The problem with a Sept. 11 conspiracy

is that NO group of people could ever keep a plot as massive as the Sept. 11 attacks a secret.

...Unless they are a couple dozen arabs.

it is the coverup. It was easy for OBL - he didn't have to worry about a coverup.

when they committed war crimes.

if you own the intelligence agencies, Justice department, and media.

they've also done here -- from stolen elections, to assassination, to "false flag"

to create wars . . .

does Cheney have a dungen full of federal employees' loved ones?

Well I suppose at one end you could shout 'national security' everytime anyone asks arkward questions, obstruct any meaningful investigation in the middle and at the other end send anthrax through the post as a warning to anyone who steps out of line.

I don't know though... it's a bit far fetched.

because if you bring up examples of massive conspiracies from history which were not revealed for years or decades, like the Manhattan Project or Operation Paper Clip or Operation Gladio they'll come back at you right away: "you see eventually all of these came out". Of course by definition 9/11 was a conspiracy, ppl just disagree who were the conspirators: arab terrorists vs arab terrorists working for rogue elements in the US gov. Either way the notion of "criminal conspiracy" is not something kooks came up with, it's in the legal system of every country. And yes, some criminals do work for the national security establishment, ever heard of the concept of "treason"?!

The CIA IG report said that 50-60 people at the CIA and probably about half that number at the FBI HQ who knew about Mihdhar and Hazmi, knew they were inside of the US and knew they were in the US in order to take part in the massive al Qaeda terrorists attack that both the CIA and FBI HQ had been warned about since April 2001.

So you are only talking about less that 100 people, that made sure this information did not get to the FBI Cole bombing investigators that could have stopped this attack. This is all described at www.eventson911.com.

something as incredulous as 9/11 off. Just the right people in the right places. And to boot, you've always got the "it's too big" con/alibi.

Please.

PLUS, all of these people have one way or another been involved in mutual corruption of

government and siphoning off government money before this --

They all had a lot to gain --

Which is another factor in considering their future violence because they have to worry

about being out of power too long -- there's a lot that has to be kept covered up.

We can't have Dems digging up dead bodies!

Considering all the war games that were taking place, many people who were "involved" didn't even know they were involved and ironically these "War game" diversions were even used in Britain and Spain. So, you have your military, law enforcement, and intelligence personnel imitating the event and don't even realize they are helping it occur in real time. That eliminates the need to include a ton of people in the process. As for the hijackers, I think they were fooled into thinking they were doing something entirely different and for a different purpose. Which leaves only the puppet masters of the main organizations who really need to know what was happening. (Of course if my theory is accurate, that would mean the military planes observed (and on video) in the sky over New York and Washington during the attacks were controlling the planes remotely which was technologically possible at the time.)

"As for the hijackers, I think they were fooled into thinking they were doing something entirely different and for a different purpose."

Like somehow the hijackers didn't notice the part where they were on a real commercial airliner hijacking it? Or maybe they were tricked into thinking the twin towers were giant Twinkies and they just wanted to see the cream filling?

What in the fuck exactly do you propose they were fooled into thinking they were doing that involved slamming jets into buildings?

Also has proven there were no phone calls!!!

PLUS, the FBI had 24 hour high security watch on at least two of these alleged hijackers!

Nor is there any proof that any of these "hijackers" were even on the planes --!!!

And, my advice to anyone who still believes that aluminum planes go thru steel buildings

like BUTTER is to get a copy of the planes flying into the buildings in slow motion and

just keep watching them --

over and over again -- until you get it!

:eyes:

Which puts a bit of a crimp into your 'theory', don't you think?

and at least one or two of the exercises began that morning . . .

coincidentally . . . at the same time the hijackings began.

Those hijackers had phenomenal luck that day didn't they?

No NORAD, training programs, had the skies to themselves.

Wow -- I guess had the Russians known our government was going to

take the day off on 9/11, they would have invaded!!!

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

As a trained, schooled, and natural born investigator, I am open to all info. Can you give me any direction on where you have heard War Games did not take place? I have yet to encounter this de-bunk and would love to have any and all information you might know about this.

UNTIL THE EVENT GOES PUBLIC!

19 individuals hijack aircraft and slam them into three buildings and a field (not the intended target).
They would need some funding etc. But we know a fair amount about that and it is within reason.

Now if something ELSE happened, then we have to start the calculation of who is involved all over again. Say the 19 arabs never existed... how many people to fake their existence? Plus the people who did exist instead, unless you posit that the planes were not hijacked, requiring another increase in complexity and the number of people in the know. Etc. Etc.

It is utterly intellectually dishonest to pretend that hijacking aircraft, and plots involving hijacking aircraft, planting explosives, and covering it all up. are of the same complexity. Much less for many of the 'truther' ideas like some or all of the video footage being faked.

One thing I have pondered is the planes that did crash were ones that were a part of the "wargames" which would explain why so many LE, military, and gov officials were on board the planes. Maybe those planes were actually simulating hijackings at the same time as they were hijacked by the military and flone as drones into their targets.

