Salon: Netroots Start to Cheer for Hillary... "The only candidate booed louder was Dennis Kucinich."

The most self-controlled figure in Democratic politics, Hillary Clinton, seemed to know from the outset that she was walking into a trap. The cavernous ballroom of the Hyatt Regency was filled with about 1,500 liberal bloggers and activists -- the so-called Kossacks, the former Deaniacs, the people-powered Joe Lieberman-bashers who helped reshape the Democratic Party for the 21st century. So when the loud boos finally arrived, a full hour into the Democratic presidential debate at the second annual YearlyKos convention Saturday, and two hours after her arrival at the convention, all she could do was smile. "I've been waiting for this," she told the crowd. "This gives us a real sense of reality with my being here."

Then something happened: The crowd started to laugh. Then it cheered. Then the cheering grew even louder than the booing...

<--- snip of already posted information from the weekend. ---->

Even if most bloggers decide to sit out the primary, there is little doubt that they will be back with a vengeance to show their Democratic stripes once a nominee is chosen. The only candidate who was booed louder than Clinton at Saturday's presidential debate was the unlikely left-winger Dennis Kucinich. He made the mistake of aping one-time presidential candidate Ralph Nader, who regularly attacked the Democratic leadership as a bunch of sellouts. "Why don't people vote?" Kucinich asked, rhetorically. "It's because they don't think there is much of a difference between the two parties."

The booing immediately drowned Kucinich out. He had committed a cardinal sin, demeaning the Democratic Party before a crowd that works countless unpaid hours a week to make the party stronger.

http://www.salon.com/news/feature/2007/08/06/yearlykos/index.html

most in the mainstream dont see a difference

As usual

He's far less self-absorbed than any of the other candidates. His campaign is all about the neglected and ignored people in this country. Only Edwards comes close to his empathy for everyone else. His campaign is the least "Me" oriented of all of them.

would have chosen to run again this time, knowing he would be marginalized and mocked by the media and by other Democrats, including many DUers who claim to be progressive.

To anyone who attended and booed: :thumbsup:

I don't have to say that the big green lie and other manipulative and scummy Naderist folly will not be tolerated, because here we see that it already isn't! People are rising to the call to put these lies in their place!

VICTORY TO THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY! DOWN WITH NADERISM!

:shrug:

but objectively, if the net-roots have begun to support HRC, well ... I'm just not seeing anything approaching a groundswell ... and yes, I monitor many of the Liberal Sites.

However, my opinion does not matter when it is playing another tune. Therefore, enjoy your seemingly small celebration. ;) :toast:

HRC seems to have a lot of support (at least vocal support) here at DU but over all I see most of the support being shared between Edwards and Obama.

I guess we'll wait until the next Kos straw poll to see if her appearance gave her any bump.

It doesn't get worse than that. :P

Let's see if it can get any worse.

I mean, seriously they COULD HAVE chosen better. The article was positive but the picture was completely horrid. It's not like Campaign Staff aren't saying the same thing as they read it and most likely emailing them one to use as a replacement.

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Dennis is a DINO?? :rofl:

DINO or not, he's the only candidate whos votes have consistently supported my positions. Every. damned. one.

-Hoot

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you were anti-choice up until 4 years ago? Pro flag-burning amendment?

Even funnier than your other post! Forget your day job,the stand-up circuit is beckoning!

:shrug:

(btw: I am being polite)

That is hard to believe. If Hillary becomes a nom I will support her all the way, but for now I support Dennis K if Al Gore isn't running.

This was after the Dems caved to Bush AGAIN on FISA.

I have more faith in the Second Coming of Jesus (I'm not Christian) than I do in the Democratic Congress to defend the Constitution and our liberties.

Their track record is one of retreat and surrender.

Why give more power to a power mad idiot?

not ok

...

The new law makes clear that a court order is not required to conduct surveillance of foreign intelligence targets located overseas.

But under FISA, court approval is required for the government to target an individual located in the United States, and nothing in the new law changes that.

he had to rush out after the debate to get back to D.C. for the vote.

Silence is more deafening.

Until the Netroots intelligentsia understand that grassroots volunteers and ground gamers actually are the real reason that people vote, it's mostly not going to mean much except for broadband fans and email organizers that send their message in a huge box of spam.

Until you can vote online, getting people off their duffs and out to vote is where it's at. Organizing online is good if you get their email address first. Otherwise, I'd guess the interest dropoff rate is high when you say "go to this website"... I've seen it firsthand many times.

people there. And it was a rauceous debate with cheering and, yes, some booing. Everybody got booed practically based on the issues. So it was fair.

I am waiting for another report of this incident from Kos.
The above reads like a rehabilitation press release from a campaign staffer.

