I still think Kerry ran away. Convince me I'm wrong.

Two weeks ago I posted a rant wherein I stated I thought Kerry to be a distraction and a ringer. Many posted replies agreeing with my opinion.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x2617973

Since returning I've been reading through the articles and posts here and other places, trying to find one single thing that would cause me to change my mind. So far I have not found such a beast. So now I turn to you. I hereby challenge you, the politically astute of DU, to point me toward one shred of real evidence Kerry is indeed still fighting the good fight. I beg you to point out to me exactly what he has done IN THE LIGHT OF DAY AND IN PUBLIC to convince me he's still working to conquer the fascism that was unleashed upon us when he made that phone call to the White House.

What has he said? What has he done? What is his team doing ON A PUBLIC LEVEL to ease the collective American Democratic Conscience? Where is he, day by day, that would let me know my country may still end up in competent hands on January 20?

And please don't bother with all that "solidarity" and "grow up" and "move on" crap. It's bogus, and it's not an answer to my question. I want specifics, and I won't be turned until I see them. Call me a cynic, call me an outsider, call me all the cool names I've seen others here labelled with over the last couple years. But don't call me naive, unintelligent, or on their side. I'm not. I've lived my life in freedom, and I want to know what's being done to preserve it, by those whom we entrusted to do so and then apparently tucked tail between legs.

Convince me.

Thank you.

So I guess he came back!:evilgrin:

Dear (CW),

I want to thank you personally for what you did in the election -- you rewrote the book on grassroots politics, taking control of campaigns away from big donors. No campaign will ever be the same.

You moved voters, helped hold George Bush accountable, and countered the attacks from big news organizations such as Fox, Sinclair Broadcasting, and conservative talk radio.

And your efforts count now more than ever. Despite the words of cooperation and moderate sounding promises, this administration is planning a right wing assault on values and ideals we hold most deeply. Healthy debate and diverse opinion are being eliminated from the State Department and CIA, and the cabinet is being remade to rubber stamp policies that will undermine Social Security, balloon the deficit, avoid real reforms in health care and education, weaken homeland security, and walk away from critical allies around the world.

Regardless of the outcome of this election, once all the votes are counted -- and they will be counted -- we will continue to challenge this administration. This is not a time for Democrats to retreat and accommodate extremists on critical principles -- it is a time to stand firm.

I will fight for a national standard for federal elections that has both transparency and accountability in our voting system. It's unacceptable in the United States that people still don't have full confidence in the integrity of the voting process.

I ask you to join me in this cause.

And we must fight not only against George Bush's extreme policies -- we must also uphold our own values. This is why on the first day Congress is in session next year, I will introduce a bill to provide every child in America with health insurance. And, with your help, that legislation will be accompanied by the support of hundreds of thousands of Americans.

There are more than eight million uninsured children in our nation.

That's eight million reasons for us to stay together and fight for a new direction. It is a disgrace that in the wealthiest nation on earth, eight million children go without health insurance.

Normally, a member of the Senate will first approach other senators and ask them to co-sponsor a bill before it is introduced -- instead, I am turning to you. Imagine the power of a bill co-sponsored by hundreds of thousands of Americans being presented on the floor of the United States Senate. You can make it happen. Sign our "Every Child Protected" pledge today and forward it to your family, friends, and neighbors:

http://johnkerry.com/EveryChild

This is the beginning of a second term effort to hold the Bush administration accountable and to stand up and fight for our principles and our values. They want you to disappear; they are counting on that. I'm confident you will prove them wrong, and you will rewrite history again.

Here is what I want you to know. I understand the strength, commitment, and passion that are at the core of what we built together -- and I am determined to make our collective energy and organization a force to be reckoned with in the weeks and months ahead.

Let's roll up our sleeves and get back to work for our country.

Thank you,

John Kerry

NGU.

He's just validated the second term of the regime. Nothing more.

"I hereby challenge you, the politically astute of DU, to point me toward one shred of real evidence Kerry is indeed still fighting the good fight. I beg you to point out to me exactly what he has done IN THE LIGHT OF DAY AND IN PUBLIC to convince me he's still working to conquer the fascism that was unleashed upon us when he made that phone call to the White House."

