Teresa Heinz Kerry went back to Teresa Heinz?

Perhaps this was posted before, if so, I apologize, but what is going on? How transparent is this? She changed her last name JUST for the campaign? She changed it back a couple of months later? I am for a woman's right to chose her last name and maintaining her own identity, but Heinz....isn't that the name of her late husband? Why hold onto that and purposefly drop "Kerry", her present husband? Will she "pick it up again" if Kerry runs in 08'. I really like(d) Teresa "whatever her last name is today", but this really makes me think. WHY?

TIA.

http://washingtontimes.com/national/20050202-114925-8767r.htm

... "I just checked, and she no longer uses her last name; only during the campaign did she use Kerry," the council's Tamara Rodriguez Reichberg told Inside the Beltway upon our inquiry.

as a source? Please.

Do you not even care about credibility?

a wrong source to use on this board, that's for sure. but in all honesty WT does try to be a newspaper, as opposed to tabloid, they employ factcheckers, and they would not print an outright lie. They spin, but they only go that far, as opposed to rush or coulter who couldn't care less about facts.

...and rethink your conclusions. He used to write for them, and make no mistake, they print bald-faced lies, early and often.

Heck, I could even mail you my copy, if you want. It's worth the read.

i actually just read the book recently, and I do remember him saying towards the ending, when he started writing for 'serious publications', how incredible it was to have actual fact checkers. His stint at WT was pretty quick as opposed to his spectator job, which is what most of the book is about, and I remeber him writing about obvious conservative bias and about how reverend moom was a taboo subject of discussion, but i don't remember him referencing any obvious ridiculous lies like the one we are talking about:

the case in point, teresa either dropped Kerry after election or she didn't, it's not some argument about policy or statistics that can be spun, it either happened or it didn't, there are straightforward legal documents to either prove or disprove that. The news of her dropping her Kerry name after election has been in several newspapers and cable tv shows, it's not something that can be faked, and a serious news publication, no matter how conservatively slanted, is not going to publish a ridiculous lie like that unless they want to lose the rest of their credibility.

NT!

Honestly, I think it's time for DU Administration to put the kibosh on the WT as a source, once and for all.

I don't think she will be able to switch to Heinz-Kerry again.

I was channel surfing HONESTLY, when I caught him mentioning this. It was towards the end I think when he was making his "commentary", his comment was something to the effect (among many others) "talk about kicking a guy when he is down"

And apparently they aren't alone.

It starts at the Heritage Foundation.

I read it in an article somewhere. It's probably more palatable to the majority of people who'd find it kind of weird that she doesn't use his name. Even Hillary Clinton did it. I find it bizarre that people are so concerned about names.

even though her husband is no longer running for office.

clinton carries more name recognition than rodham.

Everyone would know who they were talking about.

haha :)

I think that has already happened, LOL!!

SUPREME COURT, she'd be Hillary Rodham, Attorney at Law, because that is what her law degree says.

What IS this shit about taking the man's name, anyway? WHY??? Why do voters demand it? It says more about this society's absurd (dis)regard for women than it does about the women themselves.

If Teresa wants to call herself Queen of the Damn May, she should be permitted to. Her identity as an American is wrapped up in her Heinz persona, her children are Heinz kids, she shouldn't have been BULLIED by ignorant assholes to fake it in the first place.

In Europe people don't do this, in many societies the woman keeps her name, and the kids take both. Why do people get so incensed over such a silly non-issue?

What is unusual is to take it and then later drop it. No one gives Diane Feinstein a hard time because she has not taken her second husband's name, instead using the name the name of her deceased first husband.

I remember reading a quote from Teresa that she was only adding Kerry because it would be less confusing during the campaign. I don't think she ever officially added Kerry. I got the impression that she always intended to drop it and go back to Heinz.

Personally, if John Kerry doesn't mind...neither do I.

I'll try to find some links.

with Teresa's decision(s)?

it really isn't my place to say anyway.

I can see Teresa's point about saving on confusion during the campaign. It would have been a little rough to constantly need to draw the connection between Teresa Heinz and John Kerry every time they were introduced together or talked about in the same sentence.

It's their life, either way.

n/t

I can understand that wholeheartedly, but when she chooses to keep her married name, then changes it and adds her new husbands name during a Presidential election, then shortly after the election, she drops her new husbands name retaining her dead husbands name/identity..well if nothing else, why not give the GOP more ammo if and when Kerry runs again AND Teresa picks up or drops the Kerry name for CAMPAIGN PURPOSES?

That seems like a pretty simple concept to me.

It's because of her sons most likely. It's her right to use whichever name suits her but it seems odd not to keep Kerry. I kept my maiden name and added my husband's last name because we too are family but it's an individual choice.

Does this mean she'll add Kerry back if he runs again in '08?

But Heinz is her deceased husband's name. That does seem strange. For instance, if Hillary had changed her name back to Hillary Rodham, it would be less of an issue.

her dead husband's name? WHO?

If we were talking face to face my comments would take about 2 minutes? How does that qualify as "obsession"?

Besides, if Kerry plans on running in 08', this is yet "another" bad move on their part.

I really don't think Theresa making her own choices in life is a BAD MOVE ON THEIR PART.

