They get it in the UK----

A question of substance
Senator Joe Biden's bid for the Democratic presidential nomination deserves to be taken seriously.


How far can candor and substance take a politician? People claim to crave these virtues. Mourning their absence from civic life has become routine on both sides of the Atlantic.

The battle for the Democratic party's presidential nomination suggests the picture is more complicated. Senator Joe Biden of Delaware has as much substance as any other candidate. He is more candid than any of them. There is nothing wild-eyed about his policy positions. Yet opinion polls typically put his level of support below 5%. There is still plenty of time for Biden to improve his standing. He certainly deserves to do so....

.....Admirably, he seems to regard the glibness that is often the norm in presidential campaigns as a personal affront.

In the CNN/YouTube debate last month, he reacted with genuine impatience to sloganeering about pulling US troops out of Iraq immediately. "Let's get something straight," he said. "It's time to tell to start to tell the truth. The truth of the matter is if we started today, it would take one year - one year - to get 160,000 troops physically out of Iraq, logistically. That's number one. Number two, you cannot pull out of Iraq ... unless you have a political solution. I'm the only one that's offered a political solution."

It was a classic Biden moment - impassioned, serious and not overly concerned with eliciting approval....

.....The reality, unfortunately, is that Biden's many strengths will count for nothing if his ability to raise money does not improve. Asked in Iowa last month how he might break into the first tier of Democratic candidates, Biden replied, "I don't know what the hell I'm gonna do ... I thought a lot more about what I would do as president than how to get elected president. I'm trying like the devil to change that."

Still, it's far from impossible to see a scenario in which Biden could vault into serious contention.
The shallow opportunism of John Edwards becomes more apparent with each passing week. Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama are much stronger, but not without their respective Achilles' heels.

read the entire op-ed at
http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/niall_stanage/2007/08/go_joe_biden.html

a few gaffes may come back to haunt him, but he can take it.

He refuses to be scripted. He wants to be straight with the American people, and
he said the down side is that he is going to trip over his tongue every now and then.

and I can't say that about any of the frontrunners.

I didn't expect Democratic voters to be so ga-ga about polished deliveries. Maybe Bush ruined populism forever?

I like Biden a lot. He seems like a nice, likable person and he says
all the right things. The only problem is, he doesn't walk the walk.

I see Biden as one of the hardest working in the Senate, especially concerning
foreign affairs and our troops/vets.

I don't know what you are referring to - thx.

I'll just preface this (since someone else piled on after your polite request and that usually triggers a
chain of other condemnations) by saying I like Joe Biden, I've met Joe Biden, I subscribe to his and his
sister's email newsletters.

That said, I'm very troubled by (1) his plagiarism that hasn't been addressed or spoken to (I'm a writer and
I take plagiarism very seriously), (2) his support for the Patriot Act, (3) his voting for the Iraq war (which
he has admitted was a mistake due to Bush's incompetence but not because of any essential problem with the concept
of invading a sovereign nation that never attacked us, (4) his frequent pro-corporate stance including the gutting
of rights to bankruptcy, (5) his 60% approval rating from the ACLU and, well, I could go on, but those are the
basics.

I understand that it's necessary to play politics in Washington. It's a system we don't understand unless we've
been inside it. However, while I agree with most of Biden's positions, I'm troubled enough by the things I disagree
with that I won't vote for him. (BTW, I'm not voting for Hillary Clinton either).

What do you mean by he dosen't walk the walk? In my opinion he most certainly does walk the walk.
He is a very hard working Senator and has the reputation of being one of the hardest working in the Senate. He is still working very hard in the Senate as well as campaigning. He is the only one of the candidates who is not justing telling us what we want to hear,but what he believes. Could you be specific?

Besides, this British person wishes he could vote for Da Kooch

just assumed.

It goes to a brief bio

a lot of voters are so use to the mealy mouth answers and when someone says what they really think or how it really is they don't want to hear it. This is what the problem is with most of the candidates except for Kucinich.

is why -if the American people have acknowledged that Biden is as smart as he says he is in foreign policy and domestic affairs -is he rated so poorly in the polls??? To me it seems like there are certain people and industries that don't want him in office because things will change and change big. Biden has tons of ideas for this country to make it better FOR THE PEOPLE and corporations are afraid. Which explains why he's never included in media coverage when they mention the candidates.
Will America really let the media tell them how to vote in 2008?? That's what I'm afraid of. Most of America is in a trance. We will go to polls and vote like sheep just like the media and the rest of them want us to do. I hope we all wake up and soon! Don't let the media dictate this election!

though I personally find him quite attractive I must say :-). I like him, not a HUGE fan, but like him a lot. And definitely prefer him to any of the "top 3".

