During the Debate, Kerry Said He Supported the Patriot Act

I support Kerry, but I was a little bit bothered by that statement.

Was anyone else? :shrug:

I think that enough people are fed up with the Patriot Act that if Kerry said he'd repeal it, he'd win in a landslide.

pertaining to terror he would keep. He also said that we need to find a way to do this without the destruction of citizen's rights. Kerry has to be careful here because most Americans believe in those boogey men terrorists.

...were initially proposed by Clinton/Gore (and scoffed at, most famously, by many Republicans, including Ashcroft). Roaming wiretaps, expedited surveillance requests, etc. The problem civil libertarians have, and rightly so, is the lack of oversight to prevent abuse, and the attempt to make permanent many of the measures that were passed with sunset provisions because they were NEVER INTENDED to be permanent.

"Now the three things they try to say I've changed position on are the Patriot Act. I haven't, I support it. I just don't like the way John Ashcroft has applied it. And we're going to change a few things. The chairman of the Republican Party thinks we ought to change a few things."

He should have been more specific maybe. We'll probably hear more about it in the next debate.

since he voted for it I think he is trying to avoid another "flip flop" accusation. His position was strong without being inconsistent since he can't condemn it without giving the Republicans more ammunition to use against him. I agree with you 100% that many people (including myself) do not support the act and might I add that I find it's passage rather terrifying.

Ending the Era of John Ashcroft
Senator Kerry, Ames Iowa

<snip>

Much of what is in Patriot Act are good ideas. The Act increased penalties for terrorists, limited the statute of limitations for terrorist crimes, and allowed for greater prosecution of overseas acts against America. I fought to include important money laundering restrictions to clamp down on the cash flowing to terrorist enterprises. I had been pushing for these ideas since the late nineties - and after September 11th they were more important than ever.

I voted for the Patriot Act right after September 11th - convinced that - with a sunset clause - it was the right decision to make. It clearly wasn't a perfect bill - and it had a number of flaws - but this wasn't the time to haggle. It was the time to act.

But George Bush and John Ashcroft abused the spirit of national action after the terrorist attacks. They have used the Patriot Act in ways that were never intended and for reasons that have nothing to do with terrorism. That's why, as President, I will propose new anti-terrorism laws that advance the War on Terror while ending the assault on our basic rights.

<snip>

http://www.vote-smart.org/speech_detail.php?speech_id=26626&keyword=&phrase=&contain=&PHPSESSID=9dccbf9fc0fcd2ac993b387a16fd93c0

From the KE website, it says they are in favor of 95% of the provisions of the PATRIOT Act. The document is here. Worth printing out to circulate among friends and family that have similar concerns.
http://www.johnkerry.com/pdf/pr_2004_0525b_a.pdf

Try to read the whole thing - Kerry is on our side re patriot act - He will protect our liberties

here are the parts he says are "good" and I agree w him

<snip>

Much of what is in Patriot Act are good ideas. The Act increased penalties for terrorists, limited the statute of limitations for terrorist crimes, and allowed for greater prosecution of overseas acts against America. I fought to include important money laundering restrictions to clamp down on the cash flowing to terrorist enterprises. I had been pushing for these ideas since the late nineties - and after September 11th they were more important than ever.

I voted for the Patriot Act right after September 11th - convinced that - with a sunset clause - it was the right decision to make. It clearly wasn't a perfect bill - and it had a number of flaws - but this wasn't the time to haggle. It was the time to act.

But George Bush and John Ashcroft abused the spirit of national action after the terrorist attacks. They have used the Patriot Act in ways that were never intended and for reasons that have nothing to do with terrorism. That's why, as President, I will propose new anti-terrorism laws that advance the War on Terror while ending the assault on our basic rights.

<snip>

I agree with the concept behind the Act. (the word "patriot" is outright disrespectful and makes it sounds like those 3000 who died did so to benefit *'s plans.)

I disagree with how far it goes and how * wants to be even more controversial with subsequent acts.

As pointed out in F9/11 movie, congress people vote on bills all the time and rarely read the details. They probably read summaries or rely on someone they trust more familiar with the bills to tell them what it says.

The bills are long and very legalese. They just don't read them. I bet Kerry didn't know all the rights that we'd be losing in the act. But he is right when he says that it has been misapplied by this administration.

I think he's right on this issue....at this point in time.

He said something about "not letting the terrorists change the constitution."

Kerry supports the parts of the Patriot Act that help law enforcement communicate and work better in fighting terrorism, but has always said he disagrees with the parts that are abusive to civil rights.

Look, none of us like the Patriot Act but the fact is, we can't expect Kerry to go against it - you know what they'd do to him. They'd say he is against fighting terrorism. You know how it is. The sheeple are so damned stupid all they listen to is "he voted against it" and not the details. This is the country we live in. Most of these people don't deserve freedom. The sheeple are the ones who need to be thrown into Gitmo - they are the real threat to America.

it infringes on our civil liberties and those parts need to be changed.

kids in school how legislation is proposed, debated, haggled over, etc.? * is such a freaking idiot, he is asking me, an intelligent person, to believe that "legislation" consists of a one sentence statement ( I love Jeebus; I hate abortion; I am terrified of terrorists so vote for me) that lawmakers either agree or disagree on. Repukes are constantly adding self- serving clauses and provisions, which any true Patriot would abhor, and then claiming Dems "don't love Jeebus, "believe" in abortion, and wanna "hepp the terraists". I find Bush's simplistic crap INSULTING.


Mr. Bush, YOU are the only one who is simple. Most of us know that the Patriot Act, the Partial Birth Abortion Bill and the Parental Notification Bill had serious flaws. To say "if you don't vote for flawed legislation you are an atheistic, terror-loving abortionist" is more evidence that America is so dumbed down, even the President has no earthly clue.

he's not willing to stop to think that one of his proposals might have flaws.. as long as it gives his buddies more money then it's the right policy for america. everyone else is expected to suck it up and fit into his plan even though its screwing america up.

Clear as a bell.