When political gain no longer existed, she reverted back to her dead husband's name. Choices based on what? I don't know about you, but when I got married I took my husbands name because I LOVED HIM, not because it would make some of the American voters happy! Taking someone's name (or not)should have more to do with marriage, family, commitment, NOT political gain -(or loss when Kerry didn't become President)

She took her husband's name in the campaign for the sake of simplicity...perhaps she doesn't feel she OWES the nation an explanation.

Who cares about what choices YOU made with your husband?

Again, your smear campaign over such a petty issue is humorous.

Is your reaction something like "If your not with us, your against us?"

Lively discussion is SUPPOSED to be part of the benefits of a Democratic society.

I don't care if Teresa drops both last names and calls herself TERESA, I just think that it was really STUPID to change her name to begin with only to change it again when Kerry didn't become President to again change it if Kerry runs again in 08', there is nothing simple about it. AND like it or not IT will draw attention to their intentions and will not be SO SIMPLE.

of crap about it...good idea ;-)

If you think that the discussion is so meaningless, why are you sticking around and being part of it? If it is so idiotic and counterproductive, then why contribute to it? The only reason why this thread is continueing is that there are people LIKE YOU responding to it and keeping it alive..... Thank you by the way!

make up crap, or run with crap so meaningless as this thereby giving a NON ISSUE credibility.

You're welcome.

and any one of those steps could end the marathon. Not that this would end the marathon, BUT stupid mistakes add up and eventually take their toll. This to me is a stupid mistake. It opens up some pretty funny monlogues or skits for SNL, Daily Show.... By itself, your right, it means next to nothing, but in this world where everything in examined, reexamined, exploited, rehashed, misrepresented - on and on and on things like this could end up tipping the scale in "personal opinion" on believeability. Hey, I could be wrong, wrong wrong, So far I am batting 1,000. I supported Wes Clark MISTAKE Dem. Nom., I supported Clark for VP, I supported John Kerry for President. So why should my opinion be worth anything? Kick me while I'm down.

and I think Monday morning quarterbacking when there was such a small gap of votes separating this election are not useful.

Again, I don't favor us taking THEIR propaganda and running with it.

I always thought that it had something to do with lies of some sort. As far as I know, this isn't a lie or is it? If it is than I apologize. If it isn't, well, it doesn't sit well with me and I think that it opens the door to unnecessary rhetoric.

I don't have anything against women who chose to change their last names, but I was older, had already built up a professional reputation and was known in the community by one name.

Teresa Heinz probably changed her name the first time for political reasons. John wasn't going to get elected to much in the '70s while married to a woman named Maria Teresa Thierstein Simoes-Ferreira.

But 30 years later, when she married Kerry in her 50s, after being known as an activist and philanthropist as Teresa Heinz for years, why would she change it?

apparently for POLITICAL reasons and not for personal, which is where I think that a mistake was made. IF your going to change your name for WHATEVER reason, change it and MEAN IT, not change it for politics and then change it back when politics aren't involved. Then.....in 08', what, change it again? That is the problem. For a few months it was O.K. to add Kerry to her name, now it isn't? Why not? Changing or not changing TO Kerry is no big deal, but REMOVING his name from hers?

She heads the Heinz Foundation and all her kids are named Heinz.

Only a 19th century moralist would show outrage over her decisions.
Or a rightwing propaganda spreader.

Great line!

Kept my brother's name, added a hyphen, then added her new husband's name. Tell me why anyone would do that?

Editing to add another example. A good friend, now married to the best man in our wedding, kept her first husband's name (they divorced). Her maiden name was very common, his was not, and she'd used it for years, and decided not to change it again.

She was married to my father for 20+ years, had 4 kids and was known professionally by his surname. She later married my step-father and uses his name only when she's with him "because it is easier". Most people still know her by her first husband's last name - a drunk who made her life a living hell so it was not out of attachment to him. His last name became her adult name and that is all there is to it. From what I've seen of their marriage, I doubt very much Kerry is diminished by that choice.

I found it rather curious. It's almost like she doesn't want to be associated with John Kerry either!!!!

Perhaps she likes having the same last name as her kids.

I have a friend who kept her married name from her 3rd husband when she married the 4th and 5th simply because she liked the sound of it. Didn't even like the 3 rd husband

It is definitely her choice. Feminism is all about choices. I have to admit, the whole naming thing is very hard. I kept my name when I got married, but we're having a hell of a time deciding what name to use for the kid, when we have one!

If your kids don't have the same last name as your husband, most people, especially principals, teachers, doctors will assume your husband is their step dad. This will likely cause him more than a few awkward moments. I think no matter what he says now, that would bother most men eventually.

Society is pretty used to moms keeping their maiden names or hyphenated names today, but if a dad doesn't have the same name as the kids, society will just assume he's not the biological dad.

Just .02 from a former schoolteacher.

Society was okay with woman not voting too. Kids can take their Mom's name, how bout that? Sheesh. The idea that I should change my identity so my husband "would be spared a few awkward moments" is ridiculous. I have been married twenty two years and there are idiots in my own family who said he would leave me because this was an insult to his masculinity. We both just laugh at such people. Some insiast on referring to me by his name. I don't answer them. I used to correct them especially on social correspondence . Now, I just cross them off my list!

My Mom doesn't seem to want to accept that I didn't change my name. Some of the mail she has sent me is addressed to me with my husband's surname. We have been married since 2000. It is VERY annoying!

