Gov Mark Warner of Virginia just signed a bill to deny benefits to

illegal aliens, according to Lou Dobbs.

The bill would not apply to education or emergency medical care, however would cover all other state benefits.

Virginia becomes the second state to pass this type of legislation, joining Arizona.

The vote in the Va legislature was unanimous in 1 House, & overwhelming in the other house. (Not sure about Senate vs House)

Any opinions? And how will this play in a potential run for Prez?

Illegal aliens have legal relatives, whose votes are strongly influenced by decisions like this.

but I wasn't sure.

...but not how you think. I'm a "legal" alien. My parents and many relatives came from Europe when I was a child, and became citizens through proper channels. Why would we want or support other relatives in coming over illegally??? It doesn't even make sense. What does it say about our hard work and doing things right, when others can just walk across the border and they're all set

I think as a wealthy country we have a responsibility to help people all over the world, but there are better ways of doing it. Since a lot of these people are willing to do work that most born Americans don't want to...then why not relax or change the laws. I wouldn't mind at all using my tax dollars to help poor countries have a better standard of living. Mexico, for example, is a beautiful place. Why not help them so that people can stay in the country and with the people they love.

What's the point of having laws if you are going to ignore them? If they don't work...change them.

BTW...Mark Warner is my governor. He is a very compassionate, highly intelligent person.

isn't considered "illegal" and so that they are registered.

lend support to legal migrant labor? This only feeds into anti-immigrant prejudices.

place that allows people from C & S America to work here registered.

And should such a system be put in place, it would be entirely reasonable to refuse benefits to those who don't comply.

& wondering how it will play politically.

Hillary Clinton has come out as opposed to illegal immigration.

No freaking way. A human being is still a human being even if they weren't born in America.

This idea that human life means less if it isn't American is what allows the Republicans to not care about the over 100,000 Iraqi dead. We need someone who will reject the most despicable conservative ideologies, not adopt them.

My brother is a huge repug and is totally against letting anyone over the borders who is not American, never mind migrant workers. I think their (his) mindset is that terrorists will infiltrate this way and he's astounded the shrub would even consider granting access to anyone other than Americans. The terror alerts ad nauseum apparently worked with a big part of the country.

Edited to add: doesn't quite explain Hillary's objections.

Illegals should get their three hot and a cot before they get shipped back to wherever they came from. They are not here legally. They should not be benefiting from our tax money for breaking the law.

And what about their children who don't have a choice.

If that means the kids are not citizens and can't stay here with someone legal, they have to go too. Illegal immigration is unacceptable IMHO.

But what we are doing is letting them stay and treating them like complete shit. BTW sending them back is kind of pointless until we secure our borders because they can just come back.

Immigration is a mess in this country. It meeds a major overhaul. I don't understand why it's not a bigger issue.

use our benefits for our citizens, not illegal aliens. Kudos to Warner.

You mean the 40 MILLION Americans who don't have health insurance? The benefits are only available to those who can afford to pay. This isn't 'giving' anybody else more benefits.

And cutting benefits for illegal aliens except for emergency medical care means we'll spend much more overall, since they won't get treatment or help until a situation is desperate.

If he can make it through the Democratic primary he will be a force in the general election.

but illegal aliens who dont speak English with no college usually do.

That;s backwards.

Especially considering that illegals aren't even here legally. In any other country they would be thrown in the slammer and deported.

a lot of hispanics there....

Wonder what my favorite Senator thinks of this - America's Senator, Ms. Boxer.

I know that corporate America adores these illegal aliens and wants scads more. I can see states doing everything they can to pull the plug UNLESS these people are guaranteed decent wages and benefits. We are not doing them a favor by letting them be used like this and we are not doing our citizens any favor whatsoever but just flushing everyone towards the bottom. It's time to make the "masters" pay decently for the help. Otherwise, we literally, as years go by cannot afford them because our workers will be making the wages of the countries they just left!!!!!!!!

The businesses get their cheap labor, but taxpayers rather than businesses are forced to pay the cost.

And the states are not getting help from the Feds, but it is a Federal issue.

As I understand it, virtually all states are in the red now. Something's got to give.

i was kind of surprised at first but their reasons did kind of make sense. they view themselves as people who followed the law, put up with the long waits, and everything else needed to come here legally. and they want to know why those here illegally should get the same benefits. they do tend to make exceptions for things like education(especially where young kids are concerned as they are viewed as innocent) and emergency medical care which is the case with the bill Warner signed based on the original post.

this is why many were turned off by prop 187 in California some years ago. it denied education and medical care. but why they tend to support things like denying drivers licenses, or making learning English a requirement.

Biggest opponent of illegals is legal immigrants.

I've also been surprised to see polls where Hispanic Americans are opposed to illegal immigration.

When you are an immigrant and that you have done everything legally, you dont like that people wonder whether you are legal or not, and some people think automatically that an Hispanic is an immigrant alien.

The only problem is that these measures have been proven useless in the past because they do not attack the root of the problem.

Like montana500 said, start providing benefits to our citizens not illegal aliens. Gov. Warner is gradually climbing to the top of my 2008 list.

Stop worrying about losing Hispanic voters. Legal immigrants are some of the biggest supporters of this type of legislation.

WARNER, WARNER, WARNER, WARNER! 2008, 2008, 2008, 2008!

Va for health care has increased 70% in the last 5 years, and the residents of Va. are very upset, as well they should be!

I have to believe the immegrants who took the time to become legal would be as, or more upset by the illegals as everyone else is.

I must tell you, when I worked for a company in Tx, we had a lot of legal Mexican immegrant workers. One was a very nice young firl who worked for us for about 5 years, and had 2 small children during that time. She announced one day that she was moving back to Mexico. We had a party for her, and wished her good luck. About a year later, she contacted us again to say that she wanted to come back to the States, and asked if we had a job for her. We asked her why she wanted to return to the US, and she said she decided she wanted another baby, and needed the US to pay for it!

I've never forgotten that story. I felt it was an abuse of the generosity of the US then, and still do!

Don't reward illegal aliens for BREAKING our laws.

We should not reward the illegal aliens who are breaking the law and robbing us blind.

You go Mark!

also feel this way. After all we are very often the ones who are left to compete for the same jobs and same low income housing. With housing; there is not enough to go around and we are force to pay over 50% of our income for housing. Higher earning dems are oblivious to what this feels like.

The Dems support it too. Remember, Bush supports worker programs for illegals. It's bad policy.

Good for Virginia.

Common sense!

At least, in states with a Sales Tax. Like Texas--no state income tax.

And though most of them don't own property--landlords DO pass on property tax costs to their tenants. Otherwise, all renters would be ineligible for state benefits, as well.

What do you want, endless benefits to subsidies manufacturing and construction's use of cheap labor (with no benefits) or a reasonable approach to state expenditures. This is smart (education) and compassionate (emergency care). Other than that, no state like Virginia with a large population of illegals (yes, Virginia) can afford this and maintain other benefits. If this is what he signed, you can be SURE that the first Republican legislature in modern Virginia history had much worse in mind.

Keep in mind, under Warner, Virginia is rated THE BEST GOVERNED STATE IN THE UNITED STATES. That's one of us, a Democrat, doing that.

Warner :yourock:

feel resentful that they did all the work and endured hardships in order to come in legally, yet others who did not are given benefits.

Warner may have been sensitive to these issues in addition to the other points raised on this thread.

Illegals are illegal. They should not get licenses and taxpayer money. Just a flight back to wherever they came from.

that will be subsidized by good American citizens who dont want to pay their workforce enough, I guess. Start by fighting the roots of illegal immigration, that will be more efficient.

but we should sue whoever hire them so that they dont anymore. May be there would be less illegal immigrants if there was no companies that hire them. (Here in Boston, they arrested several people working in the airport - Do you really think that the company that hired them did not know they were illegal).

That's a big part of it. I do worry about what it means if these people go underground, but this is a good place to start.

For me, this law is demagogery, nothing more.

Same thing goes for some people on this board from the remarks I have read.

Sure, illegal workers should not be here, but who can reproach them to try to earn a living. Some of our GOOD Citizens (I loved this term, seems so xenophobic to me) (corporations or otherwise) who hire them at low price get large benefits of that though. But the only solution imagined by M, Warner to curb on illegal immigration is to strike the poor and helpless people

Historic studies throughout the world have proven that these measures, besides being heartless, are useless. Measures that would strike strongly people who hire illegal immigrants are a lot more efficient to fight against illegal immigration. But this would probably be hurtful for some of the people who finance Warner's campaign.

I must have missed that directive from the Central Committee.

I fought fighting for the weakest was part of that. Apparently, I was wrong.

Now, if this type of measures is representative of the Party, I guess I should be an independant.

This shouldn't be an issue because we should be securing our borders so that illegal immigrants can't get in, in the first place.

They can go so much farther to control and discourage illegal immigration, but they chose to ignore it and even in Bush's case, condone it. The states are forced to act.

There needs to be a guest worker program that works and is fair and respectful to all concerned. The situation we have now with illegal immigration is completely dysfunctional.

While I wish Warner's bill wasn't needed, it seems that it is only through this kind of political pressure that immigration reform will be dealt with in any meaningful way, unfortunately.

care) cost to the state of Virginia (as a % of the budget)?

How much does the state not get because of fiscal evasion by companies that hire those people?

I dont know the numbers, but I am sure that this will not solve the problem at all, except by increasing costs for hospitals.

This is typically a demagogic bill if there are any.

It does nothing to solve the problem, but looks good on his resume for presidential candidate.

This is all this would solve..

I am all against illegal immigration, but may be we can try to solve the problem rather than pander.

welfare, kids' schooling, etc.

or is Warner playing politics?

I say, Big whoop-di-doo!

Since there is corporate welfare, why not illegal immigrant welfare?

Maybe when Warner goes after Corporate welfare issues of businesses in his state, I'll jump for joy.

Is he being Politically courageous or pandering? It's easy to propose a bill on Immigration while governor of Virginia. Why Am I not impressed?

or the Legislature proposed it & he signed the bill.

particularly in the DC area but also elsewhere, drawn by the international nature of the city, by huge demand for service and construction employees, by the fact that many immigrants already have family members here. Some are legal; some are not.

Schools are bursting at the seams to accommodate population growth, partly driven by the immigration. Real estate taxes are skyrocketing and people are angry about it.

You might want to get more informed about the facts before drawing conclusions about Warner's motivations.

What's the standard operating procedure when a person is found to be an illegal alien? Aren't they deported? If this is the case then why is it necessary to have a law cutting off benefits? Are the checks being forwarded to Mexico or something?

But most times, people, when caught, are given a summons to appear in court...they have to have a hearing before being deported.

Unless accused of a crime, most places don't take illegals into custody.

we'll let the illegals stay and remain as chear labour, but won't grant them the same benefits other residents get? Sounds great. Warner '08!!!!

Given that the two services illegals use mostly are the two that are still accessible (education and emergency care).

This is pure pandering and solve no problem:

- will not stop illegal immigration that is driven by people hiring illegal workers.
- will not help the state budget as the two most important spendings remain.
- will do absolutely nothing concerning security issues linked to illegal immigration (does not even pretend to).

Here's a start:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=edit&forum=132&topic_id=1693644&mesg_id=1694853

It creates scapegoats and will make access difficult for legal aliens and foreign-born citizens as well as they will have to document they are legal to have access to the services.

I read the bill where you posted it and it did not change my mind. I agree fully with the opponents of the bill.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=1693644&mesg_id=1694853

It does not mean that illegal immigration should not be fought, just that the bill will do nothing for that.

I support this 100%. As a Virginian who has recently discovered that two homes in my neighborhood are housing members of the violent gang MS-13 - most of whom are illegal aliens - I'm all for this.

they *should* get available to them.

Solves no problems and just makes you feel good.

http://www.boston.com/news/globe/editorial_opinion/editorials/articles/2005/03/30/wal_marts_cut_rate_labor/

GLOBE EDITORIAL
Wal-Mart's cut-rate labor

March 30, 2005

THE JANITORS were cleaning up in some 60 Wal-Mart stores in 21 states -- including Massachusetts and New Hampshire -- on Oct. 23, 2003, when federal immigration agents suddenly appeared. It was a series of raids. Agents arrested 245 illegal immigrants who had been hired to clean the stores by cleaning companies contracting with Wal-Mart. Lawyers representing the workers say their clients were locked inside stores and denied overtime pay. After the raids, Wal-Mart contacted federal authorities and promised to cooperate with the investigation.



It's a law enforcement victory. But it shows the flaws in national immigration policies. Market forces fuel the problem: Companies want workers, and undocumented immigrants want wages. Many companies take the risk -- hiring illegal workers, hoping they won't get caught, and leaving workers with little protection against abuse.


Another strategy is to penalize employers who hire illegal immigrants. But while the $11 million settlement with Wal-Mart is record-setting, it isn't a lot for a company that had $285.2 billion in sales for the year ending Jan. 31, 2005. In the future, sanctions should be tougher so fines don't seem like an acceptable cost of doing business.

Ultimately, it's immigrant families trying to make ends meet who suffer the most from weak immigration policies. Ali Noorani, head of the Massachusetts Immigrant and Refugee Advocacy Coalition, points to the workers who deal with unscrupulous employers and then get deported.

"the $11 million settlement with Wal-Mart is record-setting"

A $11 million fine to WalMart would be like a $10 fine to the average American working person.

"it isn't a lot for a company that had $285.2 billion in sales for the year ending Jan. 31, 2005"

We have enough problems fixing our domestic poverty as it is and we have seen how the illegal problems are breaking California's back financially.

This bill does not solve anything. It just makes illegal immigrants (and legal ones at the same time) scapegoats for real problems that exist in the state.

illegal aliens...with emphesis on the first.

There are processes to apply for political asylum and processes to apply for citizenship.

Illegal aliens deserve no benefits, other than emergency and humanitarian.

Ask Romney. Is MassHealth in better shape since he terminated benefits to LEGAL aliens? I dont think so.

If they want to attack the real problems, they are welcome. Read the editorial in the Globe on the subject. For once, they are right!!

And for those who think that the process to get a visa is easy, I can tell first-hand it is not if you are honest with the immigration, except if you can help the corporate world, in which case it becomes more than easy.

Make immigration laws simpler (not easier, just simpler so that consulate agents are not swamped by cases that they say are not problematic but that still takes months to process while illegal aliens arrested by police get a walk), condemn people who hire illegal workers severely so that they dont try again, insure a better control at the border, and may be we can start to curb illegal immigration. But if people are here to enrich companies by being paid less, give them a break if you are not willing to attack the sources of the problem.

in the World Court or U.N.?

Are we to become a provider to every illegal immigrant that wants to come here?

A down payment on reparations to the World.

Stop worrying about losing Hispanic voters. Legal immigrants are some of the biggest supporters of this type of legislation.

WARNER, WARNER, WARNER, WARNER! 2008, 2008, 2008, 2008!