Speak of the South...found straw poll, Nov. 2003, SC. Dean leading.

I was looking up some things on the DLC, and I found this poll by the South Carolina DLC done in November last year. It is a very interesting picture of the candidates and the demographics who supported them. Yes, it is a straw poll, but I saw so many from various areas just like this. He won all our straw polls as well.

I remember hearing how only Edwards had a chance there. I remember being told Dean would be a disaster there. NOT TRUE. I never saw this poll before. Most interesting. Be sure to look at #7.

I had come across this page will researching the DLC.
http://www.valuejudgment.org/archives/000275.html

Then I linked to the original poll and its details.
http://www.scdlc.org/content/special/presidential2003/survey/

We can NOT ignore the South. And yes there is hope for a New Englander there....he was polling better than Edwards in November.

None of our candidates was perfect, Dean was not perfect. And the Democratic candidate's campaign who PAID for the confederate flag demonstrations against Dean was not perfect either. Read Dean's book.

I am not reliving the primaries....I am looking to the future. I am tired of hearing that an intelligent passionate New Englander does not have a chance in the South. I am tired of hearing our party write off a whole demographic of society.

We have got to stop thinking in stereotypes.

I believe Dean would have done well in the south too, not necessarily win, but maybe get in the mid 40's in some of those states.

I am looking for the whole speech, as it was really quite excellent. But then a Southern candidate made fun of him, told him to quit telling Southerners how to act...that we did not need him in the South. (Yes, it was the one who lost both Carolinas.)

http://www.thenation.com/doc.mhtml%3Fi=20031201&s=jackson

Good read.

SNIP..."Historically, the Confederate flag is a symbol of the Democratic Party. Today, however, Republicans can fly and wave it, but Democrats can't talk about it--and current Democrats don't know how to handle it.

As a result, the symbol Howard Dean used got in the way of his substance, but his substance was on point--and the point was that Southern whites and blacks together must focus on their common economic needs: jobs, good schools, affordable healthcare...."

Guess what, I don't think we have heard the last of the Southern Strategy, Dean style.

outtasight.

Do you remember the cover of his book? IT had the Confederate flag on it -- and I'm trying to remember the book title, but it was very clear to me after seeing that (book cover and title) WHY Jackson Jr. supported Dean. He saw in Dean what so many of us did (Al Sharpton notwithstanding, not to mention John Edwards' cheap and code-worded trick during the debates), that Dean had the right formula AND vision for healing the separations and divisions.

It's times like this I have to remind myself of what Ted Rall, I think it was, put in his column: at least they didn't kill him.

They HAD to stop him, and stop him they did.

when one Democratic candidate paid for confederate flag demonstrations against another. I think someday Dean will say the name, but he is at least mentioning it now.

It was his grassroots funding, Eloriel. I am learning more about some of the ones who were coincidentally coming here to attack Dean all at the same time. Research is hard, though.

I think it was so coordinated.

People are just people. They believe in issues. It is our job to try to get them out there.

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He believes that Democrats really can engage Southern voters without jettisoning everything our party stands for. To be sure, there is a rightwing hardcore that we will never win over, but that doesn't include everyone in the South. Basic Democratic values are the right values, dammit, regardless of section. We just haven't a very good job of explaining them. As a result, we've kept giving ground in every election. Now I'm reading some threads proposing we totally write off the South. Becoming a deliberately regional party is a formula for extinction. Had he been the nominee, I believe that Dean really would have run a national campaign. Even if he didn't pick up a single Southern state, the presence of the national campaign helps down-ticket candidates who are the future leaders of our party.

Dean was just starting to get southern state campaigns set up before Iowa. He was making inroads.

I get angry when people write the South off. We are, after all, just people. The real extreme fundamentalists are in a minority.

and it proves Dean has appeal to moderates. He blew away the other candidates on ideas, with the exception of Wes Clark and John Edwards. Thank you so much for this link. I am saving a copy to show people who claim Dean doesn't appeal to moderates and DLC types.

to criticize the stupidity of the whole shenanigan of allowing the repubs to pick the democratic candidate.

We and the party owe him a lot for having a message that resonated with Millions who felt they had had enough from the 1st bush cabal..can you imagine what it's going to be like in 2008?

Whatever Dean does these next four years I'm glad it's going to be political and front and center for our Country so I can hear what he has to say next.

Thanks for keeping us informed, madfloridian!

The tide has to turn our way someday, just not today!

These authors have done books on Southern culture and noted how only Dean had at least acknowledged and tried to address the divide.

Personally I think Dean would have done okay in the South. I don't like the idea that the Party will once again dance to the GOP tune by running southerners like Mark Warner or DLCers like Evan Bayh. Doing that doesn't address the root problem. Just like choosing Kerry for the military part of his resume didn't work.

As Dean has said many times, when we choose candidates and issues just to win one election instead of standing on principles, the Democratic Party hurts itself.

I have seen posts here advocating writing off the South, and then in the next breath wanting to only run candidates from the South.

Actually, truth and clarity speak more loudly than pandering...us Southerners ain't no fools.

is how he got labeled a liberal. The only reasons I can think of are his stance on the Iraq war (he NEVER was a dove or anti-war) and his signing of the civil union bill in VT.

Yes he thought govt had a place in helping the less fortunate, but he is a fiscal conservative.

There were times I wondered why I supported him because he _wasn't_ all that liberal, and I figured out that I liked the way he spoke and because I believed him, precisely because he didn't pander.

If Dean runs again he needs to play up the fact that he paints his own house, and stuff like that. Maybe release some pictures of some of those family camping trips, etc. Dean is a real person as well as a politician and a physician. Oh, I also think Dean should stress more that he and his wife still make/made housecalls. There is a lot about Dean's personal life he could make known that rural folks could identify with, without playing the religion card so much.

Because despite what you may think, I find that we southern Democrats are actually quite similar to our northern counterparts. We just happen to be outnumbered locally by Republicans and the unpredictable Independents who supposedly decide elections.

is a very, very different proposition from Dean leading among the SC electorate. No Democrat has a chance in SC.