Do you have kids? If so, what did you do about the naming situation?

My mother doesn't do that to me, but she DOES do it to one of my cousins! Go figure.

Our kids are hyphenated. It's a mouthful, but they don't seem to mind.

Another one would be to hyphenate the kid's name.

Why am I supposed to care?

You have better things to discuss than this, don't you? It makes you look as petty as the FAUX talking heads.

If Kerry runs in 08' THIS will be brought up and this WILL affect people's opinions on Kerry's character. When you are so thorough that you change - even the SMALL details - of your life, to apparently conform to what you believe society wants from you, then you obviously didn't leave the MAJOR things to chance either. Suggesting a Political Animal - in some of our worlds that means EVERYTHING.

Teresa is out to destroy her husband's political career. I guess cussing out journalist's wasn't enough. She's a trip.

And, I thought your post was going to be "Jesus, even after the campaign, everyone is out to destroy this woman. Leave her alone."

Well, I guess that is my post, now.

Honestly, I just believe (so shoot me) that this was yet ANOTHER oversight by the Democratic Strategists. Either let her remain Teresa Heinz or she changes to Teresa Heinz Kerry and STAYS there NO MATTER what the outcome of the election. SIMPLE

I'm behind Teresa's doing whatever the hell she chooses. It's HER name.

time though didn't they? When I said "let", I didn't mean it literally, of course Teresa could do whatever she wants to do and she seems as though she usually does.

And what about the many women who don't have the same names as their husbands? Does that reflect badly on them (us), or on their husbands?

I say it reflects well on his character--he doesn't tell his wife what to do. How refreshing!

this is NONE of our business. There are much bigger fish to fry! It would behoove us to let Joe and Chris know that we are much MORE CONCERNED about the STOLEN ELECTION, THE ENDLESS WAR IN IRAQ, THIS ADMINISTRATION DISRESPECTING AND VIOLATING LAWS, AG'S THAT CONDONE AND SUPPORT TORTURE, A SEC. OF STATE THAT IS A PROVEN LIAR, A GOVT. THAT VIRTUALLY SHUT DOWN THE STATE OF CALIFORNIA BY MANIPULATING ENERGY (not to mention what revenue California dumps into this country's economy), CROOKED, LYING GOVT. OFFICIALS, GLOBAL ISOLATION...the list goes on and on! Joe and Chris NOT covering these stories is quite telling! With all of the above mentioned, how important is Teresa Heinz and her choice of names? No offense to anyone here...just my thoughts!

American People. Those things were important in 04 to. What happened though? Did the American People even really take those things into consideration? The American People voted on much more superficial things than that. In order for them to vote those issues they would have to know about them first? Right? Do most American People even bother to learn about what is really going on? I don't think so. They judge a lot on superficial impressions and 30 second soundbite messages. That is what we have to learn to master. The IMPORTANT issues will not even be acknowledged until we can master the 30 second soundbite and to speak to the American people the way that they want us to speak to them. It comes down to a choice, do we want the American People to drink their Koolaide or ours? Right now that is the choice. Until we get some fairness in the media and control at least 50% of it and we learn to dumb down our message and APPEAR to be the strong likeable leaders that the American people now seem to choose, we are sunk.

What will JK and/or Teresa say when asked why she changed her name back AND will she change her name again if JK gets the Dem. Nomination? What will they say then when they change or not change Teresa's last name? Why even open the door for the question? THAT is what is stupid about the Dems.

she married John Heinz pretty young as was married to him for decades. There's no reason not to use that name if she wants.

She did pick up Kerry just for the campaign in an attempt to stop idiots from criticizing her husband over one stupid thing (when there were already so many stupid things to be criticizing him for).

Big deal.

She married Heinz as a young woman and they were married for many years. She still repects that. She added "Kerry" for the campaign because a lot of yahoos would snigger at the senator because his wife didn't adopt his name.

It's trivial. If Teresa and Kerry are OK with it, why should we care ?

Should it be Jackie Kennedy, Jackie Onassis, or Jackie Kennedy Onassis ?

...seriously, why is this of concern to you? And I'm really tiring of all the talk about 08 candidates. Let's get thru the next two years of BushCo and work on the midterms. WAY premature for us to be thinking 08. That's what got us in trouble for 04. The DNC "plan" for the 04 elections were decided in 2002, when much of the dem leadership was trying to kiss Bush ass real hard and sincere like. We don't know what the climate will be in 08, making decisions now would be counter-productive.

what you said.

to choosing future candidates. It is really hard to play catch up with the information rather than just keeping up with it. Besides, I have noticed many many threads that were pretty meaningless in my book, but I am not the only one writing am I?

Nothing wrong with long term planning but politics are fluid. Look at some of the names that came up this last election. Lieberman was no surprise, but who expected John Edwards to run or even be the VP candidate in 2001? Wesley Clark? Who foresaw Howard Dean being the front runner into the primaries in 2001?

In '08 some people are going to come into the fray that we did not see coming. Which is a good thing, nothing wrong with some new blood.

I agree. And Welcome to DU :)

at who rises to the top for '08. I can only hope that it will be a pleasant surprise. Maybe the disarray of the party right now is a good thing in the long run. Allows for some thinking outside the box.

Her first husband, the one she had her children with, will always be her only husband, spiritually. That or it has to do with her charities. Or a little of both. She loved her husband, I understand her having an identity in that.

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What kind of response is that?

I have Catholic aunties and uncles who are very much like Teresa. They get married for life. None of them remarried after their spouses died. If they did, I can see any one of them having a hard time letting go of their lifelong married name and seeing their second marriage as completely different than the 50 year first marriage.

The other poster was correct. Catholics remarry if a spouse dies like folks who practice other religions. (Of course there are those who don't remarry for various reasons.) I have two aunts, one cousin, and many older female friends (Catholic) who were widowed, remarried, and took their second husbands' last names. As a matter of fact, one was 80 when she remarried; she would not have considered keeping her first husband's name. It didn't diminish the love or the life any one of them had for their first husbands.

A strong family tradition thing. A Catholic thing. Certainly different people approach their marriages and second marriages differently, Catholic or not. But I can definitely see in Teresa the sacrament of marriage at play that she takes very seriously. John Heinz is her husband, in her mind. I would thing that the sacrament of marriage has something to do wth that. For her. Obviously every Catholic doesn't view these things the same way.

say what her motivation is to keep Heinz as her surname, can we? To paint a broad brush and say it's due to her being Catholic or luso-moçambicana is pretty short-sighted. It's not a typical Portuguese or Mozambican tradition any more than it's a typical Catholic tradition. It's obviously her personal preference.

I have to wonder. I mentioned that many Catholics, especially older ones, have a different sense of marriage. I never said it was typical Catholic tradition, because most Catholics really don't pay that much attention to what the sacrament of marriage means. I always had the sense that Teresa did have a deeper sense of her Catholicism than most Americans. I mentioned her foundation work too. Said her decision was probably a combination of things. Obviously that means it's her personal preference, based on any number of things.

In the first post you said Teresa's keeping her first husband's name was "probably a Catholic thing," which indicated that you believed it was a Catholic tradition. If that isn't what you meant, your intent was not clear.

Then you chided a poster who said it wasn't a Catholic thing, giving your family members as examples as people who didn't remarry and who would have had "a hard time letting go of their lifelong married name." I was merely addressing that issue (as opposed to her foundation/charity work) as it does not hold true for all older Catholics, American or Luso-Mozambican. (I have first-hand knowledge about Luso-Mozambicans.)

I chided the poster for a one line response that didn't say anything. And then added more info on how some Catholics view marriage.

Your first sentence does not say what I said in my first post at all because I didn't limit it to just her Catholicism. My intent was very clear. She has a different view of her marriage, probably because of her Catholicism. Her foundation work. Probably a combination of things. That's what I said.

Why aren't you proudly posting as Mrs. J. Worthington Chumley (or whatever)?

Most of us use pseudonyms here, for several reasons. But how can you criticize Teresa for using different names when you do the same?

My LEGAL name isn't cidliz, when choosing cidliz2004 it was recommended NOT TO USE your legal name. AND MORE TO THE POINT, I didn't take my husbands name for politics and THEN DROP IT WHEN THE RACE WAS OVER. THAT IS THE POINT!!!!!! WHY DID SHE DROP IT?????
Why change it to "Kerry" and then drop it a few months later? THAT is the question.

With so much else going wrong in the US, why are people wasting time fighting over silly things like Teresa's last name when there's so many other issues (which are far more important) that people should be expending their energies on?

I think it's time to get some priorities straight.

topics on this forum. There are topics that are less than important to, being a free country and all we all have a choice as to which thread we choose to respond to now don't we?

I was wondering the same thing.

A lot of women who use their preferred name legally--will simply use their husband's name informally if they are going to be in a situation where "traditionalists" will judge them harshly. I have seen this happen many times, especially with professional women. I'm sure that John was happy for her to borrow his name to make their lives easier while campaigning in places where people would become concerned with these superficialities. He obviously has NO problem with her name (or none that has made the tabloids). If she adopts or doesnt adopt his name again in 2008, nobody will base their vote on it. So what of it?

One billion Chinese wouldnt care either, as they do not have the name change custom. Name change in America is a preferential custom now, not signifying anything about loyalty or less affection in the relationship.

Both women and men should have the freedom to go with names that make them most comfortable at any time.

the Kerry name. Anyone familiar with Teresa knows that John Heinz was the love of her life.

Her children carry the Heinz name, so it makes perfect and logical sense for Teresa to keep that name.

This story is a lot about nothing!

As to Kerry's advisors, shame on them! They were so afraid to offend the "stay-at-home-and-bake-cookies" set that they felt into the typical sexist stereotype of what a candidate's wife should look and act like.

Shame on Kerry's advisor's for more BAD advice. The cookie bakers voted for the Stepford wife's husband anyway, right?

This campaign made lots of boo boos period.

It's no secret that the wimps that ran Kerry's campaign felt their balls were threatened by a strong woman like Teresa.

Sexism exists even among people that call themselves liberals, as is racism and homophobia.

Strong women intimidate most men. Thank goodness my husband just so happens to be stronger. (I wouldn't have it any other way) The campaign people wanted to put Teresa in a box with a nice ribbon wrapping it up. Boo hiss! She has now reverted to the name that she obviously prefers. Good for her. I wonder how JK feels about it though? I also wonder that if JK runs again in 08', will they try to tie Teresa up in another bow?

and I've been known to bake cookies. I also didn't vote for Chimpy McChimster either.

:hi:

It is probably out of respect for her first husband. He was her first love and Heinz was her last name for years and years. I don't like the media talking about it and trying to insinuate that she and John Kerry are having problems. Politically it is a little bit awkward though. If Kerry runs for president in 2008 is she going to refer to herself as Heinz-Kerry again?

It is awkward. Personally, I don't care what name she chooses, it is her choice. I just care about how it will be played out in the media if Kerry runs again in 08', will she again change her name or won't she? Either way, you said it..it is awkward...

to get upset and worried about something as trivial as this, whipped out of all proportion by the media.

If we really are going to make Liberal values strong again, this is the kind of "image" worry that we have to avoid. Just don't take the bait. Can't do anything about what the other side does with it, but don't let them disbalance us. Liberalism I think is a lot about tolerance. Tolerating differences, like name choices.

They should investigate if Smirky and Pickles are having maritial troubles with a war going on. How do they sleep at night with all the soldiers coming back in body bags?:grr: :mad:

and she was practically giddy speaking about her deceased husb. And when the convo changed to Kerry she would get almost agitated and would point out faults of his. I dunno just an observation.

or is he a golddigger for marrying Momma T, while Smirky earned his money wisely, according to his supporters.

to all of this commentary on her name. She pretty much is who she is, as she proved during the campaign.

P.S. If this is all the repugs have got to smear the Kerry's with, it's pretty lame.

i think she is hard on him and still very much in love with her previous husb. It seems he looks to her or affirmation.

Like i said it is just a observation.

No one supported JK more than I did and still do - but the woman just makes me cringe.

Everyone knows that there is genuine love and affection between her and John Kerry, but they also know that Teresa is too strong a woman to be put in the Pat Nixon mold, as some of Kerry's advisers wanted to do.

I think we need to take a critical look at our own views on women, and ask ourselves why we still want women in the subservient lapdog role when they are the spouses of political candidates.

These attacks on her make me very angry. They're uncalled for. Personally, I didn't find anything she did offensive. Her only offense was having a strong opinion. Oh, and some hated her "foreigness", a sentiment I found repulsive

Edited for my idiocy :)

:nopity:

You tell 'em.

I also am a Kerry supporter and have stayed so this through it all. I do find it interesting though that it is OK to criticize someone of another party OVER A DRESS but to make a personal observation that is not "along with the flow" guarantees an instant label of "REPUG".

I agree she had some mannerisms that i would not find attractive IN ANYONE! I have no issue with strength or individuality in women. And this was not what i found problematic with her. I do not think that woman need to be window dressing for their men but i also think they should EACH support the other. And as far as i know we are still all entitled to our opinion. ; )

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wives we usually have to watch. I'm sorry, but I am so sick of the stupid ass role that they put the 1st lady in. Clinton tried to break the mold, but there was such a backlash that she had to revert somewhat back to the traditional role. Teresa would have further broken the mold and it may have stayed a little more broken. Women have equal rights, but they still have to know their place in the WH. The tea room, women's groups and clothing designers.

because I think Hillary pretty much has the nomination wrapped up already.

we would all be calling Kerry President right now. IMHO

A muzzled Teresa = No more Bush

she's just like the rest of us women. It's a MAN's last name. Even if you use your mother's maiden name, it's still a MAN's last name. Women will never have their own last name. In some ways, we are still property.

it is no less my name than my husband's last name is his name. It was my father's also (just like his last name is his father's also), but I've certainly made it my own name.

And for the same reasons!

Kerry will never be a viable candidate. "Reporting for duty", indeed!!

This post is pretty "transparent" as far as I'm concerned.

As for Ms. Heinz, I don't really give a rip what she calls herself.

’Tis but thy name that is my enemy;
Thou art thyself though, not a Montague.
What’s Montague? it is nor hand, nor foot,
Nor arm, nor face, nor any other part
Belonging to a man. O! be some other name:
What’s in a name? that which we call a rose
By any other name would smell as sweet;'

Romeo and Juliet by William Shakespeare



Much to do about nothing! (imho) :shrug:

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With all that's going on in the world, it's troubling that some folks are so shallow.

Who gives a rat's ass what Teresa goes by in her last name...this shit is so fucking stupid to even waste time on.

She runs the Heinz Foundation, it's her business name. I doubt John Kerry cares one iota... why should you?

It not only looks "indecisive" but it also looks "disingenuous" to take the name of your present husband "just for politics". Excuse me but credibility does have some value with some of us. Even the "small" things like changing your name for the sake of politics.

and it's evident that you are using this to perpetuate the RW rumor mill and bash THK, not to counter it.

THK did not "change her name" for the sake of politics! Maybe you just have a little THK envy!

