It is time to move Foley to Page 2

The Dems would be wise to move off of the Foley story and back to the revelations in Woodward's book.

The FBI is on the Foley case. The Republicks are shooting at each other - and their own feet - about who did what to whom and when. We need to stay out of the crossfire. Our only productive role might be to hand them more bullets when the gunfire slows down a bit. This scandal's on autopilot right now.

We need to let that run on its own and start once again to talk about the lies revealed in toady Woodward's book. No one else will be pushing it, so we need to. We can, of course, rhetorically tie it back to Foley. And we should, just to keep picking at that scab.

Every once in a while, tell them our plans for Iraq and for the next Congress. But more than that, we need to just keep the electorate pissed off.

:rofl:

:rofl:

I didn't even catch that! And I usually see that sorty of thing before I see anything else!

Seriously, I agree with you. The Repugs are going to keep this one going for a while on their own, the Dems need to get back to The Bush Administration ignoring all warnings prior to 9/11. That's the story.

How can they keep us safer when they ignore the facts being presented to them? They can't. They haven't. And they won't. This is the story. They knew it was coming, did nothing about it, lied to cover it up.

THAT'S THE STORY, DEMS. NOW GET BACK TO IT!

..... "The couldn't protect the House pages. How can we expect them to protect our country?" ........ and then we launch back into the stuff in Woobward's book.

but issues do NOT. Voters are have been dumbed down too much! But this time it will play to our advantage!

.... the scandal will dominate the media for weeks, no matter what we do. And that's all good. As you say, sex scandals win elections.

My point is that we can use our time more productively to propel the hard newz stories revealed in Woodward's book at the same time the media gets its ratings rocks off with the Foley thing.

Use it to get a foot in the door, and turn it to the hard news. How many Dems are going to get on MTP with Woodward's book? Not bloody many. How many will get on with Foleygate? Loads.

Use Foley to get in, then smash 'em over the head. Don't throw away the battering ram.

n/t

But the beauty of this is - it's a win-win either way for us. If we move the discussion away from Foley to Woodward and Iraq, we get back to OUR strongest issue - the fiasco in Iraq. If we stay with Foley, we pound the bad guys on one of THEIR strongest issues - presumed morality. Either way, it'll hurt the republi-CONS.

But it's exquisitely delicious to add in the angry suspicion "what ELSE are they covering up?" What ELSE are they lying about?"

LOVE this, Dr. Fate! Such a terrific reminder. I hope you're all over these boards repeating it.

I just can't keep up with them...

No, we need to keep this on the front page every day until Novembra 7th

You know how the constipated conservatives and Republicans love sex scandals....

Unfortunately this story is our win, sad but true

Lets let them have it, stomp the rebubes until it hurts

.... Yes, we need Foley on Page 1.

But it needs to be on ***our*** page 2. The media will keep it going.

This is all we have, we have tried with Condoloser lying about Sept 11th and what she knew,
torture didnt help
state of denial is not helping


This sex scandal sells, its like a perversion to them,(no pun intended)
they eat this stuff up (no pun intended)
I guarantee you, this will give us a win in Novembra

But we need to be **ahead** of stories, not just blithely riding their crests.

I am in NO WAY saying we need to back off. just that we need to let it play on its own and get involved only when we have to fan the flames or make a specific point.

This story will be around for weeks.

This is good focal point. The story will be thrown down the memory hole without active political efforts by progressive forces.

This story has weeks' worth of legs without anything from our side.

There is a rightist bias. The media are used to consuming GOP spin, and this must be countered.

Remember- Democrats refused to exploit that story- the media let it die as quickly as they could-as a result, the average swing voter knows who Jennifer Flowers, etc is but has never even heard of Jeff Gannon.

The media (and sadly, DEMS with media access) also let the NSA sex scandal die- when was the last you heard any word on that one?

