Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

Christians, Jews in Holy Land alliance

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion: Presidential (Through Nov 2009) Donate to DU
 
Poll_Blind Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-20-07 10:25 PM
Original message
Christians, Jews in Holy Land alliance
Christians, Jews in Holy Land alliance
MELBOURNE, Florida (CNN) -- Sondra Oster Baras is an Orthodox Jew doing an unorthodox job.

--snip--

Baras stumps for money from evangelical Christians to support Jewish settlements in the occupied territories -- land she calls biblical Israel.

--snip--

Baras said God called her to this work. She left her high-powered, high-paid job as a Wall Street lawyer and moved to Israel in 1984.

"I was never fully American," she explained. "I was Jewish." Judaism was not only her religion but also her nationality.

--snip--

In 2002, a Palestinian suicide bomber blew himself up inside a pizza parlor in her neighborhood, killing three children. She said she fought back by encouraging support from evangelical Christians in America.

"If we give any part of that land to the Arabs, we are looking at terrorism," she told a church audience.

Christofaro's Florida congregation responded with money -- all while singing a prayer for peace in perfect Hebrew.

Their money builds parks, child care centers and music therapy programs -- projects that make Jewish life in the settlements more comfortable. And more permanent.

"If you don't live somewhere, if you don't take possession of it, it is not yours," Baras said.

Some people say Jews and evangelical Christians make strange bedfellows, given historical anti-Semitism.

"Because of this doctrine of a Jew being a Christ-killer ... so much hatred and anti-Semitism has been propagated throughout the Earth," Christofaro said.

Now such historic anti-Semitism has given way to an urgent support of Israel among some evangelicals, many of whom believe that when Jews live in all of the Holy Land -- what they call Greater Israel -- only then will Christ return and true believers be raptured up to heaven.

--snip--


  The whole article is worth reading and, being CNN, isn't all that long. Taking an average paragraph at 7 sentences, I figure I'm still under the limit for excerpts. Christiane Amanpour is about the only major reporter to spend any time on showing us the error of our fundie ways.

PB

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
rockymountaindem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-20-07 10:26 PM
Response to Original message
1. I don't need to read the article, I live it every day
growing up Jewish in the Protestant Vatican of Colorado Springs.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Poll_Blind Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-20-07 10:30 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. That's...gotta be weird. Sorry. One thing Amanpour touched on...
...was the inherent or perceived "unease" of the relationship. In your opinion is the tension there or not or Ya Really Have To See It Yourself To See How They Are (TM)?

PB
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rockymountaindem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-20-07 10:35 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. No tension for them, plenty for us
for various reasons. On the one hand, most Jews are supportive of Israel in one way or another (either the "don't give 'em an inch" types or those who support a two-state solution), so on one hand it's nice to get support for Israel. On the other hand, having it come from the likes of Dobson is very unsettling. These are the kinds of people who want to blur the lines between *their* church and the state. These are the kind of people who advocate for a hard right-wing society whereas the vast majority of Jews are liberals. Perhaps most disturbingly is the attitude that I've encountered when people find out I'm Jewish. It's not anti-Semitism, but a kind of genuine surprise that we're real people. I get the feeling a lot of evangelicals think being Jewish means either being a "Messianic Jew" :crazy: or that we're just characters from the Bible who don't exist in their reality.

Try telling someone around here you don't celebrate Christmas. You can hear their minds blowing.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
IndianaGreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-20-07 10:47 PM
Response to Reply #4
5. "What tribe do you belong to?"
I once worked in an office where an extremely fundie woman worked. One day, upon finding out I was Jewish, she asked me "What tribe do you belong to?." Without missing a beat I replied, "the Sandinista tribe."

Are those people stupid or what?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rockymountaindem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-20-07 11:31 PM
Response to Reply #5
6. Let me tell you
That someone we know who goes to New Life Church (Haggard's old domain) mentioned that their gift shop was selling "prayer shawls". I said, "Talits?". "What's that?" "A Jewish prayer shawl".

Now they're copying our ritual items. Oy.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pschoeb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-21-07 05:44 AM
Response to Reply #6
7. Probably Prayer of Jabez Prayer Shawls(fake Tallits)
Edited on Tue Aug-21-07 05:44 AM by pschoeb
They seem pretty popular with the whackadoodle sects, probably because their use of this prayer is all about greed, my guess is that if the prayer had nothing about "enlarging my territory", that the prayer would have never become popular in these groups.

"Jabez cried out to the God of Israel, "Oh, that you would bless me and enlarge my territory! Let your hand be with me, and keep me from harm so that I will be free from pain." And God granted his request." 1Cronicles 4:10


Though there is another type of Prayer Shawl and they occur across many denominations, and have nothing to do with Tallits. They are knitted shawls/blankets, where one thinks about and prays for a person you know who is sick or in need while knitting, and then you present them with the shawl, they are sometimes refereed to as comfort shawls as well. Though the thought of selling them kind of defeats the purpose, so my guess is the Haggard church sells the extremely debased pseudo-tallits.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
pschoeb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-21-07 06:10 AM
Response to Reply #5
8. Why is she stupid, you could be a Leviim or Kohenim?
nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
IndianaGreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-20-07 10:30 PM
Response to Original message
2. These are the sort of religious wackos that will get us all killed!
Nothing like feeding the fires of Armageddon, all for the glory of a mythical deity and fictional holy books.

Religion is the drug of choice of the masses!

Now, let's talk about that Creationist Museum!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Clark2008 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-21-07 11:44 AM
Response to Original message
9. "If you don't live somewhere, if you don't take possession of it, it is not yours"
Excuse me, but I thought there were people living there... Palestinians.


:crazy:


My sig line says it all.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Tue Apr 30th 2024, 11:15 AM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion: Presidential (Through Nov 2009) Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC