The more ya'll bash, hate on, slam, and trash Kerry...

the more I appreciate him and his post election efforts. No he wasn't perfect and mistakes were made, but his is doing his job. eom

:evilgrin: :hi:

I'll support him, unconditionally. I just feel as if he's not being tough or vocal enough in his attacks on Bushco.

... the press doesn't cover what he says because he says nothing worthy of coverage.

"baggage we cannot afford". This is what passes for tough talk by JK. While his opponents are calling him a liar and a fraud, his retort is lame.

You can spin till you are blue in the face but you'll never convince me that Kerry has the killer instinct required to win a battle with today's Republican party, and as such he is useless as a presidential candidate.

... more effective slams on the adminstration since he was elected to the DNC chair than Kerry has in his entire career.

The press never gives a lot of airtime to party chairmen, how much of Terry MacAuliffe did you see?

Kerry is just too nice a guy to be president. It is that simple. And his tortured speaking style just does not connect with the average American. If Americans were as smart as they should be, perhaps he'd do better, but as it is the Reps have perfected the art of the one-liner and Kerry cannot issue a thought in less than 10.

Dean got roasted by the media. He would have lost in a landslide. You just haven't been paying attention, Kerry has been after Smirky for a while. Too much FOX news huh? :grr:

... that Dean would have done better in the election - you simply pulled that out of your ass.

I have merely said that JK is too goddamned much the stereotype of the New England liberal to get elected president in this country.

He is too genteel, too reserved and too measured to take on the Bushistas. Had he done something as simple and obvious as take on the SBVT bullshit with some outrage, he might have won.

But no. He didn't do that and after the election was over he chose to roll over rather than risk his precious second chance.

A second chance that I don't think he deserves. You think what you want but I'm entitled to my opinion and I justify it better than most people here do.

What a fucking joke.

All I've heard about is Dean talking up pro-life Dems to LOCAL press.

Meanwhile Kerry went head-to-head with Russert on Meet the Press Jan. 30 to refute the SBVT crap one more time and say about Social Security that "Bush is hyping a phony crisis."

No comparison. Kerry deserved to be the candidate in '04 and deserves to be the candidate in '08.

Kerry had his chance. This isn't the 1950's and 60's in which a person gets multiple chances to run for the presidency (like Adlai Stevenson and Richard Nixon). Party leaders may like to try to give him another chance but the "American Democratic Street" (i.e., the average jane/joe voter) wants a fresh face. Regardless of the political machine Kerry builds, he will not get enough support from average voters to get the nomination.

Kerry reached the people, the counting was rigged, this is fact, accept it, unless you think bush deserves the benifit of the doubt! Now.. did Kerry do what we think was right.. no.. do we know what would have happened had he done what we wanted.. no... is he still in the fight on our side.. yes!

... Kerry was not willing to fight or contest the election in any way. It's not as if the shenannigans in Ohio were unanticipated.

It is as simple as this for me - Kerry dropped the touchdown pass because he was afraid of a hard block. Why would I throw him another ball?

does not mean he is doing nothing. As I said, we both wanted him to fight this more directly, but perhaps he knows things we dont... I will wait and see what he does, Kerry broke the Iran Contra scandal too, but it took years of research and fact gatherering. So if he works hard for a few years and does some election fraud exposure I'll consider him for president, but no matter what he does, he's on our team!

attacking each other wont help.. and even the best recievers drop a pass, you dont trade right away!

and i was not even aware of this. I beleive Kerry has things
in progress that he really doesnt want out until due time.

There are only a relative few who believe otherwise (a good percentage of whom congregate here). Kerry, like Gore, will not get another chance of being nominated.

I understand Kerry's need to keep his name in front of the Democratic activists who monitor this site but I do not believe that it will work. I just cannot imagine that the party will give him another chance. There are too many other good choices rather than somebody who has already "lost".

