Almost 70 Percent Of U.S. Casualties In Iraq Under Age 30

Link: http://www.mtv.com/news/articles/1512285/20051026/index.jhtml?headlines=true&_requestid=164157

Snip: <The death of a 34-year-old Army staff sergeant wounded by a roadside bomb marked the 2,000th military casualty of the Iraq war, the Pentagon announced Tuesday, cementing another grim milestone in the two-and-a-half-year-old conflict in Iraq.

It's a number that many are using as a symbol of either a misguided military action or the ultimate cost of freedom. But who are the men and women behind the number? Of those 2,000 troops lost, nearly a third were between the ages of 20 to 22, with the highest fatality rate (11.7 percent) being among 21-year-olds, according to figures from the Iraq Coalition Casualty Count, which gathers the bulk of its data from the U.S. government. Soldiers in their mid- to late-20s made up 37 percent of deaths, making almost 70 percent of U.S. casualties under age 30.

Nearly half the fallen were soldiers, one-quarter were Marines and 15 percent were from the National Guard. More than three-quarters (78 percent) were killed in combat, with more than 93 percent killed after President Bush declared an end to major combat in May 2003.

Most casualties were suffered by men, with only 46 female fatalities. Seventy-three percent were white, compared to 11 percent Hispanic and 10.7 percent black; other ethnicities constituted the remaining 5 percent. Forty percent left behind spouses and 30 percent were survived by children.>

are missing limbs or are paralyzed. I know there are other disabilities they suffer, but I'd like to see the numbers on those 2 disabilities.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Casualties_in_the_conflict_in_Iraq


Scroll down half way down the page.

15,220 combat wounded, over 7,000 evacuated. These are old numbers but they are recent and fairly accurate. Think about all those poor young people who are now gimps for the rest of their lives - unable to work or provide for themselves and/or their families. Wards of the state. We will be paying for these poor people for the rest of our lives. Bush has just added to our tax burden and as health care costs surge faster than inflation, we're in big trouble if this shit keeps up.

These poor people. These poor people are the ones that wish they were dead. I wish the press wouldn't ignore them, like just surviving is good enough.

I remember a very creepy movie from the Vietnam War era, Johnny Got His Gun. http://us.imdb.com/title/tt0067277/ I think of all the kids coming back like that now.

I remember seeing drugged/drunk vets strewn across sidewalks like garbage, begging to survive. We may see that again, too.

I always got freaked when I saw this one vet who was often parked on a gurney type thing in the foyer area of a discount department store. The bottom half of his body was missing. He would talk gibberish to everyone coming in and out of the store. There will be more of those guys, too.

That's the way it worked for these guys from Vietnam. They thought they would be viewed as heros and in the end they just ended up getting spat on and stepped over. They pass out on the sidewalks and nobody gives a shit.

My grandfather passed away recently. He didn't even see heavy combat in that fucking war but Vietnam turned him into a pill-popping, half insane crackhead in the last decade of his life. And I literally mean he was a crackhead. He smoked the shit in his trailer. That's the respect we give our brave men and women who die and get maimed for us.

It's despicable. The only thing that matters in this country is money. People will fucking kill for little green paper. It's amazing. What ever happened to honor and respect? They seem to have gone out the fucking window along with everything else that once made America great.

They were physically damaged. And emotionally damaged. And no one cared and no one helped. If their families cared for them to begin with, it didn't last, because the soldiers were too much to handle and were ousted from the flock.

I remember people who died, people who came back nuts, and people whose bodies were broken. If they were spat upon, that would be the LEAST of their problems.

Being outcasts was not a problem. Dealing with physical, mental, and emotional trauma was enough to fill their horrid living hell that some called a life.

I can tell you're either not American or you don't give a damn about the people who spill their blood for you.

<[These stories have to be taken very seriously, but as historical evidence they are problematic. In the first place, stories of this type didn't surface until about ten years after the end of the war. If the incidents occurred when the storytellers say they did, in the closing years of the war, why is there no evidence for that? Moreover, many of the stories have elements of such exaggeration that one has to question the veracity of the entire account.>]

What historical evidence you fucking boob? My best friend's father was a green beret and the second he got off the plane in San Diego he was called a baby killer and a murderer. They should have taken those bastards who were calling names and sent them over there to aid the Communists so we could have reason to take them out as well. My grandfather was ignored and shunned for the last 25 years of his life because of his alcohol and drug problems. They were CAUSED by Mr. Johnson and his war. No other reason. These pinhead rich elitist assholes who could afford to go to college instead of war are the ones who are the most out of touch with reality.

