U.S. anti-gunrunning effort turns fatally wrong

PHOENIX — They came from all over the country, agents with the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives, brought here in a bold new effort to shut down the flow of U.S. guns to Mexican drug cartels. It was called Operation Fast and Furious, after a popular movie about street car racing.

But from the beginning, much of the fury was inside the agency itself.

On his first day undercover, John Dodson, who had been an ATF agent for seven years in Virginia, sat in a Chevy Impala with Olindo Casa, an 18-year veteran from Chicago. They watched a suspected gun trafficker buy 10 semi-automatic rifles from a Phoenix gun store and followed him to the house of another suspected trafficker. All of their training told them to seize the guns.

The agents called their superior and asked for the order to “take him.” The answer came back swiftly, instructing them to stay in the car. The message was clear: Let the guns go.

This was all part of an ambitious new strategy allowing Fast and Furious agents to follow the paths of guns from illegal buyers known as “straw purchasers” through middlemen and into the hierarchy of the powerful Sinaloa drug cartel.

But Dodson and Casa were confused and upset. ATF agents hate to let the guns “walk.” Yet it happened again, day after day, month after month, for more than a year.

full: http://www.washingtonpost.com/investigations/us-anti-gunrunning-effort-turns-fatally-wrong/2011/07/14/gIQAH5d6YI_singlePage.html

should be outraged when it is possible that multiple agencies of our government have allowed thousand of weapons to be sold to straw purchasers who will smuggle these weapons into Mexico and possibly sell some on American streets.

These weapons will leave a long trail of blood.

We pass gun laws and expect our government to enforce them. If it is true that agencies of our government decided to allow the laws to be bypassed in order to trace where the weapons go AND HAD NO WAY TO TRACK THESE WEAPONS then we should support an fair investigation to find our who allowed this to happen! Let's support finding the truth.

People have been killed because of these weapons and many more will die. There is even a POSSIBILITY that tax dollars paid for these weapons.

Strangely enough, in this forum only those people who are pro-gun pay much attention to this story. Perhaps some here feel that it is perfectly OK for our government to allow firearms to "walk" from mom and pop gun stores as long as it enhances the chances of passing another assault weapons ban.

I don't know the truth of this story but I do know that there appears to be the smell of a cover up here. It would be best for the administration to support the investigation and not allow this story to grow day by day and eventually become a major factor in the 2012 election.



Let me ask you where do you stand?

Would you like to see a fair and unbiased investigation into this "scandal" that would reveal the truth? If the result revealed that the Justice Department was deeply involved in allowing the illegal sale of weapons to straw purchasers knowing that they would find their way into Mexico and into the hands of criminals in our country, would you support changes in the management of the departments that authorized this program?

Of course, a fair investigation might find that the problem is false or limited to the ATF.

I would like to see a fair and unbiased investigation into this scandal that would reveal the truth but you aren't going to get it.

What I'd really like to see is the ATF disbanded and give the "A" & the "T" back to the Treasury Dept. and the "F" to the states unless it crosses state lines then we give it to the FBI

I want to know the facts and not have them tainted by politics.

The idea of disbanding the ATF and giving its responsibilities to other agencies has surprising advocates but does make sense. Much depends on the results of an investigation. Some rumors tie other federal agencies to the scandal.

....to allow a couple of these 'straw buyers' to make purchases.

The tweaking was evidently required due to some of the 'straw buyers' having disabiling convictions.

We may find out more tomorrow...

Since it began in 2006, Gunrunner has seized more than 10,000 firearms and led to the arrests of more than 800 suspects. New York Times, 6/16/2011

Convictions, simply are not worth lives lost...to most of us anyway...

http://tucsoncitizen.com/view-from-baja-arizona/2011/03/13/mexican-officials-claim-atf-walked-guns-suspected-in-the-death-of-150-mexicans/

But we have covered this ground before....

Is not Gunwalker® .

nice try. It is a continuation of the same program. My guess is the arrest rate and confiscation of firearms is much higher now. Well unless the NRA bullshit stops a successful program.

So deaths that result from the abuse of a Constitutional right (I.E., RKBA) in this country are abhorrent to you, but deaths that result from our own government aiding and abetting the breaking of federal law by agents of the federal government itself are to be ignored as part of a "successful program"? Well. How very "progressive" of you.

What success, the BS stats from the NY Times article?

Let's dance .

You dont get to guess , so find the answers to these questions and prove yourself worth scalping .

After two years and chingos of cash . How many F&F convictions or defendants are there ? How many were ALREADY felons ?

Carters Country was fingered via press release by the feds as a pivotal part of the conspiracy the moment someone that counted got killed . So what ever happened to their FFL ?

Till then , I have yeast to pitch , and Vedalias and pork on the fire .

To paraphrase .

Goodness, Myrna. Quit guessing.

Whats the conviction to death ratio?

the specific operation that is in question here, is only a part of Gunrunner. So it's disingenuous to point to unspecified successes of GR as any sort of evidence in favor of F & F...

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/06/16/us/16guns.html

only a part of (hahahahaha, nice one) I would guess the arrest rate and confiscation of firearms is actually much higher.

undetailed success - there's no indication that F&F is responsible for any fraction of that. And even if it was, that doesn't erase the flaws and failings of F&F...

Edit: By the way, that "part of" you found so amusing is a quote from the column you lifted your sig line from (perhaps you should reread it?). The column makes no mention of any successes due to F & F itself:
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/06/16/us/16guns.html

And you maintain that this is a "success"?

Some kind of fundamental change or transformation I'd wager .

This from the supervisor..



I love though how wapo makes it out to be a local operation gone slightly awry.

Grassley and Issa's report released today paints quite a picture using Agent testimony. Today's hearing s should be interesting.