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Obama inspires in me a feeling that is almost the exact opposite of hope.

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Stop Cornyn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 12:27 PM
Original message
Obama inspires in me a feeling that is almost the exact opposite of hope.
My friends and I are all political junkies, and we're all left-wing Democrats.

We are Kucinich supporters, Edwards supporters, ex-Dodd-now-Edwards supporters, and ex-Biden-now-Hillary supporters.

A couple of these friends are gay, and none of us are Obama supporters. I mention these two facts in one sentence because they are related facts.

We gave my friends (a couple) shit when they switched to Hillary after Biden dropped out. We gave them shit about getting on the "corporatist bandwagon" and kidded them about whether they were going to enlist when we invade Iran, but the ribbing was good natured. We joke about hating Hillary, but we all know that she might be a compromise but she wouldn't let us down too badly if she won the nomination.

But the feeling about Obama is different. I feel that supporting Obama would involve leaving my gay friends behind; they have not gotten over Donnie McClurkin, and they will not get over it unless Obama changes his current trajectory, and -- out of shared values and personal loyalty -- I also cannot get past it either.

If Obama wins the nomination, my friends will not vote for him. They will vote third party or leave the top of the ballot blank. I'd vote for him, but unless he makes this situation right, I'll need to bring pliers because I'll have to pinch my nose so hard. I may not even be able to tell my friends that I voted for Obama. I'd literally feel shame over abandoning my friends to vote for Obama.

If anyone in the Obama campaign monitors DU, please pass the word along: I want to like Obama, but I cannot leave my friends behind, and these conflicting feelings inspire in me a feeling that is disheartening, maddening, and mostly disappointing.

This feeling is the polar opposite of hope, and it needs to be fixed because I cannot believe that I'm the only one who feels this way.

I just needed to get that off my chest before it's too late to fix the problem.
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Cha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 12:28 PM
Response to Original message
1. If Obama wins..I hope
you and your friends will be able to handle.
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Colobo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 12:35 PM
Response to Reply #1
5. Exactly.
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Little Star Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 12:32 PM
Response to Original message
2. Then just try some....
change or faith. :silly:
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Sarah Ibarruri Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 12:35 PM
Response to Original message
3. There's no doubt in my mind that Edwards is the man that should win the nomination.
HOWEVER, my priorities are as follows:

1) Getting rid of all the Repukes from the White House, and as many as possible from Congress, state govt., county governments, city governments, and local governments including school boards where they do one hell of a lot of damage to schools and kids.

2) Avoding the most centrist and conservative Democrats. Right now, the most centrist one is Hillary Clinton. She, and all the centrist Democrats need to realize that the country is suffering too much for them to continue on their path of centrism. They need to rally around a more left wing candidate.

3) Every time Edwards opens his mouth, I feel he's talking to ME. I agree with everything he says. My donations go only to Edwards. I hope things change and Edwards becomes the nominee for our party. However, if that doesn't happen (and I can't fathom it), then I will rally around whoever is the candidate for our party because I no longer will allow Repukes in my government.
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Cha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 12:53 PM
Response to Reply #3
20. Very good, Sarah..
I like your priorities.
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Sarah Ibarruri Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 12:59 PM
Response to Reply #20
24. Thanks my friend. I think we have a great opportunity right now to get rid of the GOP scourge nt
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cynthia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 07:45 PM
Response to Reply #3
51. And don't forget, Edwards is most likely to pull in more Democratic
victories in Senate and House races, so that they can really accomplish some of his goals. Clinton would do the exact opposite, as I suspect many will vote in a very conservative congressional or senate candidate to counteract her. I fear the Obama may have a similar effect. We'll see.
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ccpup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 12:35 PM
Response to Original message
4. it's odd
because I don't know anyone in my circle -- well-to-do professionals and artists of all races in NYC and LA as well as expats in Paris and London -- who will vote for him either. They listen to his speeches and hear a lot of "fluff". Or, as one of my friends in Paris put it recently, "He's kind of a Martin Luther King Jr. wanna-be, isn't he?"

I don't necessarily agree with that assessment, but I do recognize this fear that the American People -- again -- will buy the hype and elect a guy with a thin resume and a whole ton of rhetoric to lead the Country out of the mess the other guy with a thin resume and a whole ton of rhetoric (albeit folksy rhetoric) they kinda sorta but not really elected last time made.
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Auntie Bush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 04:44 PM
Response to Reply #4
39. Interesting post!
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1corona4u Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 10:46 PM
Response to Reply #4
59. Bingo.
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Beacool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 02:59 AM
Response to Reply #4
67. Hear, hear!!!
Edited on Mon Jan-07-08 03:02 AM by Beacool
People are swept away by Obama's alluring personal history and forget that this shouldn't be a popularity contest, but a decision as to who would be the person to best govern in these tough times. I have been very busy talking to people who are on the fence and are attracted to his charisma but know very little about his record. Once I do a comparison list between Hillary and Obama, most of them agree that she's much more prepared to lead and that he's still quite young and has plenty of time to run in the future.

Time will tell who will end up being our nominee and I have tried real hard to buy what this guy is selling just in case he's our nominee for the GE, but I can't do it. To me he's a smooth operator akin to a slick salesman, I don't see him spewing much more than platitudes and he has a below the surface cockiness that surfaces on occasion when he lets down his guard.
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cindyw Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 12:37 PM
Response to Original message
6. Are you from Texas?
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Stop Cornyn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 12:47 PM
Response to Reply #6
14. Yes so whether or not they vote for our presidential nominee will not cost the ticket any electoral
votes.
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cindyw Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 01:03 PM
Response to Reply #14
30. Let me just assure you that in states where Obama can win,
there are large groups of friends who can support him.
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chascarrillo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 12:37 PM
Response to Original message
7. Would you be leaving your black friends behind if you voted for Hillary Clinton?
Serious question. Would you be leaving your African-American friends behind if you voted for Hillary Clinton, who was <b>personally at</b> a small, private fundraiser thrown for her last year by Jefferson Parish (LA) Sheriff Harry Lee?
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Stop Cornyn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 12:42 PM
Response to Reply #7
11. If Hillary invited a notorious racial bigot to join her on the stage at her campaign events, neither
I nor any of my friends could support her. Not in a million years.

That's my serious answer.
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chascarrillo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 12:44 PM
Response to Reply #11
13. But personal visits to private fundraisers held by notorious bigots are ok?
And this is what Sheriff Harry Lee was.
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Stop Cornyn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 12:50 PM
Response to Reply #13
16. I didn't say that. Frankly, I have never heard about the event you are talking about until you just
mentioned it. In any case, I'm an ex-Kucinich supporter now supporting Edwards so I don't support Hillary anyway.
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chascarrillo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 12:55 PM
Response to Reply #16
23. And you don't think that a Southern Democrat has some bigots in his closet? nt
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Stop Cornyn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 05:09 PM
Response to Reply #23
40. Are you making a judgment about Southern Democrats just because of where they're from? There should
be a word for judging other people based on what category they belong to instead of judging each person as an individual.
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mrreowwr_kittty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 01:04 PM
Response to Reply #16
31. Yes you just did say that.
It's only bad if you invite the bigot onstage. Any other manner of association, up to and including endorsements, contributions, fundraisers, and hiring them as consultants is hunky-dory. Well, unless you are named Obama. Then you'd get raked over the coals.
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mrreowwr_kittty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 01:00 PM
Response to Reply #13
25. Oh I've been through this many times with these people
Hillary Clinton's associations with bigots (including a known homophobic campaign consultant who is paid $10000 a month) are completely different. The poster you responded to, like all the rest, will contort themselves into pretzels to justify Clinton's actions while condemning Obama.

Then they will tell you that you're trying to distract from the issue by pointing the finger at someone else. Because the issue for them is not homophobia or bigotry, it is Obama. You will never get an answer to them why Clinton's ties with bigots are okay.

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TankLV Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 12:49 PM
Response to Reply #11
15. OUCH! we have a winner...
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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 07:22 PM
Response to Reply #11
47. You know so little about this that you don't even know that
Obama never appeared on stage with McClurkin. All your posts reek of bitterness and envy. I don't for one minute buy that you give a shit about this affair or have a clue about Obama's positions on GBLT issues- which are every bit as good as Edwards. Yes, the McClurkin business reflected poorly on Obama, but it's being made into a much bigger deal than it is by people who just don't want Obama to be the candidate. Too bad, it's likely he will be. And if this is the worst mistake he makes, that's not the end of the world.
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Stop Cornyn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 08:04 PM
Response to Reply #47
53. Dizzy from your spin? McClurkin said “God delivered me from homosexuality" at Obama's campaign event
where McClurkin was on stage in Charleston at Obama's INVITATION.

Final Word: Obama’s Anti-Gay Gospel Tour by Greg Hambrick for Gay Charleston:

So, there was a small group that protested the show last night and McClurkin apparently didn’t disappoint his fans.

He approached the subject gingerly at first. Then, just when the concert had seemed to reach its pitch and about to end, Mr. McClurkin returned to it with a full-blown plea: “Don’t call me a bigot or anti-gay when I have suffered the same feelings,” he cried.

“God delivered me from homosexuality,” he added. He then told the audience to believe the Bible over the blogs: “God is the only way.” The crowd sang and clapped along in full support.

While the events may help get some blacks to take another look at Obama, the negative impact in the gay community will go much further than South Carolina. Obama has a progressive stance on gay and lesbian issues and he can’t afford to miss any opportunity to get the word out. For now, all the LGBT community can hear is that crowd singing and clapping along with McClurkin.
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Egnever Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 10:26 PM
Response to Reply #53
58. We believe that everybody should have the same rights
We believe that everybody should have the same rights. That theres a right to life liberty and the pursuit of happiness.We don't believe in discrimination we don't believe in hatred,and if you do you are in the wrong place at the wrong time. Thats the whole premise of god thats the whole premise of christ its love love.

Donnie mclurkin at the same event
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dsc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 07:28 PM
Response to Reply #7
49. I would like a link for this
It would matter to me. But I am not going to just take the word of one post on a website.
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Hippo_Tron Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 12:38 AM
Response to Reply #7
64. Really, I didn't know she associated with that slime ball
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robbedvoter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 12:38 PM
Response to Original message
8. It's exactly how I felt in 2004 when I had to vote for a pro-war ticket- Kerry/Edwards
Edited on Sun Jan-06-08 12:39 PM by robbedvoter
And then, that vote got stolen too. And then the theft got shushed and swiped under the carpet.
So, voting for Obama in the GE would be a step ahead for me. having my vote counted - that would bring back hope.
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Newsjock Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 12:39 PM
Response to Original message
9. K&R #5
Because I'm tired of getting thrown under the train ... don't ask don't tell, "defense of marriage," and now this.
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CTyankee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 12:53 PM
Response to Reply #9
19. If Obama becomes president he needs to have a meeting with prominent leaders who are gay or pro gay
rights and hash this through. Obama is not seeing that his rhetoric about hope and certainly equality and human rights is empty if he cannot extend it to include gay people.

I have several huge beefs with the Clinton administration, the 2 largest being "don't ask, don't tell" (along with DOMA) and lack of action on Rwanda. "Don't ask, don't tell" has been a disaster, hurtful and harmful to gays who are serving their country and it has turned out badly. DOMA is proving to be that way, also.

Obama has to be made aware of the damage that such policies have inflicted on our gay citizens. If he is a decent person, and I think he is, he will turn around...
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RoadRage Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 12:41 PM
Response to Original message
10. Obama IS FOR CIVIL UNIONS..
His stance for the Gay community is the same as Edwards & Clinton (this has been hashed out 1,000,000 times on this site this week).

To be upset with him because of McClurkin is totally justifiable. To not VOTE for him because of McClurkin and allow a "Huckabee" a chance into the presidency is completely and utterly stupid.

If you think any one of the Republicans are going to help your friends out to a legalized union.. well, you know that isn't going to happen.

Obama is doing what he needs to do to get votes from everywhere he can. In the south, unfortunately there are MANY MANY People who dispise Gay people.. it's sad, but very much the truth. But, Obama has said from day one that he will support civil unions.. and that is FAR FAR better then what we currently have in office.

THAT should give you & your friends some damn hope!
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ruggerson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 12:50 PM
Response to Reply #10
17. He needs to make it right
I'm sure he will. Hopefully sooner rather than later. Recommitting himself to the cause of gay and lesbian equality does not take much time and effort on his part. But he needs to repair a breach he created.
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RoadRage Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 01:02 PM
Response to Reply #17
27. Maybe true..
But to say you'd note vote and let a Repub have a better shot at the election because he didn't apologize is not smart IMO.
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ruggerson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 01:03 PM
Response to Reply #27
29. I'm sure they feel very angry and resentful
He can fix that. Like I said, it doesn't take much.
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ruggerson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 12:43 PM
Response to Original message
12. But according to some DU Obama supporters, McClurkin is only a problem for a few loud mouthed homos
So, you're saying they're mistaken and that this is having real life impact?
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TankLV Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 12:51 PM
Response to Reply #12
18. OUCH! another good zinger...
thankyou...
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featherman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 12:54 PM
Response to Original message
21. McClurkin is a grammy award winning gospel singer
who was part of a gospel music tour. He's appeared on Oprah and many other formats. He's a singer, not a political advisor. Like many religious based singers he likely has views on gay issues, abortion, creationism, end times prophecy, and other things that are not in line with the views of Obama, Edwards, Clinton, etal.

