1 inches. It skirts all the definitions that would qualify it as either an assault weapon (NOT semi-auto) or an NFA weapon...and it is NOT an import!

Kel-Tec KSG Those that are prone to paroxysms of panty-filling poutrage may commence. I have no need for one, but I want one just to see apoplectic reactions, flying spittle, and stuttering sputtering spewing of venomous vitriol from certain low impulse control posters.

of instigating the whole mess .

I'm sure there must be someone out there who juggles shotguns.