Heterosexual Males only: Could you make yourself gay?

As a heterosexual male, I cannot imagine any course of therapy or discipline that would make me gay.

The question is not whether I could be coerced in some way to have sex with a man. The question is could anything make me stop seeing women as sexy and beautiful and the yin to my yang (or visa-versa... I forget.)

It is easy to imagine a hypothetical totalitarian gay regime that could drive my feelings about women underground. I could learn to block out my appreciation of a swaying hip, a curved lower back, a soft breast. I could learn to not turn my head when a woman walks in the room. But could I learn to not have those feelings at all? And could I learn to have the same magical, aesthetic, appreciative and life-affirming feelings about men?

And if I could, would the essential ME be destroyed in the process?

My "straightness" is not about being revolted by men, it is about loving women. And my feelings about women are so much a part of who I am that I cannot being ME without them.

I have no real idea what it is like to be gay, anymore than I know what it is like to be a woman, to be Hispanic, to be a holocaust survivor... but I know that being gay must be as central to the essence of an individual human being as being straight.

And if someone's religion told me that God could bless me and make me desire men instead of women, I would view that religion with great distrust.

I'm not a man though, so I probably shouldn't have responded. Sorry!)

That's why I was careful to focus to the love of women, rather than revulsion of sex with men.

I am sure a lot of men in prison (or the navy, in the olden days) have had sex with men while at the same retaining their core attraction of women.

Identity is an aspect of mind, not behavior. Prison is a good analogy as the opposite of the straight-living gay man. Lots of gay men NEVER have gay sex and do have sex with their wives, because what the really want is foreclosed to them by society. The opposite pertains in prison, (Substituting iron bars for the metaphorical bars of social convention.)

Full disclosure: I cannot speak from experience, but nonetheless I doubt that most men who've responded to that situation would identify themselves as "gay." Most are implacably heterosexual. Having sex with another man isn't what makes one gay-- sexual orientation that makes other men the preferred object of a male's desires is what constitutes male homosexuality. Some of what goes on in prisons is undoubtedly homosexuality, just like sexuality anywhere else, but a great deal of it is just sexual frustration in a confined, violent atmosphere. That is NOT homosexuality.

Similarly, I self-identify as homosexual, but if I was put into some unrealistic situation where my only options for sex were women, I'd probably take what I could get there. It would be quite unsatisfying for me, and I'd be less versatile in what I'd be willing to do, but it's better than no such interaction at all. I'd imagine that the "prison gay" situation is similar to that.

Trying to marry and live a "straight" life, on the other hand, wouldn't work for me. There are men around, of course, and my much stronger attraction to them would make a relationship with a woman simply not work.

Not everyone is like this though. I know guy guys who could never have sex with a woman. Physically, their bodies would refuse to operate because the concept disgusts them so much. Similarly, I'm sure there are heterosexuals, and of course lesbians too, in the same situation, being completely inflexible when it comes to the gender of sex partners.

Kinsey divided sexuality into a 1-6 scale: 1 being 100% Hetero and 6 being 100% gay. I know this is a vast oversimplification but it fits this post. Anyway, I think for those of us in the 3-4 range can probably lean one way or the other after dedicating to a monogamous relationship but for those in the 1-2 and 5-6 range it's impossible to suddenly change orientations.

... then you'd see a noticeable twitch...

...YUM!!

:rofl:

Now THAT'S funny!!!

Nice one!!

or Catherine



or Helena (I find her quite yummy myself.)



I figure when I don't look at those picture and think something at least somewhat naughty I'm either dead, exausted, or gay.

"History of the World". Watch those ostrich feathers.

Classic movie..."Look, the streets are crawling with soldiers!"

n/t

Must make more time to watch my Dark Angel, Honey & Sin City DVDs!! ;-)

i don't know the exact amount it would take, or that anyone would offer.

Gay is not, "having sex with men". Gay is, "getting turned on by men".

If men turn you on, you are gay whether you have sex with them or not. If men do not turn you on, you are straight whether you have sex with them or not.

gay or not. ask guys in prison.

but i cede your point. i could FAKE gay for the right price, but i could not THINK gay.

Beautifully said.

IMO, the only people who can pull the "ex-gay" thing off for any length of time are those who were actually somewhat BISEXUAL to begin with. Even so, most are miserable. That's no way to live, and only a deep pathology in our society can drive people to try it.

If attraction to the opposite sex works for you and you are homophobic, you restrict yourself to straight sex and completely ignore the fact that gay sex could also "work" for you. Sometimes I think that all the people who sincerely believe that sexual orientation is a choice are homophobic bisexuals.

Bisexuality is rather more common than is usually acknowledged.

Could I have sex with another man? Yes, certainly. But I could no more WANT to have homosexual relations any more than I could WANT to have sex with my pets. It is simply not the way my brain is wired.

The notion that sexual orientation is a "lifestyle choice" is ludicrous. Worse, it's ignorant, but ignorance is the hallmark of the intolerant, IMO, so it's not surprising that those wishing to condemn others for their differences willfully ignore reason.

