Death of Newborn Twins from Deir Ballut

The Death of Newborn Twins from Deir Ballut

Yesterday, Lamis Tayser Ibrahim, a resident from Deir Ballut village in Salfit district, was prevented from reaching the hospital in Nablus when experiencing premature labor; she is twenty years old with a one year old daughter and was in her seventh month of pregnancy with twins. However, the Occupation military closed off the entire village yesterday, prohibiting all movement in and out of Deir Ballut. When Lamis arrived to the village’s main road to Nablus in desperate need of medical attention from bleeding and labor pains, Occupation soldiers refused to let her pass.

Lamis sat in her family’s car, experiencing unbearable pain and fear for the safety of her unborn twins. Despite her consistent pleas, the soldiers prohibited her from passing and from taking shelter from the cold in a neighboring house. An ambulance arrived to take her to the hospital but the soldiers continued to deny her.

and despicable.

When, exactly, did the evil Zionist Entity close down the maternity hospital in Zawiya?

:shrug:

pretending like dying babies is a work of fiction doesn't help.

"relative calm, at it's finest.

this is by no means the only such case of people or babies dying because of the occupation.

the people and babies dying at the hands of suicide bombers intent on keeping peace at bay?

The woman should have been passed through to hospital, without question.

Denial of medical care in an emergency is certainly a violation of the duties of an occupying power under the Geneva Conventions.

It is much to be regretted it is unlikely either the persons who ordered this, or those who executed that order, will be punished: they damned well ought to be. There is no excuse for this sort of thing.

i googled this story in every way possible and came up
with nothing.

Gee, do you think this site has a political agenda??

I want some independant proof ....not this trash site.

isnt a newsource...its just a complete propaganda political
site.

lets see some outside confirmatory source.

http://www.newsday.com/news/nationworld/world/wire/sns-ap-palestinians-closures,0,7341723.story?coll=sns-ap-world-headlines

More Palestinian Moms Give Birth at Home

<snip>

"JERUSALEM -- Because of Israeli roadblocks and travel restrictions in the West Bank, more than half of Palestinian mothers give birth at home instead of risking a ride to the hospital, according to a human rights report released Monday.

The joint report by the Israeli human rights group B'tselem and the Israeli branch of Physicians for Human Rights is the latest evidence of the negative effects of the restrictions, imposed shortly after the latest violence between Israel and the Palestinians erupted in 2000."

<snip>

"Several dozen Palestinians -- including at least seven newborns -- have died because of delays at checkpoints, B'tselem said.

Before the latest conflict, about 95 percent of Palestinian babies were born in hospitals, the report said."

proves nothing about this story....from a non-news
website with a clear political agenda.

Palestinians are dying due to Israeli Apartheid, and the best response you can come up with is "you can't prove it"?

and i will eat my words.

otherwise the story is UNADULTERATED BULLSHIT.

you're beloved "JIHAD-UNSPUN" doesnt count
for shit.

www.geocities.com/jihad_unspun

"Suicide Bombers" are really free entertainers provided by Fatah

As the zionist media goes into overdrive trying to claim that "innocent" jews are being killed by "terrorists" using explosives strapped to their bodies we can exclusively reveal the facts behind this jewish LIE! The so called "terrorists" are in fact street entertainers sent by the people of Palestine to entertain jews in restaurants, discos, pizzarias and shopping centers. The so called "bomb belts" are in fact a device for holding their juggling sticks. The generous people of Palestine channel the money through fatah to groups which specialise in training young people in skills such as juggling, mime and other forms of street theatre. They cleary do this in the hope that by giving so generously even though they are poor they will persuade the people occupying their land to see sense and live happilly together.

Fun-loving Hamas holds open day for local kids

you go on thinking the story is made up, and the rest of us will continue to talk about these types of tragedies and what to do about it.

Deal?

you cant prove this story is real.

thanks for the propaganda.

i cant log on to this site at work...i willwhen i get
home.

anything from Palestine Info whatever...Don, can you say, "propaganda"? I know you can recognize it!

Then she's going to Ramallah.

First the second baby is dead, now it's alive.

Hard to keep the Propoganda straight ...


How about this? Woman goes to hospital to have healthy child. Makes up bullshit story about dead twin at the urging of ISM tools. Still doesn't understand why she couldn't just go to the maternity hospital in Zawiya, which is only minutes away.

...the first story says:

"After two treacherous hours, the Occupation soldiers “allowed” Lamis to pass in the ambulance. The timing was all too late. The first newborn child died in the ambulance near Al Luban Sharqiya, a village along the road to Nablus, while the second child died a few hours after reaching the hospital."

While the second states...

"We remained for two hours in the cold weather before we finally entered the ambulance where I gave birth to my first child who died on the spot,” the woman said, adding that the other child was born a few kilometers later and was in an unstable condition at the Ramallah hospital where they arrived at 5.30 am."