Three million vote deficit nationwide. There's no proof any planned malfeasance cost Kerry the election--just a lot of questions and theories linking circumstantial evidence. That's barely enough for a conspiracy theory, and unfortunately really isn't enough to counteract the legitimacy a declared and conceded victory gives. Just because I don't like Bush doesn't at all mean I have to believe that despite all evidence, Kerry won.

There is plenty of evidence the election wasn't legitimate. There is also most likely plenty more that we may never have access to, since diebold, et al are owned by repub backers. Why have they thwarted every effort made to prove the election was honest? If there was nothing to hide, wouldn't you think they'd be somewhat willing to cooperate? Makes sense to me.

The shrub's current approval ratings, his ratings prior to being "re-elected", exit poll results, as well as all this "circumstantial evidence", all point to the fact that it is very unlikely he should have won the election. You certainly don't have to believe Kerry won. This is america - you can believe anything you want, mostly.

I'm not a conspiracy theorist at heart - at least I wasn't until the current regime starting tearing apart our democracy. The main thing I have learned about them is that they will stop at NOTHING to get what they want. They are thieves, criminals, bullies, liars. I'm open to just about any "conspiracy theory" about this particular bunch of people.

I believe Kerry won. I will never believe he didn't. If it HAD been a fair election, I'm pretty sure those who were trying to find out would not have been stonewalled at every turn. And those "trade secrets" of diebold sure don't make me feel any better about it, either.

Declared and conceded victory doesn't mean election fraud didn't take place. It maybe means election fraud can't be proven, but that's about it. I don't trust criminals and liars to tell me an election was honest. Matter of fact, I don't trust ANYTHING they say. Gore DID win, you know.

times a week! And Kerry has been slamming back effectively and he definitely proved he can answer succinctly in the debates. I am disappointed that Howard is going back to his moderate DLC roots. His openly courting the pro-life anti choice vote is not going over well with me. I hope I don't end up regretting my support of him for chair !I wanted a liberal. I knew he really wasn't a liberal and never has been but I thought he would play one on TV! :)

He is going to soften the gap between the LARGEST issue seperating many left and right leaning voters. Many religious, southern voters have very liberal ideals and values, but vote republican because of this ONE ISSUE ALONE! Many feel they are not welcome to thier pro-life views in the Democratic Party. We preach tolerance, but are just as intolerant to issues we don't agree with. To not include pro-lifers to come to the table and express thier views within the party only alienates them further and further seperates this country. We cannot become the pot calling the kettle black. I applaud his effort to bridge the gap. I applaud his efforts to reach deep into Repug territory and rallying the existing Dems, as well as trying to reach out to others. It's that close-mindedness that has helped to hold our party stagnant while the Repugs grow at alarming rates.

like Civil Rights and Gay Rights. Lets throw those out the window too,the South doesn't appreciate those values. The South also wants more emphasis on religon so lets murk up the line between Church and State. Tom Delay says there isn't a line between them anyway.
Maybe we should just stand for nothing. That way no one can condemn our "values". We have just caved On the Bakruptsy Bill. So we no longer support working people, and protect millionaires. Hey , the south loves Social Security. We can protect that. We can be a one issue party!

some cross-over votes and get the pro lifers off our back.
I think it makes good politics. It by no means he/we are against abortion.

He kicks ass...just ask the battered Bush after the debates...

That's why they try to hide from Kerry

Get on board to kick some ass!!!!!!!


http://www.johnkerry.com/petition/kidsfirst.php?source=500

I got his back anywhere anytime!!!!!!!!!

Remember those pledge pages that donated money to Planned Parenthood or whatever for every raving anti-abortion protester that showed up at some clinic, etc?

It'd be great to have a site that gave, say, a dollar to Kerry's PAC for every petty, vindictive, mean-spirited anti-Kerry post that pops up here ($5 if Skull & Bones is mentioned). :evilgrin:

where it will help the party, not the man.

I already support both, thanks.

