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Vyan Donating Member (990 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-08-07 03:46 PM
Original message
Right Wing Attacks Live Earth .. and misses by a Planet
Edited on Sun Jul-08-07 04:35 PM by Vyan

Today I wanted to talk about John Conyers on This Week saying the I-Word out loud in reference to the recent ARG poll indicating that well over 50% of the American people favor the Impeachment of Bush and Cheney, and the fact that the White House has refused to let Sara Taylor testify in the DOJ hearings pushing Congress one step closer to a Contempt Citation.

I wanted to talk about Bill Kristol admitting that the timing fo the Libby commute was engineered to create a debate over the Clinton pardons, a debate which they happen to be losing badly.

These are very worthwhile subjects, but instead I'm going to focus yet again on Live Earth and just how freaking desperate and deranged it has began to make the Climate Change Deniers Club ™ .

Now I've had my own criticism's of Live Earth's lineup which I posted yesterday, but I'm not going to revise that debate because in many ways it's beside the point.

What I felt while watching Live Earth is that it really isn't about which bands did and didn't play or what they played. It was about reaching out all across the world and lighting a potential spark inside BILLIONS OF PEOPLE which just might change and save this world from itself.

The shear scope of this event has been staggering. It has shown that we can rise to this challenge even though it may seem daunting and enormous. We can each take steps, take responsibility in our own lives to help make this world cleaner, greener and possible last just a little bit longer.

The fact that they've gotten a person like me, someone who'se been an extremely outspoken and acerbic critic of modern music for the past 15 years to finally put that all that aside - just for moment - with a concert this massive is a stunning accomplishment.

Let me tell you Micheal Mustow has nothing on me when it comes to being a brutal and vicious critic of modern music. If you think political debate can be rough-house knock-down drag-out tussle, just try discussing music with musicians sometime.

In fact, I'm certain that over the years there are people who are flat-out afraid to discuss their favorite (fill-in-the-blank emo/neo-punk/cool hair-cut/pop-tart/rough trade) band with me to this very day because as both a music performer, fan and critic for 20 years I'll probably verbally rip that band into tiny peices of confetti, then burn the confetti without batting an eye.

Today though, I think I'd use those ashes in a compost pile just so I could say they'd finally accomplished something worthwhile.

Anywho... instead of debating matters of musical taste and preference let us turn to the wretched hive of scum and villany housing the Climate Change Deniers who I think we should rank along side those who continue to deny the Holocaust, those who continue to deny that Saddam was not the Mastermind of 9/11, and the last remaining 26% percent (Newsweek 7/3) of us who continue to deny that the Sock-Puppet Presidency of George W.Bush and his D/s Top Richard B. "Shooter" Cheney is a Fucking Disastrous Blight on This Nation.

Last night on TFucker Carlson, one of these CCD mouth breathers from the oil and gas lobby powered "Competitive" Enterprise Institute actually said that ....

Al Gore has been looking for a world crisis his own life, where he can come through and "save the world" He wants to be a Superhero Action Figure. Basically he makes this stuff up {about global warming}. There is no scientific support for most his claims.

A Superhero? Y'mean like Commander Guy ™ Here!?

No Scientific Support?

This guy actually went on National TV - while the Live Earth Concerts were taking place - and said there's No Scientific Support for what Al Gore has been saying about Climate Change?

Is that not dumb as rocks stunning?

I mean most of these guys - like say, trusty ole' Fourthbranch - usually argue that the science is "inconclusive" or that the "debate is still ongoing", but this guy, Myron Ebell, just can't seem to contain himself. He's so full of crap it's coming out of eyes, ears, nose and mouth.

Then he changed tactics and began to actually argue in favor of conservation by claiming that the Live Earth concerts were a bad idea because they use too much energy!

Which side of this mental hopscotch game are these guys playing on?

So let me get this one straight - there's "No Scientific Evidence" to support Gore's Climate Change thesis that the emission of CO2 gasses into the atmosphere tend to create a greenhouse effect which is gradually warming our planet and threatening to drastically and radically change our eco-system - yet, you really shouldn't use up all that energy cuz it's like bad, mm,kay?

Has anyone ever taught this nitwit 4th Grade Science where they usually mention, even in your basic Neo-Christian Madrossa in the buckle of the bible belt where some seem to think the Sun revolves around the Earth, that Venus the cloud covered planet is actually hotter than Mercury which is closest to the Sun?

Anyone?

Beuller?

Before I get to the really Stupifying stuff, let's point out that the Live Earth organizers went to agonizing lengths to limit the amount of travel that performers would have to make in order to reach the show.

