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Will Marshall puts down Gore, Kerry, and Dean in the Guardian blog.

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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-10-06 08:53 PM
Original message
Will Marshall puts down Gore, Kerry, and Dean in the Guardian blog.
Everytime I am trying to keep an open mind and be understanding about their stance on the Democrats having to be the stronger party on National Security, then they do something like this. Will is one of the heads of the PPI/DLC group. He could have said all this without being rude.

First he sort of agrees on the concept of consultants being a problem. But it is as usual accompanied by a few insults and put downs of the people in the party who geniuinely oppose this Iraq invasion. They do not have to do that to make their point. He then refers to the Robin Toner story in the NYT yesterday.
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/05/09/washington/09dems.html?_r=1&oref=slogin

Here is his response to the Toner post.

http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/will_marshall/2006/05/artifice_and_authenticity.html

It's true. Unimaginative pollsters and consultants managed to make the charisma-challenged candidates Al Gore and John Kerry even less exciting, by saddling them with a "message" best described as generic Democrat. Bereft of big, audacious ideas or honest passions, Democratic candidates really do come across as little more than vessels for a hodgepodge of interest group commitments.

So Democrats are looking for authenticity, passion and transcendent purposes, and here's where things get interesting. Liberal activists and bloggers - strangely empowered by the "mainstream media" they profess to despise - demand that Democrats fight harder for their principles, as if the party's core problem was a sudden pandemic of cowardice. Their model is Howard Dean, who swept to exactly one victory - the primary in his home state of Vermont - in the 2004 presidential primaries. That's not exactly an encouraging market signal.

It would be refreshing to find Democratic candidates who are willing to tell the party's imperious constituency and pressure groups where to put their questionnaires and litmus tests. But the real problem is not lack of courage, it's that Democrats disagree on some very fundamental questions of party identity and principle.

Take the most important issue in US politics: national security. The ghastly carnage in Iraq has inflamed liberals and anti-war activists who already loathed President Bush with unusual intensity. Some Congressional Democrats are hinting that, should the party regain power in this year's midterm election, it will be payback time. The White House can expect investigations into everything - faulty intelligence on Iraq, prisoner abuse scandals and allegedly "illegal" domestic spying - and who knows, maybe a push to impeach the president as well.


The worse part is that he called such concerns and such ideas as investigations..."antics".

"Progressive centrists (like me) think that such antics would only reinforce public doubts about Democrats' capacity to lead on matters of war and peace.


I don't think we need to become the party of "spreading Democracy" in order to win. I think people are smarter than that about their country. People in the party also know when they are being talked down to as less worthy.






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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-10-06 09:10 PM
Response to Original message
1. If they had not supported the war in Iraq, I would feel differently.
They are still being apologists for Bush's failure there, not even ashamed of supporting it.

Just wanted to be clear that I know they are setting the policy, and I will vote and be supportive of Democrats this time for sure.

But they need to stop calling us fringe activists, and they need to stop being insulting.
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MH1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-10-06 09:22 PM
Response to Original message
2. " ** allegedly ** "illegal" domestic spying " - WTF?
Pffffftttt.
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Pithy Cherub Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-10-06 10:04 PM
Response to Original message
3. It's hard out there trying to sell a useless book on national security.
It actually is a backhanded acknowledgment that Marshall & the DLC cronies know we are here and LOUDLY proclaiming that their stale ideas are not in fashion.
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-10-06 10:11 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. I agree. They are quite aware of us now.
:hi:
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Pithy Cherub Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-10-06 10:33 PM
Response to Reply #4
7. ROFL! And he had to go to an English blog, not a USA based one.
Edited on Wed May-10-06 10:34 PM by Pithy Cherub
That's just pathetic, but then look who we're talking about.
:hi:
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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-10-06 10:15 PM
Response to Original message
5. Now do you see what Kerry faced on IranContra and BCCI? NO HELP from the
Edited on Wed May-10-06 10:17 PM by blm
establishment Dems until IranContra became an issue in the media, then they axed him out of the hearings even though he spent the year on his own gathering evidence to press the case - and no matter how BIG the BCCI investigation was becoming, it was hard to find anyone who would stick his neck out to help Kerry on it for the whole 5 years.

They don't LIKE investigations - they don't LIKE the anti-corruption wing of the Democratic party. You watch - the Clinton crowd is the one who refused to open the books when they had the chance. They will do it again.
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-10-06 10:19 PM
Response to Reply #5
6. Oh, I agree with you .
They want no investigations at all. We are the fringe activists in their mind.
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JI7 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-10-06 11:23 PM
Response to Original message
8. who ?
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Douglas Carpenter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-11-06 12:03 AM
Response to Original message
9. are the folks in Peoria crying out for more imperial wars??
sometimes I don't know what planet these people live on and who they talk to.



http://www.dontattackiran.org


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