Why Dennis Kucinich is more electable than John Edwards

We do not need Nostradamus to tell us where the GOP attack machine will concentrate their fire power if John Edwards wins the nomination. John Edwards voted for the Iraqi War Resolution. This vote will be a dagger in the heart of his campaign. We only need to look at John Kerry's presidential campaign to see this. Any campaign strategy dealing with this vote must become convulated and distorted.

Dennis Kucinich has a simple, easy to understand, consistent record on Iraq. It will be an asset in a campaign.

The GOP will also come after Edward's health care plan. His plan basically is to subsidize the insurance companies with money and tax dollars. He will be painted as a big spending liberal and his health care plan will prove it.

Kucinich has a health care plan that makes sense, and though it will be attacked it will be a big loser for the GOP. People want universal single payer not for profit health care.

Edwards has changed his position on the patriot act, the IWR, and the bankruptcy bill. Flip flops are always problematic. These flips are in contradiction to Edwards' new found populist themes.

As John Nichols writes in the nation,
"Edwards may be "the angry populist" now. But he has not always been on labor side. Edwards -- who supported North Carolina's anti-union "Right-to-Work" law when he ran for the Senate in 1998 -- broke with the AFL-CIO to cast several key votes in favor of the Bill Clinton administration's free-trade agenda when he served in the Senate."

Kucinich has changed on choice. I do not think that this could hurt him in the general election.

My philosophy of life extends to everything I am and do. If I say I'm for peace, I'm for peace in the kind of products that I use, in the kind of shoes that I wear, and in terms of the clothes that I wear, in terms of my eating habits. I'm always thinking in terms of sustainability. That's the way I live. I live in a small house and we're very conscious of our energy usage. I drive an American car, a Ford Focus, but it's one of the highest fuel-economy cars."--Dennis Kucinich

Edwards mansion will undercut his environmental and populist themes as this quote from FOX news shows:
"But the candidate doesn't believe Americans are doing a good job of living like Jesus. Edwards — who has drawn fire from some for his new $6 million, 28,000 square-foot mansion in North Carolina — says, "I think that Jesus would be disappointed in our ignoring the plight of those around us who are suffering and our focus on our own selfish short-term needs. I think he would be appalled, actually."

Kucinich had problems as the mayor of Cleveland, but I don't think the GOP can use it. He was proved right on Muny Light, and the mayor of Cleveland videos that I have seen are a huge plus for Kucinich. People will admire him for not selling them out for political gain.

Americans don't like lawyers and a big time personal injury lawyer will not be popular.

Edwards is a handsome Southern WASP which is a huge plus.

The Kucinich campaign is financed in a completely ethical manner. Kucinich has no conflicts of interest with either his contributors or his investments. Edwards has all sorts of troublesome ethical entanglements in both his investments and his campaign financing.

I Hope I have been fair in this comparison. I have tried to be. I have used a quote from FOX news, but it is the type of thing that will be used in the campaign.

THere is more dirt on Kucinich but nothing substantial not mentioned here, and certainly nothing fatal to his campaign.

There is also more dirt on Edwards, but I won't go there.

pass the popcorn... :popcorn:

Both are great public servants.

Both are people-first Democrats.

:thumbsup:

That's the reference. :D

two of my favorites

that if Kucinich looked like Johnny Depp, he'd be a front-runner right now. If Clark doesn't get in the race, Dennis has my time, effort and $$.

RepubliCONs think it is OK to have a big house and talk about the little guy. The difference is they expect the talk to be nothing more than just talk.
Edwards does actually care about the guy living in the trailer across from the factory.

Unfortunately, we'll never have proof because Kucinich can't qualify to play against Tiger Woods.

I think that would just be an astonishing moment in spectator sports.

and show that woman how to make a butterscotch pie!

:shrug:

:rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl:

If there were a miracle and Kucinich was the Democratic nominee, we would all have to chip in and by him a bulletproof type pope mobile. Too many people don't want that guy in power, he would be a threat to the the machine we call our government and its corporate friends. For all the things he is speaking out on, its amazing that hes not even on the map when it comes to our great media coverage. Every board a lurk around on seems to mimic the medias agenda, it's really weird?

who can't break 3% within his own party is a threat to any powers that be.

Dennis is in the race. I wish he WOULD get more media coverage because I think a lot of his plans keep the others "honest" when they create theirs.

I would also love to see a debate between Dennis and any ONE of the Republican candidates. He would shame them.