But for those of us inclined to get annoyed when the same old anti-Kerry tripe (and I don't mean just flaws in his campaign or whatever--I'm talking about the grudge-laden overemotional kneejerky spew) comes up again and again, I was just tossing around some lemonade reciples. :shrug:

a nickle a swear, a quarter for every "fuck"... ahem... or something like that.

I would easily vote for him again, he and all the democrats need us to stick together as we desire they do as well.

:kick:

That sounds like it deserves a thread of it's own.

They're nothing more than a vocal minority within the party. Remember the primaries around here? Virtually everyone was for Dean or Clark, but when the votes were counted Kerry took almost every state.

And the defeated Deaniacs/Clarkies blamed it all on a vast conspiracy, as usual. :eyes:

on this subject. So what point is being served by calling those who believe that Kerry did indeed run a mediocre campaign as "nuts" in a "vocal minority?" That is unless the poster is actively trying to stir up shit, and I'm sure that would never happen. :eyes:

I believe in the truth period.

your entitled to yours just as we are to ours. But trying to discredit people who don't share your views is very intolerant and not what this party is about. We can agree to disagree.

I've seen thread after thread by the same poster on the same issue. I'm not quite sure how many threads it will take until everyone is on the same page as the poster...

;)

:hi:

Because clearly, it's all your fault. You are a conspiracy of one.
/sarcasm

This from one of your "defeated Deanaics." Wait...how were we defeated?

Oh yes. Dean now runs the party. What a loser! :)

Except for his "win" in Vermont following his withdrawal from the race.

And Dean's "win" in the race for DNC chair is hardly anything to celebrate. The only reason he prevailed is because (1) no serious politician wanted the thankless task of running a demoralized party that just got thrashed and (2) nobody had even heard of the other guys running. Tim who? Donny who?

My guess is that Dean's reign as DNC chair will come crashing down as soon as he makes another idiotic gaffe like the one he made about black Republicans; that gaffe -- and the infamous scream --illustrates why the vast, vast majority of the American people consider him unfit for the presidency.

He is the chair now. Wish him the best and lend him your support. Please.

He doesn't have to worry about constituents or reelection, just taking down the Bush administration, and he's ducking interviews like he was Gretta Garbo.

He let the Gannon story die without a word and he still hasn't gone on TV to denounce Social Security reform the way Kerry and Kennedy did a month ago.

Sorry, there's no acceptable excuse for that kind of negligence.

that if he were on TV denouncing Social Security, he'd be getting bashed as a camera hog.

Better yet trust marcologic. Heck I haven't been wrong yet! :)

Not because Dean has, or has not beenon TV, but because you set this arbitrary "standard" for Dean that is just silly, then claim he's failing because he does not meet your standard.

Actually, Dean has been all over the issue, which is the true measure use of his position, and whether he's had his face plastered on a TV screen really doesn't matter at all.

Trust you? marcologico, you've got an anti-Dean bias. Yeah sometimes you say nice things about Dean, but I think it is all just window dressing. You attack him more often than not. At the very least, you don't know HOW you feel about Dean.

Why should anyone trust that?

And I'm talking about Gannongate.

but we WERE speaking about Social Security.

Nice Dodge!

Perhaps you should change your nic to marco-dodge-ico?

to answer Mehlman's lies on national news programs?

http://www.forbes.com/business/healthcare/feeds/ap/2005/03/02/ap1857226.html

(excerpt)
Associated Press
Dean Meets With AFL-CIO Leaders in Vegas
03.02.2005, 05:56 AM

Democratic Party head Howard Dean met with top union leaders to plot a campaign to thwart President Bush's Social Security reform plan.

"The fate of the Democratic Party and the fate of labor are intertwined," Dean said Tuesday after the meeting. "It's in both of our interests to work together, and that's what we're going to do."

The closed-door meeting between Dean and the AFL-CIO's Executive Council came even as two unions are threatening to break from the organization over the direction of the labor movement.