Anyone know what really happened?

It's not true, but it is their perception, no matter how much lockstep party loyalists claim otherwise.

Most people who do not vote do not do so either because they see no particular need for change, or because they do not expect there will be change. Neither of these is quite the same as 'no difference between the parties', and neither offers much real prospect for the mobilization of millions dreamed of by splinter activists. The first group, thinking things are more or less all right, trusts that no one in a position to actually be elected to office is going to muck it up too badly once they get in, so their vote does not make much difference. The second group understands, whether in a reasoned or intuitive matter, that there are limitations to the degree of change that can be gotten through elections, and that the level of change they may want is beyond the capabilities of the electoral process to deliver. The understandings of both these groups are sound enough as lines of analysis, and it would take real upheaval and social disruption to sway many who hold them off of them.

"The art of secrecy consists in being so open and forthright about so many things that the items one wishes kept concealed are not even suspected to exist."

We know that there's a difference but "the undecided" don't see it.

The fact that only 1/3 of Democrat senators voted for the FISA bill doesn't make any difference to them. The Democratic congress rubberstamped a violation of our rights.

I see it among the greens (and their ilk) and I see it among the independents.

The greens have bought into Naderism, and the independents have bought into the idea that government doesn't work for so long that, now that Republicans have proven that Republican government doesn't work, they're no longer able to discriminate between the big (torture, secret prisons, katrina, etc.) and the little (travelgate, etc.).

The vast majority of independents can't see the differences. They're not independent because they're faced with equally valid choices, they're independent because they can't see beyond the caricature.

Because she is talking more like a progressive liberal these days.
End the war. Universal health care. Union card check.

(or, for purposes of this thread, she's talking like a "prooooggressive")

In fact, with the exception of one Rasmunssen and one Gallup poll, she has never trailed in a single national poll.

Look, she was funny -- the reason why we laughed was it meant SOMEBODY has been reading DailyKos, and knows damned well that many Kossaks hate her guts. A little: "hey, thanks for reading" nod to the Senator from NY.

I simply do not agree with Salon's assessment on whether this "helped" Sen. Clinton. Same goes with Cokie Roberts on NPR. Until a poll is taken, that is based on crowds being largely polite, trying to give her a chance. I honestly can't name the victor of the debate -- there was no clear winner.

Nothing she did changed my mind from the fact that I will not be voting for her in the primary. And that is true of everyone I talked to (but, clearly, a poll, would be more accurate).

Edit: Kuccinich deserved the boos after pulling out a Naderite remark that there is no difference between the Dem and GOP party. Thanks, Dennis -- isn't that what got us Bush in 2000?

different from the GOP. He should have known he was wasting his time talking to Kossacks.

One more time: the majority of the people who voted for Nader would not have voted for Gore.

If you don't know how that election was stolen by now, you ought to look it up. You ought to learn more about "Kos," too.

Both parties move more and more to the right all the time and most people don't care.

http://edition.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0011/08/bn.31.html

"KAGAN: Jeanne Meserve in Austin, Texas, and just add to that, Jeanne, from our exit polls, we were able to ask Nader voters across the country, if -- or actually who -- they would vote for if Ralph Nader was not on the ballot. About half of those Green Party voters said they would indeed vote for Al Gore."

I highly doubt that the other half would've voted for Bush. Most of that other half probably would've stayed home and Gore would've won the election.

convention will be called "Netroots Nation", so I hope detractors here on DU consider joining next year. Look, Dennis's remark will not bring about change; what it does is breed cynicism and lower voter turnout (oh, there all just the same!).

Thanks for the link.

Damned DLC'ers ..

Did anyone here get to go??

I'd love to hear from DU'ers and not the MSM! ~~

:)

It looks good on her.

support her just because she went to a bloggers' convention. I think the MSM was looking for bloggers to throw tomatoes at her and incessantly boo. When that didn't happen, they figured she "made peace". The truth is we were being nice. She has her supporters in a small percentage on the blogs, and that was what was represented at the convention.

People too often forget how the Come Back Kid kicked their asses so many times. This move (and performance) by Hillary is a typical Bill Clinton move: quit taking stuff personal, and instead get in there and mix it up with them.

The same way she is pummeling Obama, she is going to absolutely crush any GOP opponent.

The booing immediately drowned Kucinich out. He had committed a cardinal sin, demeaning the Democratic Party before a crowd that works countless unpaid hours a week to make the party stronger.

Amen! That's how you can almost always tell the real doers from the keyboard commandoes on DU and elsewhere. The big talkers are quick to trash, leave or otherwise abandon all hope. The doers tend to be a bit more rational and strategic after having put years of hard, unpaid work into it.

Julie