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Watch - Side-by-side test: Interceptor vs. Dragon Skin Body Armor

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wakeme2008 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-21-07 02:16 PM
Original message
Watch - Side-by-side test: Interceptor vs. Dragon Skin Body Armor
http://tinyurl.com/258akl

And ask why the Army does not want the best Body Armor for our troops.

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HiFructosePronSyrup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-21-07 02:19 PM
Response to Original message
1. Why? Money.
The people who approve of the interceptor and "disapprove" Dragon Skin are getting money off of troops dying.

It's quite illegal.
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Tellurian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-21-07 02:21 PM
Response to Original message
2. I watched it too..
The excuse they used was the "dragon skin's" performance would not perform similarly under the extreme heat conditions in Iraq.
I think an Independent is going to do the testing in Iraq for verification of T/F.
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Fabio Donating Member (929 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-21-07 02:59 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. Dragonskin has performance benefits and drawbacks
Pros

-Increased coverage area for rifle protection
-Some flexibility

Cons

-No Armor Piercing (AP) Round protection
-Poor coverage for shots from angled from below wearer
-fragile (ceramic)



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HiFructosePronSyrup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-21-07 03:03 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. Didn't watch the video, did you?
They tested it with armor piercing rounds, and it offers more coverage than the interceptor.
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Tellurian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-21-07 03:36 PM
Response to Reply #4
8. I watched it on the Today Show... Lisa Myer reporting,
The bottom line was the extreme heat (element) that affects performance, to it's detriment, so they say..
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Arkansas Granny Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-21-07 03:20 PM
Response to Original message
5. Is there any way to find out who has the contract for supplying
the Interceptor body armor? It would be interesting to find out whether or not they are a big Republican donor.
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wakeme2008 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-21-07 03:26 PM
Response to Reply #5
6. Well they did hire the right retired Generals
:grr:

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Tellurian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-21-07 03:40 PM
Response to Reply #5
9. No doubt about it. Bush et al are invested in the body armour..
and the bigger scandal would be if they have a vested interest in the artificial limbs supplied by the VA!
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Tellurian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-21-07 04:16 PM
Response to Reply #5
11. Yes, Hillary is right on this..

May 18, 2007

Senators Clinton & Webb Call for Investigation into the Effectiveness of Body Armor Issued to Our Troops

Washington, DC - In light of recent media reports suggesting that a particular body armor system may offer better protection than the system currently being used by our servicemembers, Senators Hillary Rodham Clinton (D-NY) and Jim Webb (D-VA) - both members of the Senate Armed Services Committee - today called on Comptroller General of the United States David M. Walker to initiate a Government Accountability Office (GAO) investigation to reassess the body armor systems currently being issued by all the military services and the Special Operations Command for effectiveness and reliability against the threats facing U.S. troops in combat.

"With United States troops risking their lives daily in Iraq, Afghanistan and elsewhere, we owe it to them to make sure they have the best equipment possible," Senator Clinton said.

"For several years, I have heard reports from active duty troops and military experts that Dragon Skin body armor is more effective than that currently being used," said Senator Webb. "We owe it to those who are in harm's way to examine conclusively whether this is true."

Recent media reports suggest that the Pinnacle Dragon Skin Body Armor system may offer better protection than Interceptor Body Armor currently being used by our servicemembers. In light of these revelations - along with constituent concerns expressed to the Senators describing servicemembers and government personnel in Iraq and Afghanistan wearing alternative body armor systems because of concerns about inadequate body armor currently being issued to service members - the Senators requested that the scope of the GAO review include:

1) A comparison and testing of the Interceptor Body Armor system with other commercially available products including the Pinnacle Dragon Skin Body Armor system and the Special Operations Forces Equipment Advanced Requirements (SPEAR) to determine if troops are currently issued the best available body armor system;

2) A determination of the necessary procurement steps required to obtain and field the best body armor systems for the armed forces;

3) A review to confirm compliance and applicability of current body armor system policies and Safety-of-Use Messages for wear that apply to conventional forces and special operations forces in Iraq and Afghanistan.



The full text of the Senators' letter to the Comptroller General follows:

May 18, 2007

The Honorable David M. Walker
Comptroller General of the United States
United States Government Accountability Office
441 G Street, N.W.
Washington, D.C. 20548

Dear Mr. Walker:

We are writing to request that the Government Accountability Office conduct an investigation that would reassess body armor systems currently being issued by all the military services and the Special Operations Command for effectiveness and reliability against the threats facing our troops in combat.