The AFL-CIO plans a massive campaign against privatization of Social Security, hoping to defeat the proposal and boost the union's political strength in future elections.

to tell them how to organize the AFL-CIO. In other words so what, he drove by a convention that was happening anyway.

real leadership.

on real issues from Dean. Whistlestopping through red states without (a) supporting specific candidates or (b) slamming SS reform at every opportunity is not a priority.

Sorry he's not addressing your pet issue.

Edited to add: But he's there for the party, not for you alone, and no amount of whining will change that.

Take Action to Protect Social Security

Democrats in Congress are unified in the fight to protect Social Security, and you can help them by letting them know you are standing behind them. Sign our petition to let Harry Reid, Nancy Pelosi, and all the Democrats in Congress know that they have your support in the fight to stop President Bush's risky plan to privatize Social Security.

Sign the petition...
___________________________________

DNC Launches New Radio Ads to Air During Bush Social Security Tour

The Democratic National Committee has recently released six 60-second radio ads titled "Cuts" and "Heartland." The ads aired on local radio stations in media markets President George W. Bush visited to promote his Social Security privatization plan.

Listen to the ads...
Read more about "Heartland"...
Read more about "Cuts"...
____________________________________

Go here for links to the petition and the ads:
http://www.democrats.org/

nothing?

This is all stuff started by McAullife's organization, just like the DNC's Voting Rights Institute which Dean also had nothing to do with.

just because you don't like the answer doesn't mean it's not accurate.

Dean has been all over the SS issue, and you KNOW IT.

It's my understanding that Gannon/Guckert has replaced all the toiletpaper in the restrooms most frequently visited by democratic senators with rough generic toilet paper in order to make sure the democrats are distracted with sore butts.

Where is Dean on this issue?

Just demonstrating how a person with an agenda can make up a straw man issue and demand that Dean "be all over it"

What a bunch of crap.

Dean's strategy is to build at the grass roots level, particularly in "red" states. It appears to me that is what he is trying to do. A tour of rural "red" America doesn't get much mainstream press, but it does get local press that most of us don't see. I think the Democrats dropped the ball on the Gannon story, but I can't fault Dean for doing what he said he would do and being where he said he would be. I hope he is successful in building the party on the local level, and I think it is important that someone is dedicated to focusing on that position, even if it means not being in the spotlight all the time. If he was on TV every day and not out with the people, then I would fault him.

you're funny

and eat it up like you can't get enough. The scream to which your referring was blatantly edited and meant to have a harmful effect. To anyone who saw it live or got to see an unedited version you would know the truth. Obviously you would rather insult the DNC Chairman than show your support to his efforts. At least he is making an effort unlike many Dem's in Congress. I'm glad you would rather see the "buisiness as usual cause theres nothing wrong with the Democratic Party" people in power than someone fresh who doesn't bend over so the Refucklican's can ream our rights some more.

and I'm not voting for Kerry if he runs again.

friends by dissing an entire group of people and then making erroneous assumptions about their motives.

Your statement is definitely flamebait, but then you probably knew that.

The Outlaw Bank: A Wild Ride Into the Secret Heart of BCCI. Kerry most definitely is a fighter, just maybe not in overt ways.

Many people, including the press, haven't figured out that what happened in BCCI has EVERYTHING to do with our current foreign policy and what happened on 9-11.

Thanks for making the effort. Most people wouldn't take that kind of time to read the facts about their country.

It serves the BFEE's purpose to discredit and demonize Kerry at every turn, and too many here at DU jump in ignorantly to give them a hand.

as he hasn't been serving terribly effectively in that regard.

So, on what do you base this allegation of complete GOP toolness. Could it be his opposition to Condi Rice? No, that can't be it. How about his opposition to Gonzalez? Nah, not that either. Um, his support of health care for children? Yes, that's it. It must be. It shows all those nasty family values the Pukes are always talking about. But no, they talk about values, but never do anything about them. So that's not it either.