Glad you brought up the whole "lifestyle choice" thing. I love it when the homophobes demand that it's a choice. It implies (strongly, I'd argue) that they were attracted to both men and women, but chose women. As for me, I don't think I ever really had to choose who I was attracted to.

LGBT folks do not have "lifestyles"--we have LIVES.

j/k

That's why the gay agenda has to be stopped. Add the atheist agenda and liberal schooling to the mix and you have a recipe for disaster. They're turning our youngsters into the gays and the lesbian.

Only Jeebus can save us.






Suppose I should add this for the satire impaired :sarcasm:

and don't forget about all of the soy products that are making young men gay and more effeminate.:sarcasm:

I just finished a bowl of Frosted Mini Wheats...with soy milk! :scared:

and don't forget about all of the soy products that are making young men gay and more effeminate.:sarcasm:

Apply directly to the foreskin...............:rofl: :hi:

That is a 'Heblew' :rofl: :hi:

The whole idea of "turning gay" is beyond me. You can turn blond but sooner or later the dark roots show.

The best of both worlds!!! :bounce: :bounce: :hi:

But "faith" has nothing at all to do with logic. Faith is NOT an excuse for bigotry and homophobia. Not in my book.

Belief without evidence in what is told by one who speaks without knowledge, of things without parallel. -- Ambrose Bierce

Otherwise known as "bullshit".

I didn't want to be blunt...but you said it beautifully!:toast:

type subject comes up, seems like someone tries to make a point by stating "I wouldn't for a million dollars". My answer is always, "Hell, I'd do it for a lot less that that". Still haven't gotten any offers, and I suppose there would be a bottom limit amount. Leaving that aside, in a real world application, I think pretty much all people are either/or, but there also poeple who are bi, bi-curious, and I think there is also a smaller group of people who are confused and traumatized by an abuse. Except for this last group, the smallest group which needs healing for the abuse itself, I don't think there is anything inherently wrong with however one is wired, and no matter what, it is not for any of us to judge. Of course gay folks should be allowed to marry. If the neocons ever did manage to get and amendment about it, it would be tragic and downright Un-Christian.

Are you sure you are heterosexual? Cause every time I come to DU you've got something else to say about homosexual men. It seems to me you are fixated on this issue!!

Nice catch.

...I might resort to men. In fact, when I visit Wisconsin I don't even notice women.

You could only have sex with society's notion of beauty? What the hell would you do if your wife ever got sick and became obese, leave her? How shallow can you be, sure you aren't a repub?

zalinda

...or is it demeaning to life itself for a society to become so sick that obesity and unhealthiness is the norm?

Ever have to feed your kids with food stamps? Swallow your pride and submerge your beliefs to earn a living? Get belittled and ridiculed for suffering from a mental illness. Stop your parents from smoking around your playpen. Clean out methane reeking pools because it was the only job you could get as a Latino? Have a landlord refuse to stop toxic gases from entering the place you lived? Stand in fetid bacteria laced water to earn a minimum wage. Get shit for being slightly overweight or imperfect looking so that you eventually just gave up? Smoked cigarettes or drank alcohol just to have another human being to talk to. Done drugs to deaden the pain of being called a fag and loser and deviant and child molester? Interesting philosophical question. And what if what you consider obese is considered healthy in another culture.

I'm just saying that I would easily be able to give up women if the kind you're describing are my only choice.

A man like you might be attractive to women like me. Maybe.

Nah, men like you really bring out the bisexual in me, to be honest.

so I don't think so

The sexual act has little to do with the preference.

After all who wouldn't jump at the chance to have their rights curtailed and the possibility of getting beaten up at any time...

:sarcasm:

show me a pic of you, and we'll see ...

;)

Dunno why, but your words brought me a tear.

Hekate

lol, but seriously, the answer is of course not.

with people who believe that sexual orientation is a choice.

"So, if gays choose to be gay, then you're saying that you chose to be straight? And that you might change your mind under the right circumstances."

-- Pause for a moment to let them get all huffy and defensive --

"If it's not possible for you to choose to be anything other than straight, why are you assuming that other people can possibly choose to be gay?"

-- Lots of harrumphing --

"You are who you are, and they are who they are. Can't you just leave it at that?"

Granted, this approach is rarely effective, but I enjoy making homophobes uncomfortable, so there's a certain degree of entertainment I get from it.

No you can't force yourself to be gay if your straight, and if you're gay you can't force yourself to be straight.

If I wanted to then sure I could pretend to be gay and have gay sex with someone, but I just wouldn't really enjoy it, so what would be the point, and I'd be living a lie because I don't find guys sexually attractive. I've never found other guys hots or attractive, and no amount of trying is going to make me find them sexually attractive.

It's the same way for gays. I may find women hot and sexually attractive, but a gay guy's not going to feel the same way about them as I do. I don't have to put any effort at all into finding women hot and attractive, it just comes naturally to me, but no amount of effort is going to make a gay guy see women the same way I do.