Live Earth strives to operate in as ecofriendly a way as possible: Several staffers are dedicated entirely to helping artists minimize the environmental impact of getting to and playing the shows, and each artist is given a "Green Handbook" of touring tips, such as where to get biodiesel for their trucks and how to offset carbon emissions. And in London, the team has been discussing a deal with Richard Branson's Virgin Atlantic Airlines to reduce the carbon footprint for flights

Not only did they suggest that the artist shift to using bio-deisel for their tour vehicles - which Willie Nelson has been doing for years - they even used bio-deisel generators at the venues where possible. Also LED and compact florescent lights were employed for the show, which only use a fraction of the energy required by normal bulbs.

From the AP.

"This is going to be the greenest event of its kind, ever," former Vice President and Live Earth partner Al Gore told The Associated Press. "The carbon offsets and the innovative practices that are being used to make this a green event, I think, will set the standard for years to come."

The point is not to make the everything perfectly green, but simply to make events such as this - and for that matter most of what we do in our own private lives - greener and greener, as carbon neutral as we can get it bit by bit rather than all at once.

On this point Live Earth dramatically unveiled the lie beneath the rightwings more vicious canard. We don't have to live like Geico's favorite political-correction safe whipping boy - the caveman. We shouldn't be thinking that being Eco-friendly means living under a rock with a machette, a bic lighter and a few pairs of birkenstocks. We can LIVE IT UP and have a great big global party - and still be green. Living green isn't going to be bad for the economy and it isn't going to be bad for business. Well, to be fair, it might be really bad for the brown businesses like the ones who fund Myron and his sociopathic ilk, but then they deserve it don't cha think?

And of course, that's exactly what scares Myron - Sugardaddy Warbucks might have to go on a diet. So naturally he lashes out at those damn dirty liberals who are a threat to his meal ticket.

Global warming is a creation of the left, and the left is all about re-distributing income. We have to become an awful lot poorer, and the people in China have to become a little bit poorer to solve this problem according to the Global Warming Alarmists like Al Gore.

Yeah, we're all going to be in the poor house if we adopt cleaner emissions standards. Oh wait, most of us already are in the po' house - so much so we can't even afford to buy another vowel for the rest of the word. So gee, what's there to really lose then, eh?

And speaking of that completely non-existent Scientific Evidence...

On May 26th, James Hansen, the head of NASA’s Goddard Institute Of Space Studies and the top U.S. climate scientist, issued a new warning about the threat of a catastrophic rise in sea levels.

I suggest that a "scientific reticence" is inhibiting the communication of a threat of a potentially large sea level rise. Delay is dangerous because of system inertias that could create a situation with future sea level changes out of our control. I argue for calling together a panel of scientific leaders to hear evidence and issue a prompt plain-written report on current understanding of the sea level change issue.

And then there's the Intergovernmental Panel On Climate Change which released three reports.

One on the Science of Global Warming.

In a grim and powerful assessment of the future of the planet, the leading international network of climate scientists has concluded for the first time that global warming is "unequivocal" and that human activity is the main driver, "very likely" causing most of the rise in temperatures since 1950.

One on the Impacts of Global Warming, not only on natural resources but also on our global security.

If the impact of climate change is going to make regions of violence poorer, then they really provide a level of fertility for inciting disaffection, resentment against the prosperous world. That’s an indirect effect that can create the conditions for terrorism. There is also domestic reasons. If higher-intensity hurricanes create a lot of damage, that does in some sense have security-implications as well. There is a whole range of factors. Water scarcity is another one. I’m not saying all this translates into direct threats to the U.S., but conflict anywhere has some implication for security in the U.S. As the most powerful and most prosperous nation on Earth, it is for the U.S. to take a global view of what strategically might minimize the possibility of threats to national security.

And a third on the relatively Modest Cost of implementing Green Friendly measures to combat Climate Change.

Humans must make sweeping cuts in greenhouse gas emissions in the next 50 years to keep global warming in check, but it need cost only a tiny fraction of world economic output, a major U.N. report said on Friday.

The Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) said keeping the temperature rise within 2 degrees Celsius (3.6 F) would cost only 0.12 percent of annual gross domestic product.

Not that the facts have ever really gotten in the way of chronic deniers like Myron and his pals.

Fox News: "Al Gore’s Global Warming Movie: Could It Destroy Our Economy?"

Rush Limbaugh: "{Liberals} would have us destroy our economy and millions of jobs based on pseudoscience."

James Inhofe: "Global warming is an alarmism. It’s a type of a hoax. The reality is that a cap on carbon is a cap on the economy."

I'm thinking these guys are going to be spending time in the history books being compared to their bestest buddy Ahmadinajad for their incredible level of denial, nigh unto a pathological addiction to bullcrap.

But y'know maybe that's just me.

I'm just saying...

Vyan

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Alamom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-08-07 03:51 PM
Response to Original message
1. Great post. Thank you. rec.
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drm604 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-08-07 04:00 PM
Response to Original message
2. K&R
Great Post.
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Viva_La_Revolution Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-08-07 04:02 PM
Response to Original message
3. nice.
k&r
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FloridaJudy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-08-07 04:14 PM
Response to Original message
4. K&R for a terrific rant n/t
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BrklynLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-08-07 04:22 PM
Response to Original message
5. I am printing this out and handing to people who voice doubt about Global Warming.
Edited on Sun Jul-08-07 04:22 PM by BrklynLiberal
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emanymton Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-08-07 04:33 PM
Response to Original message
6. You Need To Let Your Feelings Out. I Sense In Your Post, ...
that maybe you are holding back. Is there something that seems to have made you upset?
_______

You are right on the money with the losers on the other side. It is really bad that the other side cannot come to grips with the truth.

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Vyan Donating Member (990 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-08-07 04:36 PM
Response to Reply #6
7. Naw, I'm Peachy...
Just M-Peachy!

Vyan
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MGKrebs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-08-07 04:37 PM
Response to Original message
8. Recent email from Newsmax, shilling some "report" or magazine or something:
After several paragraphs asking suggestive questions, we get to the meat:

Al Gore's real agenda: 2008.
The Aral Sea and Mt. Kilimanjaro issues — two glaring "convenient lies" in Al Gore's film.
The myth of a man-caused sea level rise: why Florida and California will remain dry.
How modern temperature-measuring techniques could be giving a "false positive" to global warming.
Why computer models predicting climate change are necessarily flawed.
The optimistic global temperature rise projection that Gore ignored.
Why a prominent MIT professor says global warming is an out-and-out fraud.


And yet, in the same email ALERT:

An expert's four common-sense "alternative cures" for global warming.
How a clean energy source — which already exists — could eliminate the threat of global warming.


OK, so it's all a myth, BUT JUST IN CASE, here's some ways to deal with that aren't associated with Al Gore.

Sheesh. It must be hard being a conservative.
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glitch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-08-07 05:04 PM
Response to Reply #8
10. Nothing's hard after a frontal lobotomy. :) nt
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Chulanowa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-08-07 05:33 PM
Response to Reply #8
12. I imagine it is, and the medical bills...
due to whiplash from bobbling your head to everything these loons say.
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Uncle Joe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-08-07 04:57 PM
Response to Original message
9. You said a hell of lot Vyan, and I appreciate it.
Bravo!:applause:

Kicked and recommended.
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Chipper Chat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-08-07 05:19 PM
Response to Original message
11. Recommended. And thanks for calling out Myron Ebell.
He is plainly fraudulent and reminds me of a milquetoast Baghdad Bob. I wanted to kick in the TV screen.
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ChairmanAgnostic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-08-07 05:34 PM
Response to Original message
13. don't forget their attacks
on us about Iraq, their pressing the case for Iran, and their scared shitty reflexive response to Sicko.

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peacetalksforall Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-08-07 06:25 PM
Response to Original message
14. It takes all kinds of idiots to create the Corporate-Military ruling class
within the United States of Corporations. How can this 'spokesperson' go on like that and not realize how embarassing it is to humanity?

K and RECOMMEND!
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MaineYooper Donating Member (555 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-08-07 07:35 PM
Response to Original message
15. Ebell is a real piece of work.
No scientific training at all- his degrees are in philosophy and economics, and the great bulk of his employment has been for right wing think tanks (italics mine). He clearly is out of his depth in understanding the scientific arguments, yet he has the gall to criticize actual scientists and engineers who speak out on the topic if their specific scientific training isn't in climate science. He's a master of using scientific work out of context, and to top it all of, he laces it all with a smarmy arrogance of someone who clearly thinks he knows more than the rest of us.

Well written Vyan- this guy Ebell deserves nothing but ridicule. Keep up the good work!
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flyarm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-09-07 02:34 AM
Response to Original message
16. great post !! thank you !!! brilliant in fact!! eom
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dsa Donating Member (298 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-09-07 03:08 AM
Response to Original message
17. Just to nitpick a little
As a scientist, I have issues with this section of your post:

-----

"So let me get this one straight - there's "No Scientific Evidence" to support Gore's Climate Change thesis that the emission of CO2 gasses into the atmosphere tend to create a greenhouse effect which is gradually warming our planet and threatening to drastically and radically change our eco-system - yet, you really shouldn't use up all that energy cuz it's like bad, mm,kay?

"Has anyone ever taught this nitwit 4th Grade Science where they usually mention, even in your basic Neo-Christian Madrossa in the buckle of the bible belt where some seem to think the Sun revolves around the Earth, that Venus the cloud covered planet is actually hotter than Mercury which is closest to the Sun?"

-----

You really can't compare the atmosphere of Venus (96% carbon dioxide, surface pressure of 9,300 kPa, mean surface temperature of 460°C) to Earth (0.038% carbon dioxide, surface pressure of 101.3 kPa, mean surface temperature of 14°C), or Mars for that matter (96% carbon dioxide, surface pressure of 0.9 kPa, mean surface temperature of -46°C). Researchers are still trying to determine why each of these similar planets took such drastically different paths in their evolution.
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Vyan Donating Member (990 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-09-07 03:51 AM
Response to Reply #17
18. I wasn't presenting an argument
about how any of these planets were formed, I was simply pointing out the following in contrast to Ebell's claim that there was "No Scientific Evidence" of Global Warming and presumably the Greenhouse effect.

The pressure of Venus' atmosphere at the surface is 90 atmospheres (about the same as the pressure at a depth of 1 km in Earth's oceans). It is composed mostly of carbon dioxide. There are several layers of clouds many kilometers thick composed of sulfuric acid. These clouds completely obscure our view of the surface. This dense atmosphere produces a run-away greenhouse effect that raises Venus' surface temperature by about 400 degrees to over 740 K (hot enough to melt lead). <b>Venus' surface is actually hotter than Mercury's despite being nearly twice as far from the Sun.</b>


That's all.

Vyan


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dsa Donating Member (298 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-10-07 05:32 AM
Response to Reply #18
24. Not quite the point
Saying there's No Scientific Evidence of Global Warming" on Earth and the greenhouse effect doesn't exist anywhere in the universe are two completely different arguments. That's my complaint about the use of Venus in your original post. You're comparing apples and oranges.

FYI, the leading theory is that the greenhouse effect didn't start on Venus because of carbon dioxide but because of water vapor. Venus was probably covered in water like Earth. As the water evaporated, the partial pressure of vapor in the atmosphere raised temperatures causing CO2 to be released from the surface. The greenhouse effect also exists on Earth and has generally been beneficial. Without water vapor, CO2, and methane in Earth's atmosphere, the average surface temperature would drop from +14°C to about -20°C and complex animal life would probably never have developed.
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Apollo11 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-09-07 07:14 AM
Response to Reply #17
19. "You really can't compare Earth and Venus" ???
As a scientist - do you even know what the word "compare" means???

New York Times - July 1, 2007

Moving Beyond Kyoto


By AL GORE


(...)

Consider this tale of two planets. Earth and Venus are almost exactly the same size, and have almost exactly the same amount of carbon. The difference is that most of the carbon on Earth is in the ground — having been deposited there by various forms of life over the last 600 million years — and most of the carbon on Venus is in the atmosphere.

As a result, while the average temperature on Earth is a pleasant 59 degrees, the average temperature on Venus is 867 degrees. True, Venus is closer to the Sun than we are, but the fault is not in our star; Venus is three times hotter on average than Mercury, which is right next to the Sun. It’s the carbon dioxide.

(...)

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/07/01/opinion/01gore.html?ex=1184126400&en=d0116fe1fde8e185&ei=5070



Let's all find ways to show our support for Al Gore! :patriot:

Sign the Live Earth Pledge: www.liveearthpledge.org

Then ask all your friends and family to sign it too! :-)

Visit Al's site www.algore.com and read his blog http://blog.algore.com

Sign the petitions at www.algore.org and www.draftgore.com

:kick:
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dsa Donating Member (298 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jul-10-07 05:36 AM
Response to Reply #19
25. NYT doesn't get it right either
This statement is totally bogus:

"Venus is three times hotter on average than Mercury, which is right next to the Sun. It’s the carbon dioxide."

Temperature on a planet is regulated by the presence of an atmosphere. Mercury does not have one, so the side that faces the sun gets incredibly hot (430°C, nearly as not as Venus) while the poles that never see sunlight get incredibly cold (-180°C, almost as cold as Saturn). Good example of sloppy reporting.
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OnionPatch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-09-07 08:26 AM
Response to Original message
20. Their point is to plant the seeds of doubt
As long as the "debate is still out" they can stall movement to stop global warming. I'm guessing that this guy knows there is plenty of evidence. But his statement will plant a little doubt in a few uninformed people's minds.
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Pacifist Patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-09-07 08:30 AM
Response to Reply #20
22. That's it exactly. Prolong the debate ad infinitum if at all possible.
Nothing need be done if we're still debating it. Horribly irresponsible right-wing tactic, but if it lines their wallets....
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Pacifist Patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-09-07 08:29 AM
Response to Original message
21. So what do you think of Enrique Iglesias?
Just kidding! Wonderfully comprehensive post. Gladly recommended.
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olshak Donating Member (339 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-09-07 09:10 AM
Response to Original message
23. Tucker Carlson = Waste of DNA n/t
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