Hmm.

Environmental record? Nope. Gets high marks there too.

His soldiers bill of rights? Naw. Real GOP tools only talk about supporting the troops. Maybe they wear a ribbon or two. They'd never consent to such, such WELFARE, even if the guy in need IS a soldier. ("I don't care what you did for your country, fella. Take your beggin' someplace else.")

Err...the election reform bill he's co-sponsoring maybe. No, the GOP won the last election. Why would a GOP tool want to reform a system if his masters WON.

Maybe his absense in Ohio. Yeah! That's it! What's that you say? He has a lawsuit going there?

Well, hell, he must be a GOP tool somehow. Leesa said so.

I suppose there is that IWR vote. Hm, he did explain that, but some don't believe him. Well, that COULD be it, but then that hardly constitutes a sense of "completenness" does it. There must be more!

Hmm. I'll keep looking and get back to you.

It has become childish and boring. They reply with the same old tired rhetoric over and over again. Most of their rants have no real substance to them and they don't win new recruits over to their way of thinking.They don't want to get along with anyone who does not support their views. It's difficult to take them and their opinions seriously when they are all so transparent. May I suggest they form their own little DU group so they can rant,rave and encourage each other's negativity in their own forum and stop polluting the rest of the DU. That said, I appreciate John Kerry's efforts and votes since the election. I liked him during the election process,but I have since grown to admire him also.

People are entitled to their own opinions. I recently said the same thing in a Clarkie thread.

People seem awfully thin-skinned around here, especially since last year's primaries essentially ended over a year ago, and the next round won't happen for years to come.

as you said, but sometimes I do wonder what more people want Kerry to do now.

Now, I understand many are disappointed that he conceded as soon as he did and didn't speak up enough about election reform. I'm not going to argue about that or his IWR vote, which has been hashed many times now.

It just seems silly to say things like "he's a GOP tool" like the comment above. Kerry was a flawed candidate and I was extremely critical of his campaign, but I'll give him credit since then. He's clearly shown his opposition to the Bush agenda - he opposed Condi, Gonzales, SS privatization, the bankuptcy overall, etc.

His speaking style isn't terribly exciting. He tends to ramble on sometimes but he's still one of the better senators.

Whether you like Dean or Kerry, Kerry was chosen and he lost the election (or the vote was close enough so they could steal it, again!). I don't hate Kerry but I would be loathe to support him again as a candidate for President. I want someone who will win, and I've come to think that it should be someone who is not from the Northeast of the country and I think it should be someone who can speak to ordinary Americans.

As far as what he does as a Senator from now on, I'm glad he is on our side for the issues and I respect him and think he's honestly trying to do the best he can.

Aside from the multitude of negatives surrounding an already compromised Kerry bid, what would be the most successful broadbase appeal to mobilize the Democratic vote is a populist appeal to the common American. I am sorry if this offends some of you insulated inside-of-the-beltway types and Kerry affectionados, but Kerry bats less than zero in this department and he neatly fits the model of the New England elitist...snob. There, I said it, Kerry comes off as a snob.

How offensive it is that these millionaire politicians dabble in politics for their own personal fanatasy projections--at the expense of the public. If the Democrats really wanted and cared enough about winning they would back a winning candidate and dispense with the back room deals between career insiders.

Meanwhile, we all appreciate the efforts of such "career insiders" as Ted Kennedy, Robert Byrd, and Pat Leahy.
As well as Kerry, and newcomer "dabbler" Jon Corzine.
....whatever.

With his windsurfing vacations in Nantucket or his sking resort and his million dollar wives and bank accounts and his million dollar estates and his affectations of class as the richest senator, his booked rooms at the Four Seasons on the common man's dime, his man servant carry his game after the hunt. What the fuck is the matter with this pompous jerk? He not only IS but he acts and looks the role as well. He is like a cartoon of what IS, is.