Isn't “we must fight not only against George Bush's extreme policies -- we must also uphold our own values” fighting the good fight? Isn’t “I am determined to make our collective energy and organization a force to be reckoned with in the weeks and months ahead” working to conquer fascism?

If you’re specifically referring to counting the votes - and that wasn't clear - I point to this passage: “Regardless of the outcome of this election, once all the votes are counted -- and they will be counted -- we will continue to challenge this administration.” I believe that there’s not much else Kerry can do, until we build the groundswell. But I do believe he’s with us.

FWIW, I’ve signed up to go to Ohio and help the Greens with the vote count. What are you doing to help?

NGU.

if he doesn't take a stand on that he is worthless

People may say there are more important issues, but if this distortion, and the people behind it are left untouched, then we deserve everything we get

and tied up their resources fighting it while his lawyers got subpoena power over every single White House thug who ever had anything to do with John O'Neill. It would have been instructive to see where their multimillion dollar advertising budget came from, too. Winning the suit was beside the point. Outing every one of those bastards as a liar and Bush front was the point. Tying up their resources was the point.

That he got and took wretched advice from a DLC hack who told him to ignore them and they'd go away should be the final nail in the DLC coffin, but it probably won't be. They'll continue to weaken candidates, remove important issues from discussion, and lose elections for some time to come.

Personally, I think Kerry caved because he realized the magnitude of the fraud, he finally realized the junkyard dogs he was up against, he was exhausted, and he realized that having Bush's bungling blamed on Democrats was probably not a great idea. I also suspect there may have been a credible threat against his family, but that's just suspicion on my part.

The fact is that we're probably stuck with Bush, no matter how much of the blatant fraud we are able to document. We'll just have to watch as all the smug Bush voters start to get suckerpunched by what's coming.

"That he got and took wretched advice from a DLC hack who told him to ignore them and they'd go away..."

Do they have political malpractice?

If the situation was reversed and Kerry had won the election in the manner Bush purportedly did, would the Republicans now be wiping their collective noses and subjecting themselves to endless rounds of self-criticism and hand wringing?

Or would they be howling with rage and dominating the news with claims of fraud and vote fixing?

Not even a whimper. Just a phone call.

Would have saved your typing fingers. I don't know the answer to that one, but I suspect that it was because he surmised it would have caused a very predictable but very nasty Radical RW shitstorm in their wholly-owned corporate media, and figured more could be accomplished without that. But that's just my guess.

And you didn't answer my question. What are you doing to help with the vote count?

NGU.

was not sated. But "Gore-ing" himself in public would not have been terribly effective, even if it would have been emotionally satisfying for you and some others.

Instead, it is at least possible that he's pulling a "Nixon" ala 1960. Now wouldn't that be ironic.

Yes, Kerry was a "ringer." Or, more precisely, he was a "stalking horse."

I know a lot of DU folks have a hard time grasping this, and I can certainly understand one's reluctance to admit to themselves that they've been played like a fiddle.

The bulk of what I've read on here is sheer projection about Kerry "working secretly" to undo what happened, and other fantasies. I guess a spinning top takes a while to run down.

But the facts fit. Kerry ran a seemingly good campaign, but in retrospect you see the stagecraft. No timely response to SBV? No contemporary response to the republican convention? An odd "response" to the last-minute OBL tape? Conceding before the votes were counted, only to completely disappear for two weeks so as not to upstage Bush?

The entire campaign on both sides was completely fabricated only to make it appear legitimate in the domestic press, who willingly played along. It has been this way ever since before the 2000 election. It's all theater now, just like in the old Soviet Union. The country is finished.

Yes, Kerry was "Reporting for duty." He just didn't say to whom he was reporting.

:crazy:

Spinning tops, huh?

NGU.

100% correct we were played.

It is one giant facade for the consumption of the masses.
How the fuck do we change this.

Instigator.

The floor's yours. Use it well.

That's a raving lunatic rant.

And you still haven't answered my question...

NGU.

Oh, please.

Damn, man, who's in denial here, and who's basing their opinions on at least SOME facts.

Got your back, ClassWarrior.

It's hard to accept, but don't allow yourself to be fooled again. I sure won't.

Very sad.

If we are projecting, or fantasizing, then show me some documentation that this is the sort of person John Kerry is. What book should I read? What article should I seek?

What have you read that tells you that John Kerry is the kind of person who would go along with this kind of bogus theater.