Apparently unrelated, but bear with me, please: by chance yesterday I came across a live video feed from a lecture at the Panetta Institute in CA, very interesting, wide-ranging, intelligent and unscripted discussion between the Bob Graham (ex-senator FL, just in case), Chuck Hagel and of course Panetta. Two issues relevant to the discussion here. One: super critical of how the media covers the campaign, and specifically of the debates, with the inevitable American Idol comparison, I think from Graham. How the country deserves a meaningful and an in-depth discussion on important topics that affect everybody. The second issue: how the situation the next president will inherit is so complex, that NOBODY will be able to govern effectively based on the 51% majority principle so dear to the dearly departed Rove. How some measure of consensus must be built, and the initiative and the ability to built it must come from the top, i.e., the president. Hagel was arguing this very strongly, and it's one of the reasons I respect the man (yes, I know very socially conservative). He even described quite in detail a meeting of republican senators + administration officials (the secretaries involved, Chertoff and whatever is the name of the other guy) to discuss the immigration bill in its second unsuccessful incarnation. And how when he arrived at the meeting he asked "where are the democrats?", only to be told that they (= the republicans, I am terrible at telling stories, sorry!) will put together a bill and try to get it passed. To which he said "Guys! I don't if anyone here noticed, but the democrats are now in control!", and then he made some funny comment that I do not quite recall, Harry Reid as the Road Runner, with bills being passed at max speed by him. Major laughter all around.

In any case, the point of the story, and the point I am trying to make, is that a consensus-builder, a "uniter" if you will, is SORELY needed. It might not be ideologically pure, it may offend many sensibilities to have to compromise and work with the "enemy", but it's a choice between that or NOTHING being done, almost complete paralysis. I find this last alternative unacceptable.

I am sure Biden can be an effective consensus-builder, and I trust that his compromises will not be too bitter to swallow. For reasons that would take way too long to explain, I am EXTREMELY pessimistic about Hillary or Edwards in the same role. Obama may have it in him, I am not sure, but the famous "experience" factor comes into play. I do think experience, having been on similar barricades, would help a lot. But he is an exceptional person, and maybe he could make it work, I just don't know.

One last comment about the Panetta-Graham-Hagel thing: it was quite depressing to hear all of them, when discussion the problems with the current campaign system (including the crazy primary schedule, etc. etc.) acknowledge that it is most likely too late for 08, and talking mostly about what can be done so that 2012 will not be the same farce. Ah, and by the way, for anyone interested, Hagel was of course asked about his presidential ambitions, but short of a laugh, I have no idea what he said, the feed was at time very hicuppy.

because he tells the complete truth and his smile is genuine. I really think we need a man of his caliper in the White House. Someone who can work w/ Dems and Repubs alike. And get something done.

I agree and that is why I support Biden. It is just the right time for someone like him.
His foreign relations experience and his track record of getting things done.

I like Obama but not right now. There is too much at stake for on the job training.
Let Biden get the WH ready for him.

the high school game of who is the most popular. Candidates are described by their appearances, mannerisms, whether they talked tough (that's one of my favorites, tough). Bush started that meaningless chant. George wasn't going to rely on the law, he was going to get them dead or alive!! Clinton did and the bad guy is doing big time, plus vital info was gotten from that arrest that bush/condi, etc. ignored. The one where it was described how they planned to use airliners to crash into buildings.

Got way off subject but, I too don't like the press and polls telling us who is best for the country. How about just the facts. The only problem when talking about a consensus builder is that Lieberman comes to mind. The dems tend to bend too far towards repubs and we get kicked in the teeth. Someone like Biden might be a decent deal maker, not give the farm away in the process.

people are closed minded. All they know is how he voted on one thing.
They have put a label on him, and don't even bother listening to what he is saying or doing.

He just wrote that legislation for our Veterans.
Is going to Iraq and Afghanistan before Petraues' report, to see and hear
for himself if the surge is working.
Got the peacekeepers into Darfur.
He is so hardworking, and honest,

but Obama was on the cover of GQ - and that is all that matters.

I am so afraid with the early primaries that people will have buyer's remorse because it is going to be a looooooooong general election campaign, and I worry about the frontrunner's ability to stand up to the rw attacks.

:kick:

really are too lazy to read and most people do not really listen either,so they just remember something they heard and take it for the absolute truth! They think well,I see her,him or whatever on the tv all the time so they must be the best one to vote for. That is exactly how we go stuck
with 8 years of George. :rant:

:kick: