Twilight Zone / `I punched an Arab in the face'

The most chilling of all the personal
confessions: "I ran toward them and punched an
Arab right in the face. I'd never punched
anyone that way. He collapsed on the road. The
officers said that we had to search him for his
papers. We pulled his hands behind his back and
I bound them with plastic handcuffs. Then we
blindfolded him so he wouldn't see what was in
the Jeep. I picked him up from the road. Blood
was trickling from his lip onto his chin. I led
him up behind the Jeep and threw him in, his
knees banged against the trunk and he landed
inside. We sat in the back, stepping on the
Arab ... Our Arab lay there pretty quietly,
just crying softly to himself. His face was
right on my flak jacket and he was bleeding and
making a kind of puddle of blood and saliva,
and it disgusted and angered me, so I grabbed
him by the hair and turned his head to the
side. He cried out loud and to get him to stop,
we stepped harder and harder on his back. That
quieted him down for a while and then he
started up again. We concluded that he was
either retarded or crazy.

"The company commander informed us over the
radio that we had to bring him to the base.
`Good work, tigers,' he said, teasing us. All
the other soldiers were waiting there to see
what we'd caught. When we came in with the
Jeep, they whistled and applauded wildly. We
put the Arab next to the guard. He didn't stop
crying and someone who understood Arabic said
that his hands were hurting from the handcuffs.
One of the soldiers went up to him and kicked
him in the stomach. The Arab doubled over and
grunted, and we all laughed. It was funny ... I
kicked him really hard in the ass and he flew
forward just as I'd expected. They shouted that
I was a totally crazy, and they laughed ... and
I felt happy. Our Arab was just a 16-year-old
mentally retarded boy."





http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/363483.html

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you pretty much said it all

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situation over there is all about - it is about GREED!!!!!!!! It is about running the Arab off the land and stealing everything they have. Pure and simple. I don't care what they do to disguise their agendas, but the ugly and brutal truths somehow always manage to squeak out. So before you go blah, blah, blah, you need to open your eyes and take a look at what little bits of truth manage to make it to the light of day. What you will see is just the tip of the iceberg. Reality for the Arab is about 500 times worse. So please spare me your "fair is fair" rationale. This is why American policy is so "loved" around the world - YOU are the ones who pay cash for this behaviour over there!!!! Think about that.

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complacent about the brutality there. That is why they have gotten away with it for so long. Plus all those American dollars.

bombs blowing up kids at discos?...just asking...

for a moment and you have to ask yourself who really gains by keeping this brutality going????????? I know what the newspapers tell you. Think beyond that for one moment.

is actually blowing up Israeli children? Is that what you believe?

Yes, the Palestinian groups NEVER commit terror -- even when they admit it, videotape who will do it ahead of time and parade around the parents like they are heroes.

??

...who Poodle claims is doing the bombing. I'd like to hear it from the source.

Than to be cut down by a human bomb attack.

In comparison, every Palestinian has to go through these checkpoints and statistically they are going to run into a prick like this at least once and more likely over and over again.

You don't think eventually life would cease to be worth much other than as a token to spend getting back at your tormenters?

that makes it okay for Palestinian militants to kill Israeli civilians?

I'm not trying to deny that the Israeli military is doing horrible things to Palestinians, but blaming the entire population for the government/military's actions, or insinuating that they deserve to be blown up in cafes is absurd.

You don't think eventually life would cease to be worth much other than as a token to spend getting back at your tormenters?

I have no patience for that kind of thinking. It's exactly what keeps the cycle of violence going.

The vast majority of Israeli's will not be blown up, the entire Palestinian population however is dealt with in this way. Do you see where I am going? The death toll is a meaningless statistic, human suffering is universal for Palestinians where it's highly specific and rare among Israeli's.

I'm not asking for patience or offering justification for the human bombers, I'm offering a reason why it would become a seductive idea other than the usual banal ones.

Corrodes all. Persons feel, rightly or wrongly, they control automobiles, and so do not fear to use them, whatever the actual risk. Persons presented with the possibility of death at any instant, erupting in the normal and unavoidable routine of their lives, grow rather nervy. It cannot be reasonably pretended the situation does not wear greatly on both peoples.

Have you been to Isreal recently? Do you know anybody who lives there?

If you did, you would never suggest that the suffering related to terrorist attacks is "highly specific and rare." Everybody in Israel has to deal with the possibility of somebody walking onto their bus or into their cafe and blowing the place up. Terror affects everybody, that's why it's an effective weapon (though not necessarily toward the intended ends).