And speaking of disingenuous... please take a look in the mirror!

name. I am one of those who is proud of my own name' and accomplishments and wishes to be known for who I am. I refuse to answer to "Mrs." Anybody. Not to offend anyone , but I think the woman having to take the man's name is demeaning. Why shouldn't he take hers? it has been done. I have several friends who have also retained their names. I think Theresa is just more of herself as Heinz! She established her identity as Heinz ,and doesn't want to be a "Mrs." Anything. I don't think she wants to be a reflection of John. I also don't think the Heinz is because she is still devoted to her late husband. It is just her name. I don't believe she ever did change her name. Not legally anyway. And I think she won't have to attach Kerry to her name again even if he runs,as everyone now knows they are married. BTW , I have interviewed Theresa and met her several times and I think she is one of the neatest people I have ever met. I think she is a tremendous asset to any campaign, and someone who didn't like her was probably not a real Kerry supporter to begin with. She is also one of the smartest people I have ever met. Greenspan should let Theresa run the Fed. I am dead serious.

I really like Teresa as well, in fact she has more gumption that JK, and was more the type of candidate that I wished he were. She would have been a splendid 1st lady. She would have broke the mold much as Hillary did, but in a different way. I just feel badly that she changed her name back and it appears as though the name change to begin with was just for "looks". Teresa doesn't strike as that kind of person AT ALL. Just the contrary, she strikes me as "I am who I am and you can take it or leave it"

If and when I change my name I do it with great thought, so much so that when we had the opportunity to change our names on DU, I thought about it for a second and decided that it is "cidliz2004" that I am, even if 2004 was a disappointment. maybe i am just placing value on my name more so, than others. My name is how I am identified, that is why I cannot and won't change it at a drop of a hat and maybe that is why I feel somewhat insulted by the "flipness" of name taking and dropping.

And I'm amazed that we continue to have discussions (not just here, but in the world at large) about the temerity of a woman using the last name she chooses.

I don't know her reasons for wanting to be Heinz instead of her maiden name -- they really matter only to her. (Perhaps b/c that's the name her children have?)

But it made me uncomfortable to watch her become Heinz Kerry just for the campaign. I guess we're really still so backward that this is a big deal. Sad.

I still get guff from the strangest places about my name -- receptionists and the like. It's 2005 for heaven's sake -- this should be a radical thing to do?

My children carry my last name and my husband's. Yes, his is their official last name, but they understand they're also XXXs as well. Doesn't faze them in the least that mom has her own last name. Don't know why in the world it should be of concern to anyone else!

Nobody's business.

Thank you for this very astute point. And you know what Teresa would say the same damn thing! What she does with her name is nobody's business.

She did not legally change her name and then change it back.

Further more this whole ridiculous discussion is stemed from the Moonie rag - the Washington Times. It hearsay from a Repub rag.

In both the Boston Globe and the Boston Herald today she was called Heinz Kerry, I don't think this is worthy of a discussion. It's a disingenuous conversation about a truly great woman.

here is to realize what spin is going on in the RW media very quickly so that we can counter it. If they are working on Teresa this soon, it tells us something.

At least by this discussion we can identify the nature and direction of the smear.
This kind of wimpy "she shouldnt have done it" is what we (Dem wing of the Dem party) have GOT to STOP doing. We need to just say, "whatever" to this kind of BS. Don't be intimidated.

This whole discussion can aid in future attacks PERIOD.

The best defense is a good offense. Good strategy is being proactive NOT reactive.

So all your snide coments about this are really just test runs of what the Repubs will say and how to counter them? :eyes: OH PLEASE!

I believe what I said what straight forward. I said what I meant and I meant what I said. Too bad people cannot handle honest and legitimate opinions. Too bad people have to put a label on anything that they don't like hearing, something like what the Republicans do. I keep forgetting that even though this is a DEMOCRATIC forum, there are still many people claiming to be Democrats as long as they hear everything that they want to hear. Dissent and honest discussions seem to really rub some people the wrong way. Like you for instance. I don't think it is politically SMART to change your last name to your husbands for an election and then 3 months after the election, you change it back. I think it is stupid because if you don't want to change your name then don't pure and simple. Don't play politics with such stupid things like that. It appears PHONEY and MANIPULATIVE. "I'm Tersa Heinz Kerry while he is running for President, other wise I'm Teresa Heinz" Be who you are and don't try to be something else.

Yes, it is a small miniscule thing and I simply made a comment about it and participated in the discussion that followed. Evidently there are some people that would like to be able to control what is and isn't talked about, so much for free speech. If you don't like the comments so sorry, but that is how I feel about it and I am not being snide, you are.

that by bringing the issue here you find some strength to put up a "good offense" about this kind of thing in the future. It's very clear you have an overly anxious reaction to right wing innuendoes about what Teresa calls herself. Try not to let them hijack your emotions like that.

From the reactions here you didn't present your concerns in a constructive way. The topic is OK, as it tangentially pertains to the election spin machine, but you argued the RW Republican line. Whddya expect?

But I DO think this discussion gives us a chance to renew our determination, that IF and WHEN they keep up this garbage, we meet it head-on.

So have you written to the networks objecting yet?? Or suggested that others follow your lead in that? It would be a good way to launch a better proactive strategy. Let us know what your letter says, and we will be supportive.

...supposed issue. Why is this so important to you? What are you really trying to achieve?

Your claims about this non-issue giving Republicans ammunition against John Kerry in 2008 are hollow. This is not a real issue. You are trying to make it one. Stop it.

Let it be 'important' to someone, Wrinkle-in-time. Let people express their opinions. Your advice to 'stop it' is anti-democratic, IMO.

cares what name Theresa Heinz uses?? Get over it!

Laura Bush has recently announced she wants to be called "Mrs. Laura Bush." I guess that means she's married to Laura Bush.

Mods lock this "E" Entertainment bullshit thread.

Why do we need to stop?

Let this thread die, or live, based on posters' interest, instead of an attempt to stifle comments.

otherwise known as "the moderated board."

Actually, the alert button is a better option than calling for the thread to be deleted in the middle of the thing. But then, it sort of has to violate board rules, which I don't know if this one has yet. If it degenerates into flame wars or is seen as flame bait, it might just go byebye. But "thou shalt not post a dorky thread" doesn't seem to be one of the commandments.

- but not a smart political move. It merely added fuel to the fire, as demonstrated here. Should Kerry run again, the name change and re-change will be touted as a "spousal flip-flop" or something similar.

Her actual mistake was changing her name the first time.

They managed to make Kerry's Vietnam service a liability. We really love getting previews of the Right Wing Talking Points here.

By the way--the first time she changed her name was when she became Mrs. Heinz. You're saying this was a mistake?

:eyes:

- is it possible that Theresa herself isn't aware of how this will be perceived? I doubt it, she's too smart not to know.

BTW - in my saying her first mistake was changing her name the first time, I was referring to when she changed her name prior to the election, adding the "Kerry". I have a feeling she was pressured to do that. Society is used to women having a different surname than their spouse and NOT changing it in the first place would not have been nearly as damaging as changing it back now.

back...???

It's her name, her choice, and her life. I'm puzzled as to why anyone could possibly care. I'm sure she would wonder, too, for a split second, before she told y'all to kiss her ass.

Jeebus, stuff like this :eyes:

and probably just as accurate. Oops, check-out time.

This AM on C-Span there was a question regarding Democrats as to whether we are digging a bigger hole!!

I was very upset by some of the Dems and their answers to the question... a lot of them saying that we need to "change" and get with the mainstream.

For me, that IS NOT where I want to go. I'm appalled to think that the Super Bowl is being used to PUSH a Religious Agenda. There is a group who will be there standing up for the Religious Right. If this is MAINSTREAM, I'm sorry... just opt me out!!! Whether I'm Christian or not does not mean I should be "infiltrating" every sector of American life!

I don't care if Teresa changed her name back and I don't think it matters very much over all. I don't think Kerry will ever be nominated again, even though I personally care a lot about him. He should just save his money. From all the negative chatter here, I doubt he'll even get re-elected as SENATOR!

But for us to beat this to death seems to show how split we are. I don't see where this discussion is helpful. To some degree, and I've said this before... a lot of POLITICS is simply CYCLICAL!! It's just that the media is so mealy mouthed and many of our Democratic Leaders seem to have rolled over and are playing dead! My own Senator Bill Nelson is one of them. I won't ever vote for him again. Florida has gone to the dogs anyway!

The bubble will burst, but it will only do so if we keep focused on what really matters. When those "red-staters" can't pay their bills or put food on the table, they may not UNDERSTAND what happened or may be in denial, but facts are facts... and some will see the LIGHT!

And even though I like Howard Dean and support him to head the DNC... just watch what the MEDIA does to him!!

to go down in flames until we stop this crap. Get a real cause and stick to it.

After the pressures of the campaign, it must be a relief to go back to being who you really are.

I thought she was angry at the treatment of some in the prior elections. What was that story again?

If she was a Republican, she's not Bush's kind of Republican. She was a "Republican for Kerry" probably old-school Republican, or was just Republican because of her first husband. I dunno what her reasons were. But I suspect that she's not Bush's kind of Republican, which means the party has likely been poisoned by their kind in her eyes.

Should be interesting to see what she does.

Unless you were intending to be sarcastic.

She changed registration for two reasons, and she's discussed them in public forums. Reason number one was the direction the party had taken; she could no longer support their ideals. Reason number two was to vote for her husband.

This probably rates as one of the meanest threads I've seen this week!

The right will now plaster not only Kerry but also Teresa as a flip flopper.

What the hell. Who can run for prez anymore when anything you do, anything at all, esp the most inconsequential stuff that is no business of anyone else, becomes something that can "ruin" a person.

Really though, I think you're attaching way too much importance to this issue. This is Teresa's way of honoring her first husband. And really, is there much else they can do to smear her? Poor thing is already mostly hated by the right. I think she's a sweetie, myself.

...who will not be pushed around. Who knows her own mind. Who is charitable, and has done a fantastic job of raising good kids, who could have turned out terribly what with all that cash in the family.

Of course, a woman who doesn't take orders from, and submit to, her husband is a danger to some neanderthals in this society. We've a long way to go, I am afraid...

I really like her and I hope that we get to see more of her. She seems to be a gutsy straigtforward person. More European personality than American, where everything has to be "politically correct" so that you don't offend someone.

that English was not her first language. Things came out of her mouth somewhat oddly at times, but I think she really meant well.

I read an article that talked about Teresa, her first husband, how she still refers to her dead husband as the love of her life and as "her husband" even when John is around.

But the same article had Teresa and John during the interview, with John trying to wander around the question, and Teresa looking him right in the eye to get the straight answer. I really liked that.

And her kids credit Kerry with "putting the family back together" after their father died. That's quite a tribute. But, no, she's not over her first husband's death. And why should that be any business of anyone's but hers?

