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Do You Believe False Flags Have Never Occured?

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kerrywins Donating Member (864 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-11-09 10:43 AM
Original message
Do You Believe False Flags Have Never Occured?
Edited on Fri Dec-11-09 10:44 AM by kerrywins
Throughout history, do you think there has never been a false flag? Has the term just been made up by paranoid people?
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LARED Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-11-09 11:08 AM
Response to Original message
1. Of course false flag operations have occurred
So what?
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alcibiades_mystery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-12-09 12:05 AM
Response to Original message
2. I believe that anyone who uses the term "false flag"
Is probably a fucking idiot. Not everybody, but, say, 90%.

This I believe.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-12-09 12:24 AM
Response to Reply #2
3. Deleted sub-thread
Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-14-09 10:23 AM
Response to Reply #2
13. Well, what were the Joint Chiefs talking about then in "Operation Northwoods"...???
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The Magistrate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-12-09 05:45 AM
Response to Original message
4. This Does Not, Ma'am, Lead To What You Hope It Will....
What you are attempting is to set ground for claiming that because events of 'type X' have occurred, that 'event A' is an event of 'type X'. It does not hold. It is analogous to someone accusing you of telling a lie, and offering as proof that lies have been told prior to your speaking. You would probably not accept that as proof you were engaged in mendacity, nor should anyone else.

The term 'false flag' seems to have leaked out from intelligence jargon into general usage, and to have under-gone some alteration during the journey. The original usage referred to an asset who was deceived about who he or she was actually providing information to, or engaged in other business for. As an example, a person might be persuaded to photograph documents detailing a metallurgic process under the impression he was providing information to a business competitor, rather than to an agent of a foreign power. The term has now come to mean, to many people, an action carried out by agents of a government against its citizens, that is passed off as having been done instead by a foreign power or a criminal group. Incidents of this sort have in fact been carried out from time to time, but that this is so proves nothing at all about any particular incident in which the people or armed forces of a country are attacked. Two well known instances of this sort are typical of such actions, and worth some detail accordingly.

In Manchuria, in 1931, a cabal of Japanese officers arranged for a small explosive charge to be set off on the tracks of the South Manchurian Railway, outside the city of Mukden, with the blast being blamed on Chinese troops quartered nearby, and being used as pretext to activate an action plan for protecting the railway by disarming Chinese garrisons along the line. The explosion was very small; indeed, an express train ran over the rails moments after the detonation, and its crew reported no more than a certain 'swaying' of the train. No real damage was done. All that was necessary was for a 'bang!' to be heard and reported.

Part of the Nazi plan for commencing invasion of Poland in 1939 called for a force of SS men dressed in Polish uniforms to 'attack' a radio station in a German town on the border the night before the invasion was set to begin, so it could be claimed the Poles had started hostilities against Germany. The disguised SS men brought along several prisoners condemned to death by the Nazi regime, who were killed on the scene to provide corpses to back the claim of fighting in the town. Apart from these unfortunates, there were no casualties. The event was duly trumpeted in German newspapers and radio broadcasts, and the invasion that morning presented to the populace as a response to this crowning provocation by the Poles.

The most striking element of both these incidents is the lack of real harm done, and this is indeed typical of such efforts. Neither the officer conspirators of Imperial Japan's Manchurian garrison, nor the Hitlerite regime, can be faulted as lacking in ruthlessness, and so it is instructive that the actual damage was so slight. It would certainly have been possible for a charge on the tracks in Manchuria to have wrecked that express train, or for the SS men to have killed a goodly number of civilians in that border town, after all. But even in fully totalitarian milieus, maintaining the fiction would have been problematic, and so the planners made sure to avoid the unnecessary risk.
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CJCRANE Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-15-09 03:02 PM
Response to Reply #4
14. Your first definition of false flag
is actually the one that is most useful...
but is mostly ignored by contemporary conspiracy theorists, who prefer the "inside job"/"synthetic terror" narrative.
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procopia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-15-09 04:20 PM
Response to Reply #4
15. It just comes to this...
Many defenders of the OCT have claimed that 9/11 couldn't have been an inside job because US government officials would never be so immoral. However, history shows that false flag events have, in fact, been planned by US officials in the past.

Whether the meaning of "false flag" has changed or not is irrelevant. What most people now believe the term to mean is consistent with the following definitions from the web:

"False flag operations are covert operations which are designed to deceive the public in such a way that the operations appear as though they are being carried out by other entities. The name is derived from the military concept of flying false colors; that is, flying the flag of a country other than one's own."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_flag

"A false flag operation is any procedure which is carried out by an organization and deceitfully designed to seem as though it has been orchestrated by another entity. The false flag operation gets its name from the military practice of flying another country’s flag for the purpose of deceiving one’s enemies. False flag operations often precede war, and are sometimes carried out for the express purpose of creating the illusion of an outside attack which warrants retaliation. Although the term false flag operation is most often used in the context of war and terrorism, false flag operations also frequently occur in politics, the corporate world, and religious ideology."
http://www.wisegeek.com/what-is-a-false-flag-operation.htm
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Bolo Boffin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-15-09 05:14 PM
Response to Reply #15
16. " Many defenders of the OCT have claimed that 9/11 couldn't have been an inside job because..."
"Many defenders of the OCT have claimed that 9/11 couldn't have been an inside job because US government officials would never be so immoral."

Please document this claim here at DU.
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jberryhill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-12-09 10:19 AM
Response to Original message
5. Sure they have

So?

The "official story" is that Barack Obama was born in Kenya.

The "official story" is that life evolved on planet earth.

The "official story" is that anthropogenic carbon dioxide has adverse climate effects.

Do you actually believe any of these "official stories"? Why are you such a blind sheeple who will not wake up and try to figure out the truth, instead of blindly believing these official stories.
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jberryhill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-12-09 02:57 PM
Response to Reply #5
6. Kenya lol.... I meant "Hawaii"

Been reading too much conspiracy crap.
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LARED Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-12-09 03:00 PM
Response to Reply #6
7. O One more Freudian slip like that and you will lose your secret decoder
ring privileges.
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jberryhill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-12-09 03:08 PM
Response to Reply #7
8. I'm sorry Dr. Kissinger, oops, I mean, Lared. /nt
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SDuderstadt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-12-09 05:57 PM
Response to Reply #8
9. I thought I WAS Dr. Kissinger this week...
Edited on Sat Dec-12-09 05:57 PM by SDuderstadt
would one of you guys send me the schedule again?
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Ghost in the Machine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-12-09 06:59 PM
Response to Reply #5
10. Nice post, Birfer!
:rofl:


:hi:


Peace,

Ghost

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jberryhill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-12-09 08:18 PM
Response to Reply #10
11. You see what happens?

Dang Internet warps yer mind after a while.
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Ghost in the Machine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-12-09 10:17 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. Teh Internetz is teh kraazee!



Hang in there Mr. Berryhill... it'll all be back to normal before long... just repeat after me...







Peace,

Ghost

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