Recent media reports suggest that the Pinnacle Dragon Skin Body Armor system may offer better protection than Interceptor Body Armor currently being used by our service members. Additionally, we have received constituent inquiries describing service members and government personnel in Iraq and Afghanistan wearing alternative body armor systems because of concerns about performance shortcomings with body armor procured by the Department of Defense.

We owe it to our men and women in uniform serving in Iraq, Afghanistan, and other hazardous regions to provide them with the best possible body armor. Continuing allegations that superior body armor may be available but is not being acquired by the Department of Defense warrant an independent assessment.

In light of these revelations and constituent concerns we request that the Government Accountability Office reassess the various body armor systems currently being employed by all branches of the armed forces and the Special Operations Command for effectiveness and reliability against the threats facing our troops in combat. The scope of this review should include:

(1) a comparison and testing of the Interceptor Body Armor system with other commercially available products including the Pinnacle Dragon Skin Body Armor system and the Special Operations Forces Equipment Advanced Requirements (SPEAR) to determine if our troops are currently issued the best available body armor system;

(2) a determination of the necessary procurement steps required to obtain and field the best body armor systems for the armed forces; and (

3) a review to confirm compliance and applicability of current body armor system policies and Safety-of-Use Messages for wear that apply to conventional forces and special operations forces in Iraq and Afghanistan.

We look forward to your prompt response. Thank you for your consideration.

Sincerely yours,

Hillary Rodham Clinton
James Webb

CC: Robert M. Gates, Secretary of Defense;
Senator Carl Levin, Chairman, Senate Armed Services Committee












http://clinton.senate.gov/news/statements/details.cfm?id=274752&&
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LiberalFighter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-21-07 03:30 PM
Response to Original message
7. Response from Murray Neal, CEO, Pinnacle Armor, Inc.
Read the rest of it here Response from Murray Neal, CEO, Pinnacle Armor, Inc

"After reading the US Army’s latest Safety of Use Message (SOUM) dealing with the effectiveness of Pinnacle Armor’s Dragon Skin body armor, and viewing the Army’s press brief by Major General Sorenson, I wish to respond to the assertions, allegations and innuendo. It is our belief that your criticism of Dragon Skin is simply wrong and unwarranted.

Despite all the testing of Dragon Skin armor systems by numerous Federal, State, Local, D.o.D. and other Federal agencies, - including the Army’s own Army Research Lab, as well as a D.o.D. approved ballistic test facility, the Army still refuses to accept the fact that our Level 3 and the new level 4 Dragon Skin body armor - researched, designed and produced by an individual entrepreneur - is years ahead of the currently issued SAPI/Interceptor rigid plate system.

Dragon Skin exceeds in nine areas of performance and capabilities: flexibility with increased mobility, lower system weight, durability, greater torso coverage, less trauma to the body, better edge-hit capability, increased multiple/repeat hit capability, increased projectile diversity resistance, and ergonomic design. Dragon Skin capabilities have been proven to be significant improvements over the current Army issue.

Developed in 1996, we have provided full torso coverage Dragon Skin armor numerous times to deployed personnel. They purchased Dragon Skin armor with their own money after their first deployment. We hear and read reports that troops are complaining that the currently issued rigid armor is too heavy, too cumbersome, does not fit well and seriously restricts movement. And these reports are from troops who have been in-theater wearing it, and this latest iteration has been out less than three months!
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LiberalFighter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-21-07 03:53 PM
Response to Reply #7
10. DHB Industries
Larry R. Ellis
Senator (Ret.) William Campbell
Jack A. Henry
David Bell
Maurice Hannigan
General (Ret.) Martin R. Berndt
Suzanne Hopgood
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porque no Donating Member (180 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-21-07 06:02 PM
Response to Reply #10
12. Ellis?
where have I heard that before?
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porque no Donating Member (180 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-21-07 06:14 PM
Response to Reply #12
13. don't think it's the right Ellis.
}(
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LiberalFighter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-21-07 10:09 PM
Response to Reply #12
15. JEB Bush = John Ellis Bush
Edited on Mon May-21-07 10:11 PM by LiberalFighter
Ellis is a family name. Bush family has a tradition of using it for middle names.
Walker for GWB and GHWB

There was a John Ellis involved with the 2000 Election as a political advisor for FOX. He is a first cousin.
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Greyhound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-21-07 06:25 PM
Response to Original message
14. SOP for the DOD. You don't really think that they give two shits about the troops do you?
Any organization that can blow through a trillion dollars and not be able to scrape together and properly equip 200,000 troops, is sending most of that money out the back door to their friends.

You pick any military project at random, do a little investigation, and you will always find that they are spending the majority of the money on unnecessary, non-functional, crap at hugely inflated prices provided by their friends and associates.


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