Obviously the latter version was written before the second infant died.

The first says that she's going to Nablus and the second has her in Rammallah, which is in the opposite direction. Neither story explains why she wasn't in the maternity hospital in Zawiya, which is just minutes from Deir Ballut and is not restricted by any checkpoints.

pretend like it didn't happen. Fits the definition of 'denial' perfectly.

Stop posting propoganda. Stop posting lies.

Tell me this:

When was the maternity hospital in Zawiya closed down?

sure. it's all lies. made up.

:crazy:

:yourock:

Here's another example of their "fine journalism":

"Rafah - The Zionist terrorist military campaign into the southern Gaza Strip city of Rafah that started at dawn today has so far led to the martyrdom of eight Palestinians and the injury of 32 others ten of whom in critical condition."

http://www.palestine-info.co.uk/am/publish/article_3766.shtml

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

:yourock:

prove that the site supports terrorism?

The link you gave is not to that article.

Nablus is 33 kilometers northwest of Deir Ballut. The maternity hospital which serves the people of Deir Ballut is NOT in Nablus but, rather, in the town of Zawiya, which is only about 3 kilometers away on a line and perhaps as many as 5 by main roads.

http://www.indymedia.org.uk/en/2003/07/273802.html

"The village has two clinics and a maternity hospital that also serves the nearby villages of Rafat and Deir Ballut."

Moreover, while the road between Deir Ballut and Nablus has numerous checkpoints, the road between Deir Ballut and Zawiya has none:

http://www2.manniskohjalp.se/www/dok/bulletindok03/wb_north_closure.pdf

Deir Ballut, not coincidentally, is the new ground zero for anti-Israeli propoganda:

http://hawaii.indymedia.org/news/2003/12/3954.php
http://vancouver.indymedia.org/news/2003/12/93406.php
http://mumbai.indymedia.org/newswire/display/773/index.php

Magistrate, my friend, haven't you seen enough of this kind of propoganda and lies to not take it at face value?

One is that there might have been anticipated complications with the delivery that led the attending physician to recommend the particular hospital. That sort of thing happens, and Israeli hospitals, laudably, make a point of treating Arab Palestinians in need of their services.

Another is that there is nothing particularly outre about the story: there have in the past been incidents acknowledged true in which delays at check-points have led to serious complications. It is one of the difficulties with the security measures, though these are, on balance, a necessary part of any sustained campaign against guerrilla forces. It seems to me the Israeli army could take better steps to minimize this particular difficulty, which can only harm the state of Israel in the long run.

If a soldier at the checkpoint had been shot, say, how long do you think it would have taken before army medical assistance reached him? If there was some question in the sentry's mind whether the emergency was legitimate, army medical personnel could have quickly arrived to determine the facts. If there was some concern regarding the vehicle the patient was to be transported in, surely an army ambulance, about which there could have been no such question possible, could have been quickly provided. Measures such as these would have turned such an incident from a propaganda windfall for the Arab Palestinian ultras to a propaganda windfall for Israel. Surely "IDF Ambulance Transports Palestinian Mom To Hospital, Babies Fine" would be a better headline? Even the "National News" would enjoy running it....

IF the incident happened at all as it was reported or, in fact, if it happened at all. Mr. Scurrilous reports that the story is confirmed by another source. Specifically, Arafat's own Palestinian Information Center. However, rather than lending credence to the story, it refutes it at every turn. See post #47 for some of the inconsistancies. The truth is easy to keep straight. It's verifiable. Lies are tougher, which is how you wind up with babies being born in different places, dying in different places, a woman of different ages going to two different cities with different relatives.

Do you really believe that, with a maternity hospital just minutes away (and it is, specifically a maternity hospital), that a woman would have sat for over two hours in the middle of a cold night by a checkpoint and given birth in a car? If the soldier had shot out her car tires and held her there at gunpoint (which is the story that you may hear next), do you believe that no one from her family, who was there with her, would have, in all of that time, made the short walk up the road to the maternity hospital and brought a doctor or nurse back with them?

Do you really believe that any "attending physician" would have sent her anywhere but the nearest competent medical facility if his patient was, in the middle of a cold night, bleeding and in labor?

This story is a lie. There have, in the past, been incidents where people have suffered because they have had to wait at checkpoints. Israel has been harmed by these incidents and, as a result, since propogandists love a story that works, you will keep hearing about such incidents, whether they actually occurred or not.

In initial reports, even honest ones, there is often a great deal of jumble and discrepancy: journalism is not called "the rough draft of history" for nothing. It is also true that incidents have been cut from whole cloth in this conflict at times, and a great deal of exaggeration and embellishment to incidents in other cases.

The Israeli army could also maintain policies that would ensure such an account would be met with general incredulity, and it would seem to me that there would be material benefit to having such policies in place. One of the mistakes conventional forces habitually make in guerrilla way is a chronic under-appreciation of the full scope of the battlefield, which is, by the very nature of such conflicts, more political than military.

Lies tend to stick and the lies involved in this conflict are constant. A few examples:

Ask anyone who shot Mohamen Al-Dura, the Palestinian poster boy for Israeli brutality, and they will tell you, "why, the IDF did." Did that lie ever come out in the wash? No. And it never will as far as most of the world, and all of the Arab world, is concerned, the IDF kills cowering little boys on purpose:

http://www.theatlantic.com/issues/2003/06/fallows.htm

The ham-fisted, clumsy lies about Rachel Corrie have been debunked again and again and again. And yet, due to the fact that they are repeated so often, people who do not know better believe the fable that Israel purposely murdered a peace activist.

The vast majority of the Arab world to this day believes that there was a huge massacre in Jenin where, in fact, none occurred. Anti-semites from the UN helped spread that evil little fable and more than a few people on this very site gave it a push.

Much of the Arab world believes, sincerely, that Jews use the blood of children in their holiday food. But for Memri bringing a story on the subject to Western eyes, it would have passed unnoticed, since it is hardly out of place in the Middle-East.

The Protocols of the Elders of Zion are turned into a miniseries and peddled as truth. Do you really believe that the average Egyptian or Syrian saw through that?

If and when this story is ever debunked, it will be in the form of some government report that few will see and far fewer still will believe.

"I am ready to kill for the sake of my cause; wouldn't I lie for it?"
- Yasser Arafat

Arafat's attitude has been taken to heart by the people who support his cause and it shows.

e.g., the NY Times, Guardian, etc.

...if the NY Times or the Guardian doesn't report it, it didn't happen? Does this apply to all stories linked in this forum? Or just ones that reflect unfavorably on Israel?

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

has been able to successfully respond to Blitz' specific truths about the hospital, the area, etc. Very interesting.

what is interesting is all the pretending that the story is totally made up.

It's called denial.

You posted propoganda from an anti-Israel propoganda site. Your story has been refuted with specific, verifiable facts. Here are some more.

The story that you posted states that the woman waited for hours at a checkpoint so that she could go to the hospital in Nablus to give birth to twins. Ultimately, according to your story, she wound up in Nablus, where her second child died.

The Story posted by Scurrilous from another anti-Israeli propoganda site about the SAME INCIDENT stated that she was going to Ramallah.

Uh-oh, red flag.

The first story says that she arrived at the checkpoint and then, after she was denied passage and had sat in her "cold car" and was not permitted to seek shelter in a house, an ambulance arrived.

Second story? The ambulance was waiting for her on the other side of the checkpoint when she arrived but the evil zionist wouldn't let her get in it.

The first story again: She gave birth to both babies in the family car (because remember, she wasn't allowed to get into the ambulance) with the help of the poor, hapless driver and the poor woman's cousin.

Second story: She gave birth in the ambulance and there's no cousin this time. This time, she's with her mother and mother in law.

First story: The first child dies near Al Luban Sharqiya, a village along the road to Nablus.

Second story: Well, we can't have that, can we? After all, she's on her way to Ramallah. OK, I know ... the first baby "died on the spot" and instead of both babies being born at the roadblock, let's say that "the other child was born a few kilometers later."

First story: The woman is 20 years old.

Second story: Now she's 26.

In a couple of very short stories, that's enough red flags for your average ANSWER rally.

But that's not all.

Your story provides a nice little map and a blurb about the "neighboring villages Rafat and Zawiya." What it fails to mention (and here, the two stories have something in common) is that not only are all three villages on the same side of the security fence, with no roadblocks or other impediments between them (refer to this map: http://www2.manniskohjalp.se/www/dok/bulletindok03/wb_north_closure.pdf ) but there is a straight road between the three and Zawiya, which is only about 2 to 3 miles from Deir Ballut, has a MATERNITY HOSPITAL. Have I mentioned that Zawiya has a MATERNITY HOSPITAL??? Just wondering, because some people might find it interesting that while this 20/26 year old woman and her born/unborn children were waiting for over two hours in the car/ambulance to go 20 miles through numerous checkpoints to Ramallah/Nablus with her cousin/mother-in-law, there was a MATERNITY HOSPITAL just a few minutes' drive away.

Do you find that interesting? Tell me, Resistance, when did the evil Zionist Entity close down the Zawiya Maternity Hospital?

this story has more holes than swiss cheese.

The *STORY* is LIES and PROPAGANDA.

These fake news outfits can't keep their own propaganda straight.

written by The Clown Prince of Propaganda , no other

than , Saeb "Killing Fields" Erekat .

It's just that I happen to think that those sources are more credible than "Electronic Intifada," "Jihad Unspun," or any other fringe publication.

Maybe when Scurrilous replies he can pick up the slack for Resistance and tell everyone about when the Maternity Hospital in Zawiya was shut down.