Why do people use the word patriot a lot when describing kerry and clark?

ProudToBeLiberal

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Sat Feb-14-04 02:37 AM
Original message

Why do people use the word patriot a lot when describing kerry and clark?

Is the word patriot only reserved for people who served in the arm forces? For me i think a patriot is a person who wants to uphold the constitution. I think everyone of the democratic presidential contenders are true patriots.

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George_Bonanza

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Sat Feb-14-04 02:39 AM
Response to Original message

1. They are patriots of the highest sense

They went out and gave everything they had to protect the men of their country. Not only that, but John Kerry did all that AND came back to protest the muddled war in which he lost six of his best friends in. You can hardly do more for your nation than that.

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Name removed

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Sat Feb-14-04 02:41 AM
Response to Reply #1

2. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

ProudToBeLiberal

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Sat Feb-14-04 02:47 AM
Response to Reply #1

5. Well then concientous objectors

Edited on Sat Feb-14-04 02:50 AM by ProudToBeLiberal

can never be true patriots? I think that is bull. People can serve their country in many different ways. For example by taking it to the streets....civil disobedience

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George_Bonanza

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Sat Feb-14-04 03:13 AM
Response to Reply #5

11. There's more than one "highest sense" of patriotism

Edited on Sat Feb-14-04 03:17 AM by George_Bonanza

Risking your life for your countrymen is at least one of them, no?

John Kerry was not some anti-gook jinogist drill sergeant who thought that all Viet Cong deserved to be burned alive in napalm. He went and did what he thought was best for his country. He saved more than a few good citizens from his homeland. And when he came back, he fought to end the misery and injustice he had to endure. So he's a patriot on both sides of the coin: the soldier and the protester. How can you get more patriotic than that?

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JohnKleeb

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Sat Feb-14-04 03:16 AM
Response to Reply #11

13. I agree with his complaint but putting your life on the line is patriotic

I think. Especially for Kerry, he was a rich guy who didnt have to fight the war in Nam and though it was wrong the war rather it was a brave thing to do. I consider those who marched to protest the vietnam war and other wars patriots. Patriot such a hard word to define come to think of it.

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George_Bonanza

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Sat Feb-14-04 03:22 AM
Response to Reply #13

15. Vietnam War was terribly misguided

But there were thousands of innocent and powerless young men sent abroad to die for a hazy cause. People like Wesley Clark and John Kerry felt it was their duty to defend those people forced into war from enemy brutality. Quite the conundrum. And when John Kerry got back, he did the best that was humanly possible to stop what he experienced first-hand as a grave miscarriage of justice. While I agree that those who try and end wars that involve their country are just as patriotic as those who risk their lives in one, I certainly have tons of respect for anybody who has the strength to fight in a war, even if it's not right. That's just my opinion.

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NV1962

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Sat Feb-14-04 02:41 AM
Response to Original message

3. Simple: to p*ss off the GOPers who claim ownership of that word

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BootinUp

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Sat Feb-14-04 02:45 AM
Response to Original message

4. traditionally it is used in connection with military service

but I have certainly seen it used to describe service to the country in other ways too, so you are correct.

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JohnOneillsMemory

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Sat Feb-14-04 02:54 AM
Response to Original message

6. 'Patriot' = Nationalist=Racist= Murder. Willing to kill for your zip code.

But that's simply the truth in human terms, not currently in vogue.

In this Orwellian world of indoctrinated children sent to kill for corporate masters, 'Patriotism' is highly valued and respected.

Very sad.

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HuskerDem

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Sat Feb-14-04 03:27 AM
Response to Reply #6

16. What is very sad

Is that some will neither see nor hear evil or examine shades of grey. I remember the world of black and white. I wish I knew everything again.

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JohnOneillsMemory

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Sat Feb-14-04 03:43 AM
Response to Reply #16

19. To kill on commands from a corrupt government is all black, no white. n/t

Edited on Sat Feb-14-04 03:53 AM by JohnOneillsMemory

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HuskerDem

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Sat Feb-14-04 03:55 AM
Response to Reply #19

20. Like I said

I wish I knew everything again, that was such a romantic time of life.............

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MrSlayer

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Sat Feb-14-04 02:55 AM
Response to Original message

7. Because they put their lives on the line for the country.

Doesn't mean they love the country anymore than you do. It just means they put it on front street. A "blue blood elitist" who voluntarily served his country in combat despite his connections that could have got him out of it. And a regular working class guy who pushed himself to Supreme Allied Commander of N.A.T.O. after being a hero in Vietnam and a first in his class Rhodes Scholar. They are far more patriotic in my eyes than the Chimp and his masters who are only out for personal wealth and power.