It seems that he stands for and is speaking on the issues that we all seem to be speaking out here on DU about? It just makes me think the media doesn't cover him for a reason and therefore he doesn't even get noticed much less supported. Even I was guilty of it, I at first was leaning towards Obama out of the candidates but luckily I found DU and was able to learn a little about Kucinich and now I find myself leaning towards him.

What do you think it is that makes it so he cant even get past 3%? I mean I see negative things about many of our candidates like the patriot act for instance, many of our candidates support it and to me that shows what direction their own political agendas are heading but they somehow still get support. If not the media, what is it that is so evil and bad about this guy that he doesn't get support? Help me make the right vote in the primaries because as of now Kucinich gets my vote. I don't want to make an uneducated vote and solely depend on the media to make my vote for me, there are too many lives and freedoms at stake to just follow their lead and go with the crowd on this election. Now is our time to step up and make a difference.

I wish the media would give him a fair shot.(Yeah, right)

Clearly TPTB do not want Kucinich to gain media coverage. Must be a big concern that when people hear what he is saying they support him.

DR

and if American's hate lawyers so much why do they keep electing so many of them to office? And why is John Grisham so popular? And Boston Legal? Edwards is not just any lawyer, he was the champion of the "little people" He brought justice to those abused by corporate entities and insurance companies.There is no "dirt" on Edwards.His ethics are held in high regard even by his opposition who claim he was one of the most honest lawyers in the country.The only people who will resent Edwards for a big house are those with a socialist tilt and they won't vote anyway.Americans like rags to riches story, and while Edwards may not have been dirt poor, he has become a self made man and a huge success. The average American admires that.It proves anything is possible.They too can be rich.This is why so many GOP voters vote GOP.They like the association with money.Edwards is the best of both worlds.He has the money and he definitely gives them hope that they too could achieve wealth!
Dennis lack of wealth does not translate to votes.People don't want to have small houses, wear clothes from KMART, and drive a Ford Focus.They want to live like Edwards.Kucinich doesn't give the average Joe, the real voters, anything to aspire too.
Edwards is more electable than Kucinich because he reflects what mainstream America wants to be.The GOP will vote for him.They will not vote for Dennis who they perceive as a" Lefty Loon" And a "Woo!Woo!" with some of his spiritual beliefs(I like that he is Woo!Woo! because I am Woo!Woo! too but it won't help get him elected.)

You state that" Edwards is a handsome southern WASP which is a huge plus" You are partially correct. His looks have been turned into a negative by the opposition but his southernness and WASP factor are a plus.But his biggest asset is his thirty year marriage to Elizabeth.In this year of the Republican moral implosion, the fact that Edwards has been married to one woman for 30 years is huge! And there has been no evidence of any marital discord. Dennis cannot say that.He is divorced and is now married to a lovely woman many years his junior. I think Dennis and Elizabeth are a lovely couple and it is wonderful he found his soul mate but the length of their marriage and the difference in their ages will make some "Moral Values" voters pause.Edwards will have the edge with them and with many women voters who approve of Edwards loyalty to his wife.
All these are the reasons why Dennis, a wonderful man and a terrific congressman, is not as electable as John Edwards in a general election IMHO.

The fact that Edwards has been married to one woman for thirty years is important.

I am wondering what others think on this point. How important is it?

Edwards is going to get tagged as the man that popularized the C-Section and made Doctor's malpractice insurance so "horrifically expensive". So much for the lawyer of the people moniker. And i'm sorry to say, i don't know a soul who "likes lawyers"... despite the fact they are addicted to the TV drivel served up to them every night.

I do agree with you however that DKs "new marriage" will hurt his chances and that JEs 30 year marriage (+ a wife with Cancer) will help his chances. I'm hanging my hat on DK's rack, but i'd certainly vote for JE as my second choice... i think he's a good man.

:shrug:

will help John Edwards chances in the primaries is so sick I don't know what to say ...

There's no doubt that Elizabeth Edwards is a strength and a plus to John Edwards campaign.

But I cannot accept that people like her more because she has been diagnosed with cancer.

I mean - who would be dumb enough to base their choice of candidate on something like that? :eyes:

about our culture/country disgust me. But the willingness of people to root for the underdogs, or want to be a part of a dramatic story, or to want to view their lives as a television series is astounding. I personally can't believe you don't think people are "dumb enough" to fall for the fairytale. (you know, poor girl becomes Princess, sick person gets well after grand triumph, etc)

This country is FULL of vacant folk... blank stares, Dunkin Donuts brains... do you think they'll concern themselves with the issues of each candidate?

People call me cynical... that's ok.

:eyes: back at you.

The people who participate in the Democratic primaries are not vacant folk.

Maybe you mean the Republican primaries? :eyes:

Why don't you say why Kucinich is more electable than Clinton, Obama, or any of the other candidates?

and his supporters are marginalizing Kucinich by calling him unelectable.

I've never heard Edwards say that he is the only true progressive in this race.

Just because I support Edwards doesn't mean I don't appreciate Dennis Kucinich. I don't think it is only Edwards supporters who feel he is unelectable.

by the media and ignored outright or insulted (more the norm).

ABC particularly has Kucinich in the crosshairs. They hate his guts. I listened one night to Ted Koppel interview Kucinich (Koppel was then on ABC News) and asked him point blank why he even bothered to stay in the race. In addition to that being incredibly personal and disrespectful, it was unprofessional. I fired off a very sharply-worded letter to ABC to let them know what I thought of that caliber of journalism.

ABC has also been dismissive of Sen. Carol Moseley-Braun (2004) and lately, John Edwards.

I don't think the Edwards camp is Kucinich's enemy at all. I've posted elsewhere on DU that the two camps have quite more in common than is conventionally supposed by the media, and I think if you talk with people from both camps (say, at a Democratic Drinking Liberally event), without revealing your preference, you'll often find the Edwards and Kucinich people in warm mutual regard.

election, the issues that he has flip flopped on are not minor issues, real people have been and continue to be affected.

His recent statements of Iran threatening the security of the entire world will be repeated along with his speech that Sadaam must be removed and that Iraq is the most serious and imminent threat to our country.

As you have pointed out many of the reasons to not vote for Kucinich are more shallow in nature and should be easier to overcome in the general election. Iraq and pending actions against other nations will be an important issue in this election, Kucinich has the best track record.

I've said this before, if candidates can be misled by our own government where they have access to intelligence and understand the language, it should be even easier to be misled by foreign governments.

IMHO, if Kucinich was our nominee, it would be the biggest loss since Reagan/Mondale.

Frankly, it is so easy to use Kucinich's New Ageish quotes and the whole Department of Peace idea to paint him as the biggest loon to ever be nominated. The far left would support him, but the independents, centrists, and all the republicans would flee so fast that we'd probably not even carry two states.

Frankly, I'd even have serious reservations about voting for him, the only reason would be to stop the republicans, but it'd be tough.

With any of the three serious candidates, we will easily though.

time to pay attention to politics I now realize that my party is leaving me.

Give the American people a chance at working towards peace, rebuilding our nation, taking care of it's citizens and keeping us safe by not creating more terrorists OR another war of agression and all that comes with it...not a hard choice for most people once the ideas are presented.

Kucinich is the only candidate taking on the corporations now, not some promise in the future.

The Democrats should embrace striving for peace and not make it out to be some crazy idea.

Yes, that sucks, but it is what it is.

Who had the better policy position...Jimmy Carter or Ronald Reagan?, Mondale or Reagan?, Dukakis or Bush?, Gore or Bush?, Kerry or Bush?. Being electable (like it or not) is not based on policy positions.

It's based on a whole host of criteria that have nothing to do with policy. Image, height, looks, charisma, working with party leaders, building an nationwide organization, raising money,...etc. Kucinich is unelectable and would be a disaster for us in a general election because of the other criteria.

some of those "new-ageish quotes" please. Got a link?

Just google Kucinich and "new age", you'll find lists. Here's one...

"The energy of the stars becomes us. We become the energy of the stars. Stardust and spirit unite and we begin: one with the universe, whole and holy. From one source, endless creative energy, bursting forth, kinetic, elemental; we, the earth, air, water and fire-source of nearly fifteen billion years of cosmic spiraling." -- Kucinich, in the "Journal of Concious Evolution"

that seems more poetic than new-agey...

I'm reading Kucinich's A Prayer for America now and it's as crystal clear in its thought and message as could possibly be.

Maybe i'm new age and didn't know it?

We are literally made of the elements of the stars from the Big Bang.
That's a scientific fact. Dennis threw in the poetic stuff but he's saying the same thing basically.

--to steal shamelessly from Joni Mitchell.

I heard Sagan talking about this on some PBS show once and I froze in my tracks with appreciation. I sure do miss that guy. What a lift he was.

Don't forget the age difference of his wife and his general pig-headedness during his tenure as mayor and in the House.

I agree that only the extreme left will support him. The left and moderate-left will not vote for him (and they might vote for the other guy). Independents and the right will certainly not vote for him. If Kuch were the nom, it might be the first time in ages a candidate will carry every state, and it won't be a Dem who carries all of the states.

The one thing that hasn't happened to Kuch is that his past actions and statements has yet to be seriously scrutinized. There are some really serious questions that he has yet to answer.

The only ones who follow Kuch are those who have completely bought into his cult of personality and cherry-pick at what they want to hear.

The Cleveland Plain Dealer has published anything and everything negative about Dennis, and they have made up some things as well.

There is nothing that any DUer or 3%er can ever say to change that.

talked to anyone who lives in Cleveland lately? Why does he get elected to office if he's ineffective? As for this, "There is nothing that any DUer or 3%er can ever say to change that."

Here's what i say," YOU"RE WRONG Dawgs!"

(tongue spewing spittle in serious raspberry at you)

:)

John Edwards has won statewide in North Carolina. Seems Dennis Kucinich's "electability" vanishes the moment he steps beyond the population size of a congressional district.

If he would have counted his votes in Ohio he would have won a national election. Too funny to read some of these Kucinich bashing comments.

Kucinich yesterday,Maybe I should've given that more thought. Here is why I should have given more thought:
Quotes

"Hillary Clinton must take responsibility for this war.
Every finger she points at Bush - she has three more pointed back at herself."
-- Dennis Kucinich on Scarborough (R-Killed that intern) yesterday

First, is Dennis still in grade school? Who told him childish taunts can make you president? Second, is he saying Hillary bears three times the responsibility for Bush's war? She voted with the majority, so isn't Dennis being a little selective in his outrage?
I know it's frustrating to be stuck at one percent, Dennis, but why give up your dignity?
bartcop-wednesday august 29th, 2007

I agree....

Ben David

Point your finger at someone. Are not three of your fingers pointing back at you?

I really do not see your problem with his statement.

I want to hear what you have to say about that part of his statement. Give me a good explanation why I knew that this war was wrong and she didn't. I read Pappy Bush's book about his war and he knew da*m well why we didn't go into Baghdad. Those reasons have not changed. I am sorry but by supporting Hillary you are buying four more years of this madness. Why do you support her? Peace, Kim

than Hillary.

Whatever forces have conspired to preclude Dennis from passing his universal health care bill (which is indisputably the best plan if only it had the votes) will evaporate as people come to embrace a candidate who makes McGovern look like Oliver North.

I agree with Dennis almost universally on issues, but I think Dennis and I may be too far ahead of the electorate.

unfortunately, you need the votes to win. He already has a track record of failure...his long primary run the last time around saw him lose to Al Sharpton who quit early.

No way to sell steak without some sizzle.

Trophy wife, flip-flop on choice, and his lack of accomplishment over the past 7 years are against him. He tells a good story, but nothing gets done.

Last poll I saw had Dennis at about 5% along with Dodd and Biden.

nt

finished third:

John Kerry 617,611 votes for 52%

John Edwards 408,175 votes for 34%

Dennis Kucinich 107,685 votes for 9%

Howard Dean 30,213 votes for 3%

(Others) -- for 2%

By the time Ohio held its primary, there was already a discernible shift toward Kerry as the nominee, especially in light of his wins in Iowa and New Hampshire. Note by this time in this part of the country that the once-contending Joe Lieberman is nowhere to be found. Gephardt dropped out before midnight the night of the Iowa caucuses. Things happen fast in politics sometimes.

Note Edwards' very impressive second-place finish, mirroring his performance in Iowa, also behind Kerry, and the voters' impulse to put these two first and second in the early going. Inadvertent of course, but interesting that they eventually comprised the 04 ticket. No matter what the New York POST says.

Kucinich has not run a statewide race in Ohio. To my knowledge, this is the closest he's come. Howard Metzenbaum was also a fighting-Dem sort, and won statewide Ohio elections, once upsetting John Glenn in a primary. I do not say that Kucinich cannot replicate Metzenbaum's accomplishment, but so far he has held to his demographically-safe regions in the NE part of the state.

Gore won the popular vote in 2000 (likely the electoral college as well) without carrying Tennessee. So I'm not holding Kucinich to the home-state standard and letting, say, Al Gore off the hook. But it weakened Gore's bid to lose Tennessee and it throws Kucinich off-stride some by his region-specific appeal in Ohio.

It could be overcome, but so far in this new presidential primary campaign, I don't yet see the Kucinich team trying new things. I don't know if it's because they are strapped for funds or what. Kucinich fights the good fight. But he needs some weapons and some fresh blood on that team to move out of the 2-4% zone he's been in for 6 years nationally. He's a good man. I want to see him make an impact.