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phylla Donating Member (331 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-02-05 12:23 PM
Original message
Libby Pardoning Lotto
In my opinion it is not a case of will he be pardoned, but when he will be pardoned.
Any predictions?
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TallahasseeGrannie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-02-05 12:26 PM
Response to Original message
1. Sacrificial lamb
they will let him swing.
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underpants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-02-05 12:30 PM
Response to Reply #1
6. Yeah if he keeps his mouth shut he gets a quiet payoff
They created a career for Ollie North for not talking. Libby will collect his way behind the scenes.

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Ganja Ninja Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-02-05 12:26 PM
Response to Original message
2. They'll stall out the case a long as possible and ...
then cop a plea so the pardon won't have to come until after the 2006 elections.
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newscott Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-02-05 12:27 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. They may even wait as long as Bush's last days to pardon him
But it will come.
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ayeshahaqqiqa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-02-05 12:33 PM
Response to Reply #3
8. they are banking on Libby
being able to do time until 2008. I'm hoping Fitzgerald will inform the Scooster that he will be doing hard time-this might be enough to get him to talk. Remember, these people are all chickenhawks, with the stress on "chicken".
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phylla Donating Member (331 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-02-05 12:28 PM
Response to Reply #2
4. My opinion exactly
Do you think that we should start circulating that we expect * will pardon Libby to keep the war secrets safe?
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Ganja Ninja Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-02-05 12:32 PM
Response to Reply #4
7. That's why Libby will plea so there's no trial.
I don't think anything we on the internet can do that would be more effective than Fitz charging a few more of them.
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phylla Donating Member (331 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-02-05 12:34 PM
Response to Reply #7
9. Our only hope is that Fitz will not offer a plea to Libby
But then can't * pardon forward?
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Ganja Ninja Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-02-05 12:37 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. I believe he can issue a pardon without a conviction or trial.
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phylla Donating Member (331 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-02-05 12:38 PM
Response to Reply #10
11. And he will
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Sandpiper Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-02-05 12:29 PM
Response to Original message
5. When Dubya's on his way out he'll pardon him
Like Poppy did with Cap Weinberger.



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gratuitous Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-02-05 12:39 PM
Response to Original message
12. If "like father, like son" has any relevance here
Stupidhead will issue his pardon after the close of business on Friday, December 23, 2005.

Wait for i-i-i-i-it.
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phylla Donating Member (331 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-02-05 12:53 PM
Response to Reply #12
13. ding, ding, ding, ding, ding ! We have a winner!
Of course, why didn't I think of that?
You are right, Friday and a huge holiday.
Brilliant.
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longship Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-02-05 12:59 PM
Response to Original message
14. No gain for neocons in pardoning him
They have very little to gain by pardoning Libby. Libby is in big trouble and the WH knows that. Rove and Cheney are sitting there with him.

The important fact here is that it doesn't matter whether Libby cooperates or not. It really doesn't matter if Libby is pardoned. The rest of the scandal is going to be exposed. Whether or not anybody goes to jail for this, the WH is in big trouble politically. They have to know this. Everybody is reporting this very fact.

The WH knows that pardoning is a very risky move. * can be impeached for it. People will not like it. With Republican Congress Critters starting to bail on some of the neocon agenda the WH has no guarantee that a pardon will not provide a tipping point. No president has ever pardoned a staffer for crimes committed on his watch. It would set a precident that could very well blow up in their faces.

I do not see them taking such a risky move.
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phylla Donating Member (331 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-02-05 01:08 PM
Response to Reply #14
16. I hope you are right, but fear that you are not.
I seriously doubt that * would be impeached for anything at all...as long as there is R control of the House... And that is not likely to change in '06.
Question is, is * more interested in obscuring the nasty truth about his war, or is he more interested in maintaining the R COngress?
Risk all around, of course.
But my bet is that he will make a stab at maintaining his grandiose allusions of his legacy.
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longship Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-02-05 01:42 PM
Response to Reply #16
17. I understand your point.
Edited on Wed Nov-02-05 01:43 PM by longship
But it may not be very operative here. It does not really matter whether * can be impeached or whether people think he can be impeached. There are several facts staring the WH in the face right now.

1. Fitz has not finished.
2. They could lose the House and/or Senate next year.
3. Iraq war looks to be a lost cause with no rescue in sight.
4. Their agenda looks mostly doomed.
5. People hate the presidential pardon.

If you are the WH, you're going to look at pardons as a risk. Historically, they've *always* been a power invoked by either

A. A president whose administration was not involved in the crime
B. On the last day of office

B is no help to *. So they are stuck with an unprecedented action which has no guarantee of success. Chimp may be stupid, but he must have advisors who know that the presidential pardon should be off the table in this case.
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phylla Donating Member (331 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-02-05 02:01 PM
Response to Reply #17
21. Once again, I pray that you are right.
Rove et al, if allowed to stand, will be able to out-think me for sure, and the rest of the country probably.

I like your logic though.

But I have been fooled by them before and I learned to never underestimate the depths that their evil minds can plow.

We look to Fitz. to maintain his integrity and indict Rove and offer no plea bargains.
(fingers crossed)
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Metta Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-02-05 01:04 PM
Response to Original message
15. How can * pardon Libby and support democracy?
Unless he shows he still doesn't care.
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phylla Donating Member (331 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-02-05 01:49 PM
Response to Reply #15
18. How could he indeed?
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Metta Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-02-05 01:51 PM
Response to Reply #18
19. Aside from the obvious lip service hypocracy, of course.
nt.
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tritsofme Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-02-05 01:52 PM
Response to Original message
20. November 5, 2008
The day after the election when all the focus is on the president-elect.
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sepia_steel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-02-05 02:06 PM
Response to Original message
22. I cna't imagine them actually pardoning him.
They KNOW how bad that would look. They haven't cared in the past, but that would be REALLY bad. Would they actualy do it? I sort of doubt it. But they've shocked me with their disgusting lack of morals before...
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