Bush may be what IS really is, but he isn't a fucking walking advertisement of elitist wealth and privilige whereas Kerry is the posterboy.

Now, do you fucking want to win, or what?

National contests are won and lost on image and marketing, so long as we live in TV nation. Kerry could not avoid "coming off" as elitist, aloof and wooden during the 2004 campaign, even though that's not the way he really IS in person. However, until political campaigns can be conducted by personally talking to every single voter in the United States, it's the IMAGE that matters most.

The fact was the Bush's handlers are extremely good marketers, and they planted in the public mind an association with Bush around the terms "steadfast", "leadership", "conviction", "resolute", and so on. The immediate corollary suggested was also that Kerry was the opposite of these attributes -- "flip-flopper", "indecisive", and so on.

I'm not saying that it's by any means true. I'm simply saying that in this day and age in which the vast majority of the American public turns to TV as their sole source of news, images and marketing are what determines national campaigns. Presidential candidates are treated no differently than brands of toothpaste. That's the reality, and you can post all the individual pictures with captions you want, but it won't change that reality.

A clip from the debate...

http://www.moveonpac.org/kerryad-QT.html

Kerry has worked as a Prosecutor, Lt Governor, and has been a Senator for 20 years. Through most of that time he was not a millionaire. He was one of the poorest Senators for a long time. He had extended family that was wealthy and many wealthy friends, but he had mainly his Senate salary. If he would have chosen a life in the public sector, his connections, intelligence, and workaholic nature would have made him wealthy, but he chose public service. Even now, it is Teresa who is wealthy, although he benefits from her wealth.

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in his shoes. This was a vicious lying election in 2004. Anyone running against this hate regime was going to get slaughtered.

Can't we wait till the primaries and see who is running? Personally I hope(and know) that I don't have to pick from the same set of candidates we saw in 2004. Can't we try and keep the good Democrats in the senate and take a long hard look at former Gov's(some that are forced out because of term limits) or other sources? If we keep losing senate seats, it doesn't matter who winds up in the White House, they will be utterly doomed, and totally destroyed by their first manufactured "scandal".

Personally I think we should focus on things we can change like making the primary process more inclusive and participatory. I think Kerry won many primaries because a small group in Iowa told everyone else he was the candidate who could win. Not that Kerry wasn't the best choice, but I don't think he got the nomination because of his message. By the time the primaries got around to many states, the selection was already made and they could either "vote for a winner" or cast a "protest vote". That leaves many of us feeling like we never had a voice in the process.

Funneling all your money to Kerry right now makes you just as short sighted as the Deaniacs many of you Kerry supporters are scorning. Donate to the party, or to the chosen candidate. Don't blow your money on a man who might not make it past the primaries.

I think that people are spending way too much time talking about who they want to back in '08. Thats THREE YEARS from now. Theres the more pressing and important issue of the senate and gov. elections in '06 (ahem... next year) and people are barely talking about them compared to praising this person or that person, or debates on who should or shouldn't run. To some degree, I am guilty of it as well. At this rate we're going we're gonna do the Repugs jobs for them by tearing our own party down. Who knows what the political atmosphere in this country will be like in three years. Who knows what leader will rise above the rest to lead us all to victory. Theres an infinate amount of things that could happen in the world that could affect the next elections. Too many to even begin thinking about them. Point is. Lets deal with the issues that are right here in front of us. Unify! We can all agree on one thing....

THE REPUBLICANS NEED TO GO!

THIS is our common goal.

So... can we please just try to put aside all of our opinions about '08 and try figure out how to try to fix America while there's something left to fix?

...rather than explaining what they liked about Democrats was going to get people to vote Democratic.

In fact, it polarized and congealed support. Hard core RW'ers circled the wagons, and the people in the middle were left MORE susceptible to voting for Bush because at least from Bush they got a sense of what he was for. From the Democrats they got no arguments about what Democrats stood for.

