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Presidential Pardons - Where Does This Power Come From?......

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global1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-24-07 07:08 PM
Original message
Presidential Pardons - Where Does This Power Come From?......
Does the constitution give a president the power to pardon people? or is this some law that was passed by Congress at one time?

Are there any criteria that the president or the pardoned person have to meet?

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EST Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-24-07 07:12 PM
Response to Original message
1. google-presidential pardons
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Pavulon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-24-07 07:12 PM
Response to Original message
2. Article II, Section 2,
shall have power to grant reprieves and pardons for offenses against the United States, except in cases of impeachment.

People have hated the pardon for hundreds of years..
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MonkeyFunk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-24-07 08:40 PM
Response to Reply #2
7. Who
has hated the pardon for hundreds of years? It's been very popular, as far as I understand. Do you have examples?
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northzax Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-24-07 07:21 PM
Response to Original message
3. ok, since you have a 'gobal1' nickname....
I will give you a pass, for now. TO ANYONE: please read a copy of the Constitution. it's your business to know what it says.

but no, the power to pardon is absolute and unreviewable.
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global1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-24-07 11:10 PM
Response to Reply #3
9. Thanks For Giving Me The Pass - Now Let's Talk......
It's no wonder why people run for the presidency - it's just an excuse to lie, cheat, steal, start wars, kill, send others to their death - and then have a "Get Out Of Jail" card when its all over. Set your cronies up and let them have at it - then pardon them and all is forgiven.

I can't believe our founding fathers - when they put that into the Constitution - meant for it to be used in such a way. What exactly was their reasoning?

Seeing that it is in the Constitution - can Congress amend it in any way to put conditions on the presidential pardon? I know that given our current situation with *Co that this would be probably next to impossible to do (unless it is a non-binding amendment - excuse the attempt at a little humor) - but how about something like the following conditions:

1. the president can't pardon people that were in any way, shape or form working in his/her administration.
2. anybody granted a pardon can never again take and/or hold a government job/position

Incidentally - when I first posted this question on pardons - I did know where it came from. I was simply playing dumb so as to be able to have fellow DU'ers that didn't know that it was in the Constitution - learn. Sometimes that is the best way to make a point.

Right now I'm pissed that the MSM is already giving Libby a pass - saying that he will get a presidential pardon - and this is even before we know whether the jury will return a guilty verdict or not. To me that sucks.

I stated in an earlier post of mine that Bill Clinton is still being crucified for the pardon he gave to Marc Rich and that was over 6 years ago.

Fast forward to present day - and we've already accepted that * will give Libby a pardon - and we're sitting back and letting it happen. I don't understand.

Isn't there any way we can make it difficult for * to give Libby a pardon?

I know that this administration has done so many outlandish and vile things that a pardon of Libby just blends in - but come on - give me a break.

It looks like the only way that * can be stopped from pardoning his corrupt administration is for 'impeachment' proceedings to take place. I wish Pelosi would put it back on the table.




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northzax Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-25-07 02:11 PM
Response to Reply #9
11. sure, congress can amend it
the same way any other amendments happen, passing the house and senate with 2/3rds and then being approved by 2/3rds of the states. not going to happen though.

the purpose of the pardon, which has a long illustrious history going back to Magna Carta days, is to correct injustices. I think the pardon concept is actually brilliant, it allows the President to correct a potential issue without any complications. And frankkly, it isn't abused all that often (and when it is, like with Iran Contra or Ford-Nixon, it becomes a big deal.