The Israeli people are not systematically oppressed in the way the Palestinians are, you're right. But it's unbelievable that you would actually think that most Israelis aren't affected by suicide bombings.

are far worse off then the Israelis. Even with all the suicide attacks, the Israelis are not losing their land, their houses demolished, their agriculture demolished, having daily raids by a foreign army repressing them and everything that a average Palestinian has to go through. Not even anything close to that...

The Palestinian people are generally worse off than the Israelis (you'll notice that I made that point already in my last post). I fully agree with you.

My point is that arguing who is worse off is never going to get us anywhere in terms of a peace process. Both sides must admit that they bear some of the responsibility.

When Poodle says that Israel is an abomination, that's not a helpful comment. It's not something that's going to stop people from getting killed. It's bigotry. The exact kind of statement that keeps the Israelis and Palestinians at eachother's throats.

If I had it my way, Gush Emunim, Kach, Hamas, I.J., Bibi Netanyahu, Ariel Sharon, and Yasser Arafat would all be put on a desert island together somewhere so that Isrealis and Palestinians could actually be given a chance to put their lives back together.

agree! Always glad to agree with the more reasonable people coming from the "other" team ;)

an episode of Survivor I'd actually watch!

yeah. right f-ing on.

the soldiers some of whom turn into bullies. The mentally challenged boy who was bullied. There is no winner here.

Still, as you said, there is no excuse for terrorism. There is no excuse for bombing cafes or shooting two little boys through the head while their mother is reading them a bedside story, none.

I put more onus on the weasel than anyone else because he has walked away from peace numerous times, encouraged children to become murderers, all the while stealing money and resources from the people he supposedly represents.

but I keep hearing how these people have nothing. How can anyone steal nothing? Besides, one can't run anyone off a land that is not theirs to begin with.

These soldiers are mostly reservists, brought up mostly on a media diet of Arabs all being 'terrorists'.

They also have the psychological memory of the holocaust drilled into them by every figure in the political spectrum (and of course plenty have that personal outlook anyway, for understandable reasons).

Then factor in having to militarily occupy an unwilling populace, with all the associated stress etc.

It equals this sort of thing.

You can see the same thing in Iraq right now. I hardly think that makes the USA an "abomination", do you?

That means most his time was under Netanyahu's watch but it really doesn't matter who is PM, the occupation always looked like this.

Right, because the majority of people in Israel must condone this sort of thing, right? If you read Israelis this story, I'm sure they'd be proud of what those soldiers did. Gimme a break.

The abomination is the violence.

Calling Israel an abomination is deplorable. And that sort of statement isn't about countering greed. It's about bigotry and attacking a bunch of people who are for the most part just as innocent as the Palestinian victims, but who (like the Palestinians, and the Americans, and plenty of other nations) are ruled by militaristic hardliners.

Criticize Sharon and Bibi and Likud all you want, but while your at it, talk about Hamas and Islamic Jihad as well. Don't make it seem as if only one side has innocent victims.

:

What point did I miss? Could you be more specific?

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most of them not only know it goes on they probably committed the same sort of crimes at some point

Ah. So you're going to provide me with some evidence to back up this claim, right? So it's not just blind speculation?

It's the guy who was beating down the Arabs.

Read the second and third paragraphs of the article.

Those paragraphs talk about an image of the military presented to the Isreali population that does not reflect what's actually going on in the territories.

That's the point I was making. I don't think that the majority of Isrealis would support the kind of behavior described by that soldier.

and it is awful, there is a balance called good. That good is the story made the national papers, and it will be published.

Why? What kind of country would wash their dirty linen, it is dirty linen in public (aside from the USA)? Only another free and progressive nation such as Israel.

When the other side can do the same, we'll have a real chance of peace.

This solder says he was the leader in this kind of behavior. Now he's written a book about it. True confessions. Sounds like he's still a leader in venting his antagonistic feelings.

Also this took place before Sharon was PM.

This is what you get in a harsh, brutal, military occupation. Doubly so when the occupier does not accept it is occupying (i.e. the residents must either be 'terrorists' or dogs who must not 'raise their heads').

army on the planet...

This young man is wise beyond his years. "Checkpoint Syndrom" is an excellent name for the thing.

This sort of duty is inherently corrupting, and the wisest course for any government of Israel would be seek ways to remove this strain from its soldiery and people.

This sort of duty is inherently corrupting

I think that's just it.

that's what you get in war, any war.

they make me wanna puke!!! :mad: :grr: :mad: :grr: