So is the drivers licenses for Illegal aliens now off the table for the 08 campaign?

Have we seen the final nail in its coffin with Spitzer's public recanting on this issue?

Right after the last debate, I was fearful that this issue would lose the 08 election for the Dems. But I hear a Great Silence on it from the primary candidates.

Have we successfully quashed this issue or does anyone think it could rise from the ashes and be trouble for us?

Gun Control...

When "some in our party" start banging the gun control drum, we LOSE on the national level........

.....EVERY TIME.....


Took us 12 years to recover from 1994 Semi-automatic rifle ban.

somewhat circuitous fashion in 04 when Kerry appeared in camo duds on some kind of hunting trip. He looked kinda funny and the media made fun of him. But then after the election Cheney had his moment of ridicule when he shot his friend in the face on a hunting trip...

Was to register handguns...I wonder how that promise went over in his home state, heck, in all of flyover country??

When he went on the record during the debate with that stance, he doomed himself with many, MANY, folks I know.

Their is a new Semi-Auto firearm ban that has been proposed, it has a huge number of democratic co-sponsors.

And with the current supreme court case over the DC Gun ban, their is a very strong gun rights undercurrent going on right now.

We ignore them, at our own peril.

Gun Control is a huge political looser for us, heck, just look at a magazine stand, you can usually find 10 to 15 gun magazines, for sale, every month...

How many "gun control" magazines do you EVER, see???

with some voters. However, among voters in urban areas, the handgun issue and the semi-automatic gun issue may be seen more as a crime control issue. To those voters, the 2nd Amendment is not as burning an issue, if at all, compared to gun violence wracking their cities.

But..

When the original AW ban was passed in 1994, several PROMINENT Democratic senators, held up, semi-auto rifles, and said ONLY CRIMINALS would own a rifle like that...

I remember this happening vividly, in my family, we owned several of those rifles Feinstein was holding up, I even had one in my gun cabinet.

Than she said...."If I had had enough votes, I would have said "Mr and Miss America, TURN THEM ALL IN".............

That was enough, basically from that point forward 90% of my family turned their back on the democrats.... Let me put this into context...My mother, was a delegate, that was sent to the national convention, for Walter Mondale. My father was a union organizer...

VERY, VERY, STRONG Democrats, as a youngster, I was in parades for the Democratic Party. And Mary Sue Terry...After that fiasco, and Mary Sue Terry, coming out for strong gun control, I remember my father telling mom, that no way could he vote for "that bitch".... She turned an easy victory in a lose by a wide margin.

Now, I am the only one in my family who pulled a lever for a Democrat in the past 10 years....THE ONLY ONE....they now pull it for repukes.

THESE URBAN POLITICOS, NEED TO CHOSE THEIR WORDS CAREFULLY...someone may be listening

family did to the other side. I do think the issue has been blurred, as you described it so well, that some hunters' guns are themselves semi-automatic. And that was ignorance on the part of the urban politicians, you are right.

I remember Bill Clinton talking about hunting, which he could do authentically. John Kerry could not pull it off. I can't see HRC making this a big issue in her campaign if she gets the nom. John Edwards could probably do okay. My point is that it hasn't become much of an issue and if it is not, then your family will have the stark choice of a party that can help them with their health care coverage, end the disastrous war in Iraq and start doing more on the environment. Poll after poll shows that most voters are concerned with those issues and that's why all the campaigns have been talking about them. I can't believe that your family would not consider those issues, esp. if the gun issue is not raised...

Until "gun control" comes up, than they "shut off"

I do agree with many of your tenants tho, but I think your wrong on the urban voters walking away from the party over a pro gun stance.

Let me explain..

It is easy for me, to see why rural folk did what they did, guns down here, are a birthright. I own several of my GREAT grandfathers firearms...They will be handed down to my grandchildren. I also posses the semi automatic pistol, my grandfather carried into combat during WW2.

These "things" hold a sacred place in my family, the THOUGHT, that some politician wants to "interfere" with them, is unthinkable.

Being compared to criminals, because we own them, is UNTHINKABLE.

I seriously doubt, that we would loose many votes, by becoming the "pro civil rights" party, But I can guarantee that we will pick up huge numbers if we do.

Yes, some of the urbanites would whine, but politically, where are they going to go????

Their feelings on gun control, have been proven to not be anywhere near, as strong as those that vote pro gun.

As I said before, if their was a true "gun control" movement, where is the "gun ban monthly" magazine??

Their is literally hundreds of pro gun magazines, because gun folks, spend money, and follow their hobbies.

In the last years of her life, my mother was very upset by the concealed weapon law that was passed in Texas. And so was I, for her safety's sake. She felt that if she accidentally insulted someone who was carrying a concealed gun, she could be a victim of a crime. This was not too long after her granddaughter, my neice, was shot and killed by her step grandfather in a drunken shooting incident at his home. He had a legal gun which he had bought, and kept loaded, in his house to protect himself against criminals. My niece lost her life because of this conceit.

My mother was a second generation Texan. I am a 3rd generation TExan. I understand this issue very well. Please do not lecture me on it. And please don't say we are whining. WE simply MUST get past this to get onto issues that everybody cares about.

If you cannot understand that, then you are stuck with the Republican way of life, which we all know is so WONDERFUL.

actually enjoying the conversation..

My father, kept a loaded .45 pistol on top of his dresser.

My wife and I, both have CCW permits, and we both carry sidearms. That fact does not change the fact that when we cast out votes, we voted nearly a straight "D" ticket. (the exception this year was in the sheriff race, where the candidate is a close personal friend)

I did not mean to imply you, where whining, I am sorry if you took it that way. I was making a general statement, not a personal one.

BTW, Thanks for the friendly discourse. :-)

Remember -- DU does not allow any criticism, no matter how slight, of Al Gore. This is your only warning. :)

Anybody who tried to do what Spitzer tried to do is committing political suicide.

Tend to forget who, they represent don't they??

Red hot issue.

in the campaign. It all depends on whether the Dems let them get away with it. If we're smart, we'll avoid it like the plague...

Why not DISAVOW it?? That would make us an easy sale in most states.

Nearly all of my Representatives, both state and Federal, ARE, Democrats....and they ALL, are anti-gun control in a huge way.


They easily win re-election....but BushCo carried my area, by a wide margin.


EDIT, I know many MANY, people whom will not vote for us, on the national level, OVER gun control....I can't think of a single person who votes for us now, that would walk away from us if we DID disavow gun control...

In many urban areas, you have police unions who come out publicly for gun control so it can be seen by those voters to be a "law and order" issue.

Rupuke state senator Jeanmarie Devolite-Davis, lost her seat to Democrat Chap Peterson, These was the urban eastern area of Virginia.

Miss Davis, made Gun Control one of the central tenants of her campaign, she even had NY mayor Bloomberg fly down days before the election for a "presser" as he gave her, HIS, endorsement...

In the election, Chap TROUNCED HER HARD, she lost by more than 10 points.

Chap had ran on a pro-gun stance...

about it all last evening on MSNBC -- saying any candidate in either party who was not strongly anti-immigration would not be President.

I hope Obama comes out against it tonight and I don't even care what he said before.

Not even the Bluest State of NY supports this and it's not like a huge issue that must be addressed now, on a NATIONAL LEVEL. Leave it to the states and move ON.