I don't think Bush will pardon Libby, at least not until his last day in office. Since, among other things, it amounts to a tacit admission of guilt by the administration and would further enrage Congress. If Libby is convicted, he will suffer the consequences for at least two years.
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originalpckelly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-24-07 07:22 PM
Response to Original message
4. Yeah, it does come from the US Constitution, and pardons are forbidden...
in cases of impeachment.
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marlakay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-24-07 07:40 PM
Response to Original message
5. Why did Bill let Marc Rich go free??
I just read the wikipedia page on pardons.
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PATRICK Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-24-07 08:25 PM
Response to Original message
6. If Habeas corpus can
be cavalierly dismissed, legislation expanding on the Constitutional definition is modest. The catch with the "impeachment" exception is conflict of interest and pre-emptive pardons whose purpose will turn out to be to avoid impeachment. Not so strangely, as with George Ist and the Governor of (Kentucky?) people were given pardons who could have stood as witnesses in the impeachment of the all-merciful pardoner himself.

Closing the loophole is tricky if it is not to run aground on- you guessed it, the conflicted SCOTUS of George II. Pardons have been used strategically by not wholesale, otherwise Nixon would have been busy with pre-emptive pardons, even that of Agnew over petty crimes as a self-protective measure. In that case the public fallout at that time would have outweighed the purely strategic- and partial- benefit. No, Nixon took the firing intimidation method the other way. The Bush weasels before George II went nuts
prefer avoidance of accountability in all its forms. if pressed, their reaction would tend not to be combative Nixonian, but smothering propaganda and disheartening jailhouse lawyer tricks. They risk because there are no signs of imminent accountability. As long as there are no imminent signs they have time to veer things away which itself provides a pain-filled bulwark of CYA for the future.

So with Nixon, the confrontation, the slugfest could build until the Congress and nation had worked itself up and prepared, slapping back defensively, learning and getting courage. George II floats like a god above it all and makes the least effort in extraordinary moves that keep the confrontation from even getting above water. Even the lapdog press has noted many times that such and such is bringing us to a Constitutional confrontation and it never happens. The Constitution just becomes so much toilet tissue. This fear of pardons is a shameful joke because not only is no urgency felt to pardon or fire or flee or fight there is simply no need. The same with the magic "pretext for war" which is substituted- mercifully for some, I suppose- with easy lies and pre-emptive war. All the heads of state who should be scared out of their minds and plotting are playing the same "leadership MIA" game as the Congress, the press, the business world simply let POTUS make moves and deal with the consequences.

We look to Congress, tho mass movement of media stifled deceived and invisibly repressed masses, world leaders, the law and everywhere we discover the softer evil of the stupefying Bushes has ridden tame horse of all weakness to the top. A quick, jarring vicious response is called for, but even vicious jarring people as evil as the Bushes are naturally averse to doing it. On this global scale it is seeing a simple miserable human behavior flaw taken to an absolute, mind boggling extreme as the lives of countless people are needlessly taken, billions threatened, a nation ruined, a world moving toward doom and even the bad guys in the lifeboat looking like scared rats who are suspecting they themselves
have as little hope as that which they would deny others.

And no one is getting the message out front and clear that the regime has to fall. At this level, such as waiting for all people to be just for the Messiah to come, or falling back on Divine intervention and doing nothing, the stakes have been incredibly raised such as no law can ever exist, no common statue be enforced but that the entire human race- too late- will line up behind a crisis and actually push in the correct and winning direction. That standard in the World vs. the Bushes is championed by all human frailty and to put off facing it down is the single definitive decision forced upon us to choose our very survival- or at least a human soul.

Forget the pardons and the torment the unpunished Bushes can continue to plague humanity with in their limited forever and demand justice begin at the top, now and completely. Everything else provides them- and their alliances with the worst of everything- more victims and more impunity.
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Jack Rabbit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-24-07 08:48 PM
Response to Original message
8. Article 2, Section 2
The President shall be Commander in Chief of the Army and Navy of the United States, and of the Militia of the several States, when called into the actual Service of the United States; he may require the Opinion, in writing, of the principal Officer in each of the executive Departments, upon any subject relating to the Duties of their respective Offices, and he shall have Power to Grant Reprieves and Pardons for Offenses against the United States, except in Cases of Impeachment.

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AtomicKitten Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-24-07 11:18 PM
Response to Original message
10. Ah, from Jesus?
It's one of the perks of the job that inevitably pisses somebody off.
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