I disagree- the way the media treated the Gannon & NSA sex stories tends to prove you wrong. DEMS and DEMS only need to make sure this cover-up stays water-cooler fodder until November.

For this story, the media will stay all over it no matter what we do. This has a VERY simple plot line and no intrigue and it has an admitted perpetrator. See, the media had it handed to them. no work. Just blab. And they'll blab forever about it ...... beating this horse until long after its dead.

The other stories were simply too much work for the media. This one's being played out in press conferences. Ya see the difference?

And damaging as hell- yet DEMS refused to exploit it.

It came complete with provacative photos & secret service records- it was ready for TV, prime time stuff.

And I dont share your trust that the media will treat this any differently- unless we catapult the propaganda and keep it in the echo chamber ourselves.

I wish I could agree with you- but the average swing-voter will change the channel if the subject is a fancy-pants book that they will never read.

Swing-voter: Some book says that Condi Lied? Ho Hum. "They all lie." CLICK.

Swing-voter: SEX? Did you say SEX??? PUT DOWN THE REMOTE & PASS THE POP CORN!!!

.... and that's exactly why I'm positing this.

When the sheeple tune in for the sex fix, we get in the news talking about GOP Lies. And we tie it to the sex.

"If they're lying about Foley, what else have they lied about?"

"If they can't protect our kids, how can we expect them to protect the country?"

Ya gotta stay **ahead** of the curve, not just ride the crest of it.

The media is not going to tie this to those things before they drop the story- it is our job to establish those connex and to keep the core story going.

And that was *exactly* my OP's point.

And Woodward's book is the display case, if you will, for those goodies.

n/t

trying to hold back a bursting damn. Oh boy, better go with flow yet....

I said, in the OP:

"Our only productive role might be to hand them more bullets when the gunfire slows down a bit. This scandal's on autopilot right now."

In other words, fan the flames when it starts to burn out.

"We can, of course, rhetorically tie it (Woodward's book and the allegations therein) back to Foley. And we should, just to keep picking at that scab."

See my post number 23, above.

And finally, also from the OP: "Every once in a while, tell them our plans for Iraq and for the next Congress. But more than that, we need to just keep the electorate pissed off."

But most important, rather than ride this, we need to be **ahead** of it.

Foley posts amounted to a hurricane force wind here at DU at present. Thats all I was saying.

I think anyone who had a few working brain cells didn't even need the Woodward info to come to any conclusions about 9/11 etc.

I doubt it will have much of an impact, unfortunately. Mainly because those who would be influenced by that info, have already been duly influenced by all the other revelations over the past several years. And if those thing have not swayed the rest, neither will this.

Foley, on the other hand, unfortunately, is what whets the public's appetite and keeps them watching politics.

It's sick but true.

..... I think there are some who had a dropped jaw with Woodward's last book and remember it validating what they thought back then - Bush as hero.

So to have the same guy come out and show him as a liar is just cognitive dissonance that might throw their 'group think' all out of whack. Call it 'jaw drop two'.

If this were a presidential year, I'd agree with you. But since this is a congressional election, focusing on the abject corruption, malfeasance and uselessness of the GOP-controlled Congress will be much more effective than focusing on Bush's failures in Iraq. Voters tend to give their own Member a pass, even when they're blaming the President for problems. However, this scandal and the corruption it reveals hits much closer to home and, in my view, is much more likely to result in more people voting to turn these people out.

After November's election, we should turn up the heat re: Woodward's book and the other revelations that are sure to come and spend the next two years hammering away about Iraq, Bush, Cheney, Rice and lay the groundwork for a Democratic victory in 2008. And, with a Democratic Congress in place, the issue definitely won't be swept under the rug.

I counsel patience. Let the Foley/Hastert scandal play out now and take up the Woodward book after the election.

"..... book after the election."

I think we can do both ..... and that's what I'm positing.

But I also don't think it's time to move Foley to page 2.

I agree, we can do both.

.... for a few more weeks yet.