Could be as plausible as the OCT. But, your guess is as good as any of mine.

I dont tend to theorize what actually happened, I just know the official story has some major holes that need to be filled to say the least. And, when you read about Operation Northwoods which was presented as an option for Cuba kinda makes you go hmmmm...


From the Wiki on "Operation Northwoods"
"It is possible to create an incident which will demonstrate convincingly that a Cuban aircraft has attacked and shot down a chartered civil airliner en route from the United States to Jamaica, Guatemala, Panama or Venezuela. The destination would be chosen only to cause the flight plan route to cross Cuba. The passengers could be a group of college students off on a holiday or any grouping of persons with a common interest to support chartering a non-scheduled flight.

a. An aircraft at Eglin AFB would be painted and numbered as an exact duplicate for a civil registered aircraft belonging to a CIA proprietary organization in the Miami area. At a designated time the duplicate would be substituted for the actual civil aircraft and would be loaded with the selected passengers, all boarded under carefully prepared aliases. The actual registered aircraft would be converted to a drone."

fake planes -- duplicate planes -- planes switched for drones --

fake "students" -- planes landed elsewhere -- mock funerals.

And then there was all that money floating around from the "fund" for 9/11 families --

and many did not make a claim on the fund! Imagine that!

The hijackers would also be imaginary -- in fact, at least 11 or more of the alleged

hijackers have been found alive.

FAKE people are just that -- photoshopped . . . including brief histories.

Of the 11 or so dead in my town from 9/11 . . . no one made a claim on the Fund!

Try this re planes . . . people loyal to Bush/Cheney -- maybe Pentagon, military people

and their families are loaded on planes . . . flown around for a while and landed in

Cincinnati, let's say. Two planes landed there. UA confirmed one was flight #93.

All passengers disembarked safely --

Actual plane "passengers" dead ... faked . . .

PLUS we have many people in financial difficulty these days -- many of the "victims" and

family members had government liens on their homes, for one.

And, let me ask you . . . have you actually looked at any of the video footage.

For instance, just the photos of aluminum planes sailing thru steel buildings like BUTTER?

Play those over and again and over and again in SLOW MOTION for a while and see what you

finally come up with -- other than anti-physics lessons!

Blackwater was available, willing and able -- and much of 9/11 looks like a military oepration.

See the level of detail in the proposal below? They not only have a broad concept, they have the exact AF base picked out and a CIA proprietary plane out of Miami... To me such level of detail in a mere "proposal" indicates they actually worked on the specifics of this plan to the point of having such detail in the memo. Knowing that they had to do some leg work to be able to list such details is what is scary...

again pasted from the wiki
"a. An aircraft at Eglin AFB would be painted and numbered as an exact duplicate for a civil registered aircraft belonging to a CIA proprietary organization in the Miami area. At a designated time the duplicate would be substituted for the actual civil aircraft and would be loaded with the selected passengers, all boarded under carefully prepared aliases. The actual registered aircraft would be converted to a drone."

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goofy, dude.

to a 9/11 thread that was in General for a while . . .

Think he was being sarcastic -- but website owners evidently do fear being labelled

"tin foil."

Personally, I think the tin foil is on the other side!

really gave me a shock when I heard it re JFK -- and really it would be true of

all the assassinations and right wing political violence that has gone on for decades --

and that is that ...

'NO ONE HAS THE POWER TO BRING THE TRUTH FORWARD'

That came from someone who might have a pretty good idea of what's going on.

But, obviously, the right wing is near hysterical now because they have to ensure that

they can steal the next elections.

If they're out of power too long, they're in danger of the bodies getting dug up!

we also created them --

People like Blackwater - Bush/Cheney could ....

for money $$$$$$$$

You have to be Arab in limited in number to pull it off?

Do explain the details!

:sarcasm:

You never know with them that have such a low post count!

High posts counts don't indicate much of anything. Just look at all the angry conspiracy deniers on this board.

Yes, it was sarcasm. I am not surprised that you thought I was serious since that really is how conspiracy deniers think. The ironic thing is that either way you look at it, believing the government version or not, what happened on sep-11 was the result of a conspiracy. So we're ALL wearing tin foil hats after all.

Conspiracy deniers believe that it is illogical to believe that some facet of the sophisticated elite apparatus of the United States is capable of pulling it off. ...But it is logical to believe a couple dozen arabs are capable. There is also the sentiment that an American government wouldn't kill its own citizens for selfish purposes. We all know the Neocons' loyalty to the well being of rank-and-file Americans. In my opinion, government believers should trade their tin foil hats in for some thinking caps.



I don't believe the government's version of the conspiracy and I never will, just like the tin-foil-hat government believers are militant in their beliefs.

welcome to the DUngeon. :hi:

here in the 9/11 Forum, we have Bill.

be happy!

for the welcome. It's nice to see friendly faces. Some people here are grumpy and mean.

There are plenty of people who know the WHO and WHY (motive) of 9/11, they just don't get onto the TV news. The information is all out there.

Most of the arguing is over the HOW of the day of 9/11 itself.