I should add that this was more of a grass roots thing. Kerry tried to give people reasons to vote for him, but the grass roots seemed much more interested in being ABB this year.

If ABB is the extent of it.

Republicans already had a candidate - all Kerry did was claim he could run a better game on Bush's playing field.

He lost because he didn't bash Bush. He was a gentleman through and through, even while viciously being smeared by the Swifties.

Bush played the fear card, and people were looking for someone who would protect them and stand up to those big bad terrorists. Kerry needed to deliver a knockout punch, not nuanced explanations.

He should have called Bush out on his cowardice and lies and manipulation, but instead he spent practically the entire campaign defending his position on the war. In the meantime, the Pet Goat Video sat collecting dust.

"Bring it on," my ass.

... to fight for health care for every child, is now doing so from the Senate, rather than from the Oval Office.

He introduced his 'Kids First' legislation (S. 114) to supporters on November 19, and is moving forward determinedly with his convictions. He deserves widespread support for this bill, both from the Senate & the citizenry.

JK still kickin' ass!!!!!!!!

the election. I'll NEVER forgive him for that. We might have been able to prove we won if he'd used all the legal help he had at hand and money he'd accumulated. It does not work for me that I have to deal with this fascist regime for 4 more years because Kerry thought he'd have a better chance then. TOO LITTLE TOO LATE. I will vote NO to Kerry in my primary.

After everything we've learned about John Kerry in the past year, I simply don't believe he "gave up" after the election because he was calculating a better shot at 2008. He knew very well what had gone on in Ohio - probably better than any of us did. And he had an even clearer and harsher view that there was nothing to be done about it - nothing that didn't make him look like a lunatic, in any case. Because the evidence was gone. This way at least he can still be effective in the Senate.

If blame falls anywhere, it's on those who knew how Florida had been stolen in 2000, and how screwed-up electronic voting was, and did nothing about it for 4 years. It's easy to point the finger in hindsight ... but at the time, the feeling seemed to be that overwhelming support for Kerry, and anti-Bush sentiment, would swamp out the cheating. Not an excuse, but an explanation.

I agree 100% Go JK in 2008!! :kick:

Kerry is history. No point wasting your time on an ineffectual leader. He is as much into imperialism as Bush is. Don't need his kind around.

them. We need every hand to man the oars in this lifeboat.

You post ridiculous charges with NOTHING to back them up. Why should anyone take you seriously?

because he is doing it very, very well. Kerry has been working very well and very creatively to push some very needed issues. The idea of using the mailing list to create petitions, foster lobbying of congressmen, and, in the case of the Kids First Bill, actually getting information of people's needs is good. Several other Democrats have followed in doing this. On the environment he has made a strong case to motivate people to become activists - I have never heard a Senator do this before.

At a time where we control nothing, he seems to be one of the people working the hardest to create and push a Democratic agenda that even if it can't get to the floor of the Senate, it positions us for 2006.

Only time will tell if he is a good candidate for 2008. There's a lot of time before that. A popular dominant candidate may emerge and make all arguments irrelevant. But until then supporting actions of any candidate IF those actions make sense is far more sensible. If it makes that candidate stronger, so much the better, I might be helping the person who is ultimately the candidate.

Kerry's still my main man, and this is coming from someone who admired almost all of our primary candidates.

Even Joementum occasionally has his moments, at least when the vote isn't about foreign policy.

They wanted a play it safe guy and they got a play it safe guy.

If he's nominated again, his campaign will be run without a single $ of my money.

And anybody who said it during the primaries.

It was people making excuses for why their candidate got left in the corn patch.

Sickeningly partisan party operatives in my state were floating that "electablity" meme early in the summer of 2003. Thanks for playing.

How do you react to that?

Julie

so your feedback couldn't matter less. The fact DU hasn't TS'd you is either an enigma or quite revealing, not sure which yet.

Julie

This thread appears to have run its course.