Go sip your Starbucks and shove it up your ass as you walk out onto Park Avenue and hop into your Volvo and adjust your black horn-rimmed glasses you elitist snob. I'll stick with my cheap Red Diamond Coffee. At least I can pronouce the name of my damn drink. Coffee. You venti latte stuck up pinhead.

in war young people die

Second rule of war,

there is nothing I can do to change rule number one

Although he inherited a shitty economy from the fruit of the corruption of the Wilson and Harding administrations and of the excess of America's upper class, old Hoover had some very wise sayings:

"Old men declare war. But it is the youth that must fight and die."

"It is the youth who must inherit the tribulation, the sorrow... that are the aftermath of war."

"Peace is not made at the council table or by treaties, but in the hearts of men."

On our national debt:

"Blessed are the young for they shall inherit the national debt."



China has bought HUNDREDS OF BILLIONS OF DOLLARS in bonds to finance this war. We have to pay ALL that back eventually. What happens if they call in our debts and we don't have the money to pay? We're fucked. They'll dump our dollars and turn to Euros and find Africa, India, or some other market to buy their cheap plastic crap and fireworks. We are passing this enormous debt down to our children and grandchildren. On top of an increasing older America, the tax burden on our children will be excessive. Expect instability in the next 50 years in America.

All because of the incompetence, overspending, and financial mismanagement of the Cheney Administration.

As our population ages and more and more of our young men and women are murdered everyday in Iraq - that's that many fewer families to replenish our population. We're going to end up with the exact same problems faced in Japan and Western Europe right now. A surging elderly population and a shrinking young taxable working class. This causes taxes to rise and younger people to get even more pissed off and have fewer children as they have less money to raise more kids. This I fear may inevitably kill our nation as part of a larger trend.

:( It's so sad and totally unfortunate. :cry:

We are going to have either revolution or civil war in America in the next 50 years. Watch as illegal aliens flood the Western states and Latino nationalism grows with their surging birthrate. - expect seccessionist movements in the Southwest. Look at La Raza, they've been talking that shit for years. That will inevitably lead to dissolution of our nation and some type of regional sectarian war. Probably on racial, ethnic, or nationalistic grounds.

I am reminded of the lyrics by the Sex Pistols in "God Save the Queen":
<[[br />Nnnnnoooooooo FFFFuuuuttttuuuurrreeeee

NNoooooooo FFFFuuuuutttttuuuurrrrreeee

NNNNoooooo FFFFFuuuuuutttttuuuuurrrrreeeeee for you!!!!]]

Not trying to sound cheesy here, I'm dead serious, this is how America will probably look within our lifetimes.

the perpetual growth you describe is not sustainable, either economically or ecologically. If we define our standard of living as the amount of per capita energy available to a society then there is no realistic way for this country to become richer by adding more people. How utterly depressing to be consciously aware of a culture and civilization in decline, much like a 5th century Roman.

Why is redistribution of wealth no longer an option in the 21st century? Is Bill Gates no longer wealthy? Are churches no longer covered in gold.

Take a look at the wealth distribution in this country, much more can be taken from the rich without brining up the straw man of the elderly and infirm.

I'm sorry, but I don't follow the Malthus crowd.

"the perpetual growth you describe is not sustainable, either economically or ecologically."

I beg to differ. We have abundant resources. All we need to do is stop relying on fresh water sources and start creating desalinization plants on the oceans to pump fresh, clean water inland. As to land, look at all the land we have out west - plenty to expand. Just look at Las Vegas. All they need there is to pump water in from the Pacific Ocean after they create de-salinization plants.


"If we define our standard of living as the amount of per capita energy available to a society then there is no realistic way for this country to become richer by adding more people."

That's not the point. Our standard of living is defined by our wealth. That's why we're attempting to create non-fossil fuel sources of energy. It's not easy but it's starting to pick up. I'm a chemical engineering student, I know what I'm talking about. As for borders, let me tell you something, the more older people you have the greater the tax burden on the young. That's common sense. The young will not put up with it, they will revolt. Either that or America will fracture into several different nations or have our land gobbled up by other nations eager to capitalize on our breakdown. In the real world people do not wait around bitching and whining about natural resources - they take them from other people who have them. That's what's happening now.

"How utterly depressing to be consciously aware of a culture and civilization in decline, much like a 5th century Roman."

Indeed, unless America is turned around. We will go the way of Rome I fear - in a Caesar or King. There is no other way to sustain such growth and power. Self-determination only goes so far before people get bored with their mundane existences here. This will lead to political and social unrest my friend.

"Why is redistribution of wealth no longer an option in the 21st century?"

I'm all for taxing the shit out of Warren Buffett and Bill Gates and thier ilk. However, re-distribution of capital is not a solution, it is a band aid over a gun shot wound. New capital must be created and then properly distributed. That's the fallacy of communism and why it only works on paper. It assumes no new capital can be created. But as we've seen, this is not the case. Capital is created every day.