A) This is a sexist, mysognyistic, paternalistic, puritanical country.

B)She never changed her name to Teresa Kerry. She went by the name so the dumb fuck stupid sexist Americans could figure out who was her husband. They can't understand big concepts like keeping your maiden name, or even more shocking I guess, keeping the name of the man you loved and married and had children with that had died. I believe she kept the name Heinz for sentimental reasons. I guess that means her marriage to Kerry is all a ruse or whatever you are implying because she didn't change her name.

C) Now that she no longer needs to be identified as the "property of John Kerry" to make the Americans feel safe and unthreatened (imagine if they just lived in sin or something-how could we elect such vileness for our holy office of presidency?)

D) I understand only because yes I kept my maiden name. It's confusing if I make a hotel reservation as my husband gets called Mr. Wife's maiden name. People make the assumuption that I have the same last name as my husband-his relatives and mine. They never even ASKED. Because it's what EVERYONE DOES. So if you don't do it...my GOD what does it all mean?? It's suspect at best.

E) Yeah, I'm a feminist and I got married late. Also, it still feels like a weird concept to change your name to his name.

F) Transparent? Why don't you stop mincing words and call her a fake (what exactly I'm not sure-maybe she was just a stunt wife) or a Republican or an opportunist or whatever it is that you really mean.

G)This reminds me again why America is a stupid country. This is not what matters. What matters is not our name but what we DO and what we suuport. Big period.

like changing your name for an election (even if not officially)

If dumb assholes cannot accept what her name is then screw them! They wouldn't have voted for Kerry anyway! Why pander to dumb asses? It looks pathetic. If people don't understand that Teresa Heinz retained her name for whatever reason, too bad! It is just another example of the Democrats being reactive instead of proactive.

...she was introduced by Kam Kerry as Teresa Heinz Kerry. Or was it Teresa Heinz? It was pretty raucous, I couldn't tell.

That's all this is about!

An enormous reeking pile of disinformation.

As if it mattered what name the lady chooses to use.

And these warnings that the Right will use it against Kerry if he runs again--the Right will use ANYTHING against its enemies. They used his honorable service in Vietnam & his honorable opposition to the war against him.

What's interesting is that they are still attempting to diminish Kerry. Likely they fear that he can still be a coherent Democratic voice.

Looked at objectively, they really couldn't find any real mud to throw at Kerry.
- His service was commendable and honorable - they distorted easily pr oven facts (length of service) and concocted a fiction that would lead you to believe that an aloof, unlikable 25 yr old tricked his entire chain of command to get his silver star which was then given to him in front of everyone else involved. No one bothered to question the account at the time even though they were involved and presumably knew he didn't deserve it, then he fooled them again to get his bronze star.

- His anti-war activities definitely should have been put into perspective. Kerry's anti-war effort was as a veteran for his fellow soldiers. More should have been explained especially the amount of advocacy and work done for the veterans who were being ill-treated by the government when they returned. (support the troops?)

At a time where on campuses there was talk of revolution, Kerry, advocating working through the political system, led a march to appeal to the government and talked to Congress. The q&A part of the 1971 testimony was in some ways more impressive than the more public speech. The respect and compliments given to him by the Senators and the fact that the Nixon tapes show he scared them not as a dangerous radical, but because as a clean cut, articulate antiwar spokesman he could tip the balance of public opinion by winning over people uncomfortable by the more strident antiwar movement centered in the campuses.

In 2004, the only liability is that the US is in an unusually war like time period.

- he simultaneously flip-flops and has the most liberal record in the Senate. Standard meaningless (incompatible) charges.

- His wife doesn't want his last name. (Obviously pushing to imply even she doesn't really love him. - an obnoxious charge - I dislike GWB but would find an article saying he and Laura have a sham marriage inappropriate and frankly uninteresting. I don't think it's any of my business.)

So, what's the point. Kerry has had an unusually long public life with no major obvious scandals. Whatever his faults as a candidate, he is an honorable, decent person committed to serving his country. All the same he was viciously smeared by the RW. Somehow in the next four years, Democrats need to turn the RW use of smears into a negative for them. Kerry's motivation for talking about going after the SBVT now may just be to defend his own honor, but the combination of debunking the lies and showing their motives and connections to the Republicans could help when they try the same stuff in 2006 and 2008.

don't get it at ALL - especially the ones who do it and consider themselves FEMINISTS

I married when I was 34, having worked for 13 years. I changed my name for a simple reason - we planned to have kids. I was uncomfortabe with the idea that my kids and husband would have one name and I would be the outsider with another. When I married, I like my mom before me, took my maiden name as my middle name. Having kids was my major motivation even though I was overwhelmingly happy to be getting married to my husband.

Without any real thought, I used my new name at work as well. I quickly realyzed though that I needed to put my full name (including my maiden name) on every note, letter,or memo that I wrote. Without it, all my history and reputation was invisible to the recipients. The alternative of using 2 seperate names (one public, one private) seemed to have greater drawbacks.

As far as Teresa goes, I believe (from memory of looking at it pre-election) the Heinz foundation website had her name as Teresa Heinz and in the biography said she was the wife of John Kerry. As she is very well known in her own right and clearly never legally changed her name, there's really no story. This seems to be simply a story to hurt both Kerry and Teresa.