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Delegating to the President on Torture..."McCain is a tragic figure now"

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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-22-06 01:20 PM
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Delegating to the President on Torture..."McCain is a tragic figure now"

Delegating to the President on Torture

By Juliette Kayyem | bio

I tend to follow Marty Lederman on understanding the torture agreement as well, and so am a little perplexed by various groups singing its praises let alone a lot of the news analysis. I was ultimately wrong that the Senators would hold out, cause now I've read the text. Here's my shot at another tragic flaw.

Marty and others are commenting on the wiggle room left to the President in determining what methods would be prohibited but may not constitute grave breaches of the Geneva Conventions and for some reasons its a big deal that those have to be published. Let's assume for the sake of argument that there ought to be a series of interrogation tactics that fall short of grave breaches but that ought still not to be permissible. That sounds right, indeed. But, the problem is the complete deferral to the President on this determination. There were other ways it could have been done, including legislative oversight, judicial determination (i.e. like a FISA court review), or some interrogation "body" that would assess the use of such tactics in specific circumstances. It didn't have to just go to the President; Congress could have equally allowed presidential tough tactics but still reserved some oversight over the use and consistency of those tactics (that fall short of a grave breach).

It is this concession to the President that is mindboggling in almost all respects because the hold-outs could have given the President the less than grave tactics without giving him the sole authority to determine what they were. I'm eating my words; Marty is right -- McCain is a tragic figure now.

http://americaabroad.tpmcafe.com/blog/americaabroad/2006/sep/22/delegating_to_the_president_on_torture


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niyad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-22-06 01:21 PM
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1. mccain is an opportunistic sell-out, period.
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indepat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-22-06 02:01 PM
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2. A tragic figure for which his heroic USN admirals grandfather and father
must be turning over in their graves.
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brook Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-22-06 02:02 PM
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3. Whatever 'wounds'
McCain may suffer...they're self-inflicted. He's now proved beyond a doubt that he's as untrustworthy as his friend, George.


Listening to Joe Conason discuss this travesty a little while ago on Al Franken's show, the first thought I had was "Clinton screwed one person. Bush has screwed millions and killed thousands."


What a pathetic sham of a government we have.

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City Lights Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-22-06 02:06 PM
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4. He's been a tragic figure for awhile now.
I'll never understand how McCain could suck up to the chimp with such gusto after the beating he took from him leading up to the SC primary in 2000. :shrug: Tragic indeed.
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Bake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-22-06 02:25 PM
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5. McCain caved to pressure, failed to stand for principle
Perhaps the rest of the country will now realize that he is not a leader, not a moral person, and that he is unfit to serve as President.

Say goodbye to 2008, Johnny Boy.

Bake
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fasttense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-22-06 02:27 PM
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6. He liked being tortured so much, he is pushing it for our POWs.
There is no other reason that could explain why he would allow the pResident of the US to authorize torture except that he liked the torture he received. :shrug:
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Anarcho-Socialist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-22-06 02:42 PM
Response to Reply #6
7. I don't think it is that
I think the promise of presidential power is numbing the memories of his own torture. If he's going to get the GOP nomination then he needs to work the base. Their core supporters are pro-torture. It says a lot about the right-wing in the U.S.
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warrens Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-22-06 02:58 PM
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8. The third major disgrace of his career
1. Forgiving Shithead and Turdblossom for calling him a coward, his wife a drug addict and his baby a nigger.

2. Speaking at Bob Jones U, where those rumors started.

3. Publicly supporting torture.
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opihimoimoi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-22-06 03:14 PM
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9. It was THE HUG...Bush is Contagious...McCain is infected with Bushitis
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