Because I've read several profiles, a few books (Tour of Duty, A New War, the Boston Globe book, for instance), plus profiles at Salon.com from before he announced, and in Newsweek before the DNC, and a few others that can still be found at my website link down below. I have to retool it for post-election, but several links are there for articles.

As for one of your examples, what do you mean "No contemporary response to the republican convention"? He popped out not five minutes after the damn thing ended at a midnight rally in Ohio. How much more contemporary did you want him to be?

Yours is the fanciful fabrication. We have nothing to accept, for those of us who support John Kerry are the ones who have carefully researched the man, and know he has integrity.

Plus, newbie, I suspect lately that people are coming onto this site to specifically discredit Kerry as a viable future candidate, because with his background as an investigator and whistleblower, he must scare the powers that be witless. Not gospel fact, just a suspicion.

he said the election was not over yet; or words to that effect.

I've lived my life in freedom, and I want to know what's being done to preserve it, by those whom we entrusted to do so and then apparently tucked tail between legs.

Why are you entrusting others to preserve your freedom? Is that our responsibility and not your own? (And before you say it... I, like John Kerry, served in that capacity already in the military. And I am a disabled veteran.)

So, what have you done since November 2nd?

Do you think you are the only one who felt abandoned, and how many people here did you reach out to comfort?

Have you donated to blackboxvoting.org?

Have you written to your Secretary of State's office (or local election board) about voting irregularities and expressed concern about the integrity of the votes?

Have you signed any of the petitions expressing concern about the vote?

Personally, I don't doubt that John Kerry is working behind the scenes trying to help secure our freedoms. I don't doubt his integrity now, just as I didn't before the election. I may be wrong, but if I am, so what? It doesn't change the fact that I watched this man fighting for all of us against all odds, against the swiftboat liars, against the Rovian tactics, against the media, against all those lies, and even against the "dividers" in our own party. I saw what I saw and I believe in what I believe in. Even if I stand alone, even if I am a minority of one, truth is still the truth.

John F. Kennedy once said: "Ask not what your country can do for you, ask instead what you can do for your country."

I am old enough to have heard those words. I acted on them.

Have you?

The state of OH would not have been as fully investigated because it would have had an onslaught of thousands of GOP attornies and the GOP preppie riots on its hands.

It would have looked like the little fascist army had been mobilized like when all the staffers advanced on Florida in 2000. We still would not known what was going on with the ballots and Bev would probably have been mugged more than one time or who knows what would have happened to her. No telling how many law suits they would have passed to seal all kinds of info from your an me and thwart all advances on the truth. Think about that one.........

Now things are being investigated calmly and thoroughly by US, after all, it is our responsibility to make sure OUR votes are counted and to hold OUR government accountable to us.

i guess he didn't want to waste his vote....haha
btw the entire bush phenomena is hinged upon time....getting minutes, hours then days/months/years to pass while the busheviks wait in horrified expectation (even the grossest repuke doesn't really believe they gonna get away with it) because they know the USA is not something to be fukked with. The best parallel i can recall is when hitler used the step by step challenge to move the nazis further to their goal of total power and dominion over the world...the seizure of bavaria state gov. in early days, the reichstag fire after they in power, the secret buildup of the military (which allies knew of but pussied around with) the occupation of the ruhr, the coup staged by nazis in austria, the conning of the czechs and finally the deal with stalin and then the invasion of poland (which finally triggered britain france reluctantly to declare war)...in each instance, especially the early ones, hitler 'held his breath' as he awaited the allies reaction...had the british or french activated a few hundred soldiers hitler would have been forced to back down and probably politically ruined, but as everyone knows the western powers did nada...when hitler sent german troops into the ruhr, which france had seized in reparation for 1st war, hitler was so pale and nervous he never slept, waiting anxiously with his generals while their fate was decided. The Busheviks are the same, in a way....they pull obvious stunts and wait, in fear and trembling, while the dems groan pitifully. It take alot more to stop them now then 2 or 3 years ago (remember how the busheviks won 3 mid term congressional races by exactly 18181 votes? someone screwed up bigtime, and the bushinc criminals must have shit themselves while daschle etc worried about how best to appease them!) and it will take even more if geeb is allowed to finish his time in office w/out opposition
tom daschle should be buried with a tape of screaming children playing 24/7 in his crypt