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DogPoundPup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-23-09 07:24 PM
Original message
The self-defence defence
Edited on Sat Jan-24-09 02:05 AM by Lithos
Wartime in Israel is effectively a totalitarian blackout: objectors are denounced as traitors and suppressed or sidelined, while the media almost entirely ignores the consequences of Israeli military actions. This is partly down to self-censorship and partly down to the codes of a military censor.

But now that Israelis can ask themselves all those difficult questions that were zealously avoided during the past three weeks, will they?

From the initial reactions this week, it doesn't look like it. In the past few days, radio commentators have been debating the wisdom of a military ban on soldiers discussing battleground details. Their concern is: if soldiers don't speak up about the Hamas horrors they faced in Gaza, how will the world remain convinced that the Israeli assault was necessary?

This has been a central theme of the war in Gaza: not that hundreds of innocent people were killed, not that over 5,000 were horribly injured and not the sky-high human and monetary cost of wrecking homes or razing infrastructure. Even as Palestinian bodies are still being pulled out from the rubble in Gaza, one prominent facet of Israel's internal discussion is how to keep the Western world resolute in the belief that it was all justified – and just.


Edited to 3-4 paragraphs to conform to DU's fair use policy for copyrighted material

Lithos
DU Moderator


http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2009/jan/23/israelandthepalestinians-gaza
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baldguy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-23-09 07:33 PM
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1. the brute cries "VICTIM!" when he's beating his unconscious targets' face into a bloody pulp.
and the ignorant fearful cheer him on.
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Boojatta Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 12:21 AM
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2. "indiscriminate bombing of civilian areas."
Why does Israel's use of high-tech weaponry to indiscriminately bomb civilian areas cause fewer deaths than were caused by low-tech Hutu attacks on Tutsis? Perhaps Israel is not a credible threat to world peace. Perhaps Israel's military is much less powerful than the Hutu militias of 1994.

Beginning on April 6, 1994, and for the next hundred days, up to 800,000 Tutsis were killed by Hutu militia using clubs and machetes, with as many as 10,000 killed each day.

Rwanda is one of the smallest countries in Central Africa, with just 7 million people

Source:
http://www.unitedhumanrights.org/Genocide/genocide_in_rwanda.htm
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iconicgnom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 01:50 AM
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3. hell no. It's so much more powerful, relatively speaking,
that the IDF could afford to take their time. They left their "warzone" on their own timetable, having taught the Gazans a lesson to remember.
In fact the military disparity is so overwhelming that it's correct to say that what Israel was doing in Gaza was straightforward operant conditioning, like the crudest Pavlovian would condition a dog. I saw this vid just now showing how the IDF tanks and armored bulldozers cleared a few entire villages. I mean, the entire things. But nicely, to show how polite they were, they served notice to leave or else, first.
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oberliner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 04:30 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. So when Hamas declares "victory" they are full of it?
Is that a fair statement?
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azurnoir Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 02:18 AM
Response to Reply #2
4. Because sir sometimes the "old fashioned way"
is more efficient. There is also the fact that in Rwanda it was literally neighbor against neighbor sometimes family member against family member, the guy you were joking with over a beer yesterday was coming at you with a machete the next, just a bit harder to defend against, not to mention no one was watching as it were perhaps if the Hutu had F16's there would have been more attention paid
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