The only people who can pretend to be straight or gay without any effort and enjoy it are bisexual people.

As a young teen I had a slight infatuation for the New Kids, but I also liked Molly Ringwald and moved on to Debbie Gibson. I just don't get sexual feelings for men. It feels like sexual preferencw was born in me, as said many times. I think anyone can experiment if they really want to, but it won't change their basic orientation.

climax. It does not matter what warmth is around the thing like say in prison and physically making a much needed climax possible be it man woman or warm liver. It is the fantasy stupid and that cannot be changed even by the gods. If a man is fantasizing about a woman he is Hetero, If a man is fantasizing about a man he is homo.

For example, you could be in a public bathroom and the gays could send in an agent who glances at your penis and WHAM: they put the gay on you.

Or the agent could tap his foot and WHAM: you could be totally gay before you even get to wipe.

You have to be very careful. The gays are everywnere.

Read Kinsey's reports on Sexuality. Virtually no one is strictly straight, or strictly homosexual. The vast majority of us are some degree of bisexuality.

I see many people who couldn't think of being straight or gay. So IF there is still some variation in those people, it would be very, very little. Not worth even mentioning. I believe in the born gay, bisexual or straight theory.

If you were incarcerated long-term (over 10 years) do you think that over time the need for intimacy would overwhelm the heterosexuality? In a situation where no woman was available nor was ever likely to be would that affect your heterosexuality in any way? Understand, I'm not saying that men who have sex in prison are all gay-most aren't. I'm just curious how one average guy chosen at random would react.


I'm not sure how I would answer the question. At my age (53) its really hard to imagine adjusting to a whole new sex, hardly worth the effort anymore.

Aside from that, I know that on "The Sopranos" they said you get a pass if your in prison. For me, it's one of those things I don't want to find out. Not the biggest reason I don't want to be a guest of the state, but it's somewhere in the top ten.
Not that there's anything wrong with that.

"Cuddle with me, Larry. Let's just talk about our feelings."

whether or not they are willing to admit it. I will always be more attracted to women but I admit there are some men I find somewhat attractive in an erotic way. Could I ever "do it" with a man? I honestly do not know.

so i decided to post here just to make myself not feel so left out.

post!

Good post, good point

Have you looked at men? We are pretty disgusting creatures. That's why I laugh at those who say homosexuality is a choice, because if you really had a choice...why would anyone chose to have sex with a guy!?!

Cute post :D

This would be an effect counterargument to use in a debate with McClurkin types. It doesn't change my view that Obama did the right thing.

:scared:

men who might have been gay. Neither I nor they could have given a shit less about having sex. I am also very physically affectionate with both men and women . I don't think that I've ever had "sex" with another man but it wasn't like it was an issue. Sometimes my wife puts the boys and my nephews and my gay brother and his friend in one big sleeping room and none of us are thinking their sexual orientation might change. I've never had to exchange sex for money with another man but if I liked the guy as a person I might do it and not take the money. I guess my family and friends love each other as people first and really don't care about sexual orientation unless someone is giving them a hard time and I've told people I was gay in cases when I was protecting others and letting them know they are full of shit. My wife calls my male friends my boyfriends and sometimes says she gets a little jealous of the love I show them, but she's my drug of addiction. I always had very close physical interactions with men at a very young age through sports and just social events and I just never felt any sexual urges towards them, unless you count hugging and all male pile ups. Okay, I did ask a gay male friend of mine to kiss me like I was gay once. Great kiss but I'm still straight. My gay friends are often very physically affectionate with each other and although I don't think any of them consider that having gay sex, they are like that with the women in my life as well and they are not becoming straight as far as I know.

Just depends on if you can hit the magic number.



Is this some sort of come on?

Uhm about this...

"The question is could anything make me stop seeing women as sexy and beautiful and the yin to my yang"

I think the actual question would be "Could I be sexually arroused by a man? Or more appropriately, could I find a man sexually arrousing to the exclusion of women"

NOT seeing someone as objectively sexy or beautiful is not a complete indicator of sexuality in it of itself.

:P

http://members.shaw.ca/trogl/orient.html

(How may threads are running??)

of course the answer is no. I am 100% straight even though my girlfriend jokingly calls me her gay boyfriend. I'm very much attracted to women and my girlfriend in particular.

I have been in oral sexual encounters with gay men where I told them I was straight and they did NOT even roll their eyes since they often have oral sex with straight men and many prefer it. I was not attracted to them, in fact I closed my eyes and thought of women. You don't want to know what sort of mental state I was in that drove me to have anonymous sex with people (women and men) who I met online. I was in a bad way psychologically and don't wish that upon anyone. I lost my virginity to some woman who I don't even know her name or where she is now.

My girlfriend knows about my past and is a wonderful compassionate person for being OK with it. She says it's good that I now know I am very much straight and very happy with a monogamous relationship where we actually care about each other. It helps that we have sex almost every night. Sex is very important to me. I want it (but not in an addiction way) just about every night and watch porn if my girlfriend is not with me.

I guess I won't be running for political office ever.

You are who you are.