"Is Bill Gates no longer wealthy? Are churches no longer covered in gold."

Yes, but the problem is taking from them and redistributing the money will do nothing. They actually control such a small portion of GDP as to be laughable. It would be much more radical to go after the 10 million or so Americans who are millionaires. But then again, that would kill investment, which would kill society. You can't have your cake and eat it to. People must be held accountable for their actions. That's why I subscribe to anarcho-socialism. Socialism by personal choice, not by government coercion and intimidation. You must create new capital, not redistribute old capital. This will kill the world economy and plunge us back into the dark ages.

"Take a look at the wealth distribution in this country, much more can be taken from the rich without bringing up the straw man of the elderly and infirm."

You wanna do something about wealth distribution in America? What the fuck will that do? Nothing. All you are doing is recycling old capital. Do you see where I'm getting at?

Also man, think about what I am saying, the older people want more pensions and benefits, the fewer young workers have to pay these benefits. That leads to conflict because younger people want to keep *their* money. Not give it to old people. Expect our taxes to be much higher. Look at Europe right now, most of it is at almost 0% growth in GDP. The reason? No new capital is being invested. Old capital is being recycled into the elderly generation and the younger generation has no money to spend, causing a sluggish economy. Economics my friend, pure economics.

The sooner we stop the agenda of the "breeders" the more of natural world we can preserve. Already most of the commercial fisheries of the world are depleted. Soil erosion and deforestation continue in all countries.

Your desalination and alternative agriculture solutions are not used today because they are not practical either from and engineering standpoint or cost standpoint. Will these realties change in the future? If it is more costly to accomplish in the future what you can do today then how in any sense is one richer?

Will water me more plentiful and cheap when we spend large amounts of energy to get from the ocean? Will land be less expensive when it is at a premium for other uses?


I invite you to post your anti-Malthusian views in the DU environmental/energy forum. See where it gets you.

<[The sooner we stop the agenda of the "breeders" the more of natural world we can preserve. Already most of the commercial fisheries of the world are depleted.>]

Well that's because we overeat fish and overfish the same spots instead of expanding our fishing areas. That has nothing with depleting the environment. The world could easily sustain at least another 10 billion people if properly managed.

<[ Soil erosion and deforestation continue in all countries.>]

So what. You have to have land to expand your population. I'm not advocating total deforestation but a lot of the stats given by radical environmentalists are misleading. Remember when I said I'm a chemical engineering student? Well I'm specializing in environmental engineering. I am an environmentalist. But I don't subscribe to radical wacko theories about nature that most serious professionals know have no validity. Look at global warming. All though I believe it to be a real threat, there is still serious debate about the validity of its existence and competent, legitimate researchers are questioning it's existence.

<[Your desalination and alternative agriculture solutions are not used today because they are not practical either from and engineering standpoint or cost standpoint.>]

Bullshit. They're quite practical from an engineering standpoint. They just have to be implemented. As for the cost standpoint, once the technology is standardized and production is increased, costs will drop dramatically. Price obstacles are just an excuse for inaction of proper courses of action.

<[Will these realties change in the future?>]

I fucking hope so.

<[If it is more costly to accomplish in the future what you can do today then how in any sense is one richer?>]

Well obviously we need some big government projects like when they built the Hoover Dam. These government projects are going to have to build hundreds of these plants all over America. That'll solve almost all of our problems.

<[Will water be more plentiful and cheap when we spend large amounts of energy to get from the ocean? Will land be less expensive when it is at a premium for other uses?>]

There you go again. You are complaining from a monetary standpoint. If the government implements it on government land, prices will drop dramatically because you are taking the profit variable out of the equation. Look at Europe and Japan and their power grid. They're on nuclear. If we went nuclear we would solve a lot of our problems. Yes, I know, it's not 100% safe. But it's sure as hell a lot safer now than it was 30 years ago and most experts are positive and confident that safe nuclear policies can be enacted. Look man, the Chinese are doing it now. If we don't compete, we're going to be left in the dust holding the bill. The longer we wait the worse it gets. We're going to lose our place in the world if we keep playing these retarded games. Because the Chinese, Indians, and others in the 3rd world play dirty. We have to play hardball with our energy policy or we go under. I'm not trying to sound conservative here, I'm trying to sound practical. We're losing jobs right now to the 3rd world because of how unregulated it is. Unless we deregulate some of our industries, we will not be able to keep up in terms of growth or technology allocation.


<[I invite you to post your anti-Malthusian views in the DU environmental/energy forum. See where it gets you.>]

I'm not trying to make friends. I'm trying to tell you the way it is. I don't really give a damn pal. Our low birthrate will kill us. Our future rivals in China, India, Pakistan, Iran, and Indonesia do not give a fuck about limiting their population or about environmental reform.