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ProudToBeLiberal

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Sat Feb-14-04 02:59 AM
Response to Reply #7

8. is kerry and clark

far more patriotic then the nuns who got arrested for defacing the nuclear facility? Are they more patriotic then the people who get teared or shot by rubble bullets for protesting the Iraq War? I think not.

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JohnKleeb

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Sat Feb-14-04 03:12 AM
Response to Reply #8

10. They are patriots

These people. They are mainly called patriotic because the word patriotism connation with military service. I disagree with it, though I have the highest regard for those who do serve their country. I personally feel a soldier's duty is as patriotic as the protester who protests the war, hell to be honest with you, I even feel the everyday work of a blue collar worker is patriotic. I dont like the word patriot being used with military service only. I agree with your feelings here but its the military service thing.

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JohnOneillsMemory

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Sat Feb-14-04 03:14 AM
Response to Reply #8

12. You're revering 'Humanity', not Patriotism. See the definition in #6.

Edited on Sat Feb-14-04 03:15 AM by JohnOneillsMemory

Patriotism means love of the fatherland. See the dictionary.

Defining the borders of a nation as your special 'love zone' is by definition as inhumane as defining it as your race, religion, sexual orientation, hair color or whatever arbitrary way you want to exclude some humans from your love.

Like it or not, that is what the word Patriot means. If you want to attach humanity and nobility to a word, choose another one.

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Sat Feb-14-04 03:09 AM
Response to Original message

9. MLK and RFK (post-67) were patriots. TR was an imperialist, but he was

a patriot who cared about his country not because he was a rough rider, but because he busted trusts.

You're right.

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HuskerDem

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Sat Feb-14-04 03:20 AM
Response to Original message

14. Taking lead for your country by choice

risking your life for your countries call, kind up trumps things like anal cysts and other draft dodging nonsense.

Personally I have respect for two groups, the ones who went and the ones who dodged with balls. I mean the ones who burned their draft cards and said FU! I had a tough time with Clinton's evasion and Dean's bad back/ski trip was pretty cowardly too.

That being said I believe all of our Democratic candidates love this country, and are patriotic. It just falls logically that war heroes will more often be referred to as patriots because of the sacrifices they made while others were content to let someone else go in their place.

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BootinUp

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Sat Feb-14-04 03:32 AM
Response to Reply #14

17. medical descriptions of Rush Limbaugh's

butt are beyond the pale! :spank:

don't do that again!

:)

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HuskerDem

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Sat Feb-14-04 03:57 AM
Response to Reply #17

21. sorry, my bad :-)

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JohnOneillsMemory

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Sat Feb-14-04 03:37 AM
Response to Reply #14

18. I share your respect for courage of conviction but revile Nationalism.

Unfortunately, even our government does not represent the people and lies to them constantly.

We have learned that the military is used as the muscle for corporate murder, not to 'defend our freedoms.'

Borders/flags/nations are arbitrary constructs of blood, gang territory, not human indentity.

In 1979, I was 18 when Carter reinstated Selective Service registration in response to the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan.

My progressive and hippy friends didn't sign up.

I did because my attitude was "bring it on!" I intended to file CO if drafted and make the biggest media stink I could muster against the Military Industrial Complex.

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HuskerDem

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Sat Feb-14-04 03:59 AM
Response to Reply #18

22. I could have respected that

If you're going to dodge, do it with a giant middle finger for all the world to see.

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aldian159

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Sat Feb-14-04 04:51 AM
Response to Original message

23. Because the right

loves to call any liberals traitors. so they are saying "yes, I'm a democrat, and a patriot." lots have been saying that libs don't equal pats.

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Piperay

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Sat Feb-14-04 04:53 AM
Response to Original message

24. There all different kinds of American Patriots

who are deserving of the definition for all kinds of reasons. I'm not limiting 'American Patriot' to just those who are in the military, I just happen to think Clark fits the bill for a number of reasons. One reason being that I think it was courageous that a General took the risk of running in the Democratic Party and also supporting the party, they usually like to hide out amongst the repukes. I also enjoy reminding the repuke RWinger idiots that it is not their term and that we have some American Patriots of our own and some of them were in the military.

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jpgpenn

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Sat Feb-14-04 07:09 AM
Response to Original message

25. Seems like your the one with the issue.

In your own meaning of the word it applies to anyone that upholds the constituion. Are you saying they don't uphold the constitution? is it a problem for you because the masses aren't going around referring to you as a patriot? Do you feel your aren't getting the attention you deserve because the masses aren't going around referring to you as a patriot?

You see where a conversation like this can go?

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