Is your theory that this singer (one of many people tangentially connected to various political campaigns) is going to determine policy for an Obama Presidency because he was hired for a singing gig once?

Strange times... but whatever floats your boat.
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bettyellen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 01:09 PM
Response to Reply #21
33. Obama allowed him to use his own stage to talk about homosexuality as if it were a disease.
he was chasing a bigot vote. and i know lots of people- even here- hope he got it.
the ends justifies everything (for those who already have all their civil rights) i guess.
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MuseRider Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 12:54 PM
Response to Original message
22. Well said.
This is a path I cannot take. I can't vote for someone who feels that my friends rights are negotiable for votes. No matter what he has said, what his policies state he acted in a manner that makes those things untrustworthy.

Civil Unions do not cut it unless we all fall under that name. There is no reason that can be found to support the need for a different name except to scream "They Are Different!".

I get no hope from the tour of hope or whatever the fuck it is called. You can't heal divisions by creating them.
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CyberPieHole Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 01:00 PM
Response to Original message
26. "Sense(sic) when does(sic) 'the gays' tell the party what to do"...
At least that's what some less~than~progressive member wrote here on DU.:eyes:

:kick: and recommend
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grasswire Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 01:02 PM
Response to Original message
28. I feel no hope with him either
...but for different reasons. I simply don't have confidence in him to meet the immense challenges, and I'm frightened of another presidency where unelected advisors make the decisions because the president is green. To me, he's a politician who has seized an opportunity for which he is unqualified. That's how I feel.
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DemCam Donating Member (911 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 05:37 PM
Response to Reply #28
41. I've spent all morning trying to overcome this same feeling.
But then I felt the same way about Bill Clinton initially and
then ended up feeling like he was the best president of my
lifetime. The difference tho, is that Clinton had years of
experience as an executive in a state that has some pretty
rough and tumble politics.

I can't decide if he's a true idealist...at which point they'll
kill him off for sure...almost always the true idealist's fate

or

If he's one tough cookie who is capable of all manner of ruthlessness
...which means he'll probably survive...but we don't know what he'll
accomplish.

Guess that's always the risk when we embrace the unknown.
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grasswire Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 09:05 PM
Response to Reply #41
55. I'm not embracing this unknown (eom)
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RoadRage Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 01:06 PM
Response to Original message
32. I think Every One of You are going to HOPE he wins
Come November, 2008 - if he is in fact the Democratic Presidential Nominee.

You're going to HOPE and PRAY he wins the election over ANY of the Repubicans... because at the end of the day.. he is FOR Civil Unions.. and Not one Republican is for them (ehh.. where is Rudy on this one now, exactly.. i might be wrong on him).

And again.. Obama has no different stance on this issue then Edwards or Clinton. And none of the others still in the running have a shot at winning the nomination.
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ananda Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 01:11 PM
Response to Original message
34. yeah
"I'd vote for him, but unless he makes this situation right, I'll need to bring pliers because I'll have to pinch my nose so hard. I may not even be able to tell my friends that I voted for Obama. I'd literally feel shame over abandoning my friends to vote for Obama."

I hear that! Except for me, it's about so many issues.

Obama worries me.

I'm just hoping and praying that forces will be in play that will pressure him into doing the right thing in so many areas, including ending the war.. healthcare.. choice.. and rights for all targeted groups.
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NoPasaran Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 01:11 PM
Response to Original message
35. I guess the momentum in this race really has changed
A week or so ago, no one knew anyone who would vote for Hillary. Now, no one knows anyone who will vote for Obama.

:shrug:
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zelduh Donating Member (8 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 07:27 PM
Response to Reply #35
48. No one knows anyone who will vote for Obama?
I think you need to get out a bit more often.  Let me tell you
who will vote for Obama in New Hampshire, just using polls and
the Political Stock Markets:

Pollster John Zogby says it best:

    “Make no mistake about it, there is movement here. Only
50% of this sample is after the Iowa caucus results were known
and there has been a 5-point swing on the Democratic side.
Clinton started out leading 32% to 26% over Obama and now she
is in a dead heat at 31% to 30%. Obama has won in that part of
the sample taken since Iowa – and just this past one day alone
Obama led by 8 points.

    “Democrats are drawing the lion’s share of the
Independents (40% of the total vote) and I have two key
observations to make:

        * Edwards still holds at 20% (including 21% since 
          Iowa).
        * Obama gets the lion’s share of leaners, with 
          Edwards receiving a smaller share. Clinton 
          is shut out among leaners.

Here are the latest poll results, with Zogby's first:

    ZOGBY:     1/2-5      1/1-4    12/31-1/3
    ----------------------------------------
    Clinton       31         32          32
    Obama         30         28          26
    Edwards       20         20          20

American Research Group:

    ARG         1/4-5     1/1-3     12/27-29
    ----------------------------------------
    Clinton      26         35          31
    Obama        38         31          27
    Edwards      20         15          21

    Obama leads Edwards among men 42% to 21%, with 19% for
Hillary. Among women, Obama leads Hillary 35% to 31%, with 20%
for Edwards. Hillary leads Obama among Democrats 34% to 32%,
while Obama leads Edwards among independents 49% to 21%. 

MSNBC/McClatchy/Mason-Dixon (no comparatives to yesterday)

    MSNBC       1/5  12/9
    ---------------------
    Clinton     31     30
    Obama       33     27
    Edwards     17     17

Rasmussen

    RAS         1/4-5     1/3-4
    ---------------------------
    Clinton      27         27
    Obama        39         37
    Edwards      18         19

 
Research 2000 - Concord Monitor

    Dem        1/5  12/13
    ---------------------
    Clinton    33     31
    Obama      34      32
    Edwards    23      18

WHAT THE POLITICAL STOCK MARKETS SAY ABOUT NEW HAMPSHIRE:

    Intrade     Bid/Ask
    ---------------------
    Clinton    18.0/24.5
    Obama      78.0/80.5

    UPDATE(!):  Intrade (finally) shows that Obama is beating 
    Hillary for the US National Democratic Nomination:

    Nomin.      Bid/Ask
    -------------------
    Clinton    37.9/37.2
    Obama      60.9/60.1 

Rasmussen Markets: 

    Rasmussen Latest Price
    ----------------------
    Clinton     19.0
    Obama       81.9

    US (national) Democratic Nomination
    -----------------------------------
    Clinton    37.9
    Obama      60.9

National Journal Political Stock Exchange:

    NJSE      Bid/Ask
    --------------------
    Clinton   20.0/22.0
    Obama     81.9/83.4 

    US (national) Democratic Nomination

    NJSE-Nat  Bid/Ask 
    -------------------
    Clinton   37.5/37.9
    Obama     60.1/60.8
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NoPasaran Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 11:48 PM
Response to Reply #48
61. Just an observation based on the OP
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jerryster Donating Member (685 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 01:20 PM
Response to Original message
36. I just found this after reading your post
I was unaware of this McClurkin, so I googled him and found the following quote:

Mr. Obama said through a spokesman that he “strongly disagrees” with Mr. McClurkin’s views. He did not indicate he would cancel Mr. McClurkin’s appearance, but said, “I have consistently spoken directly to African-American religious leaders about the need to overcome the homophobia that persists in some parts of our community so that we can confront issues like H.I.V./AIDS and broaden the reach of equal rights in this country.”

The statement he makes about homophobia among African Americans was also made in a recent interview Kanye West did with GQ mag. He's getting past it but acknowledges that it's widespread.

I recall seeing on TV some time ago an anti-gay marriage demonstration by a huge number of African Americans. I remember thinking that it was ironic and sad to see them on the wrong side of a civil rights issue.

Re: Obama and McClurkin, I have to believe that Obama is too well educated to believe that "prayer can cure gayness" bullshit. It will be interesting to see if he'll challenge this guy on that notion.





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LWolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 01:21 PM
Response to Original message
37. In my case, it's way too late to fix
if the only way to "fix" the problem is for Obama to change who he is. The only way to "fix" the problems is to make sure that he is not the nominee.

That's problematic, since the same thing holds for HRC.

Of course, I'm sure my single vote isn't that critical, lol.
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TheWatcher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 05:11 AM
Response to Reply #37
69. Since too many of us seem to have forgotten that they still have the machines
Edited on Mon Jan-07-08 05:12 AM by TheWatcher
None of our votes may turn out to be critical.

But that will not stop me from Voting, and it should not deter anyone here.

If we're going down, they are at least going to work for it.

And perhaps if the turnout is large enough, maybe they won't be able to steal this one.
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LWolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 08:49 AM
Response to Reply #69
70. I will VOTE. Just not for either of those.
And NO, I won't be throwing a vote a republican's way either, since that is always the automatic reaction.

I will either vote 3rd party or independent, or I'll write a better Democrat in. I won't be silenced, and neither will I be coerced.
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Hailtothechimp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 02:35 PM
Response to Original message
38. Think for yourself.
If your friends would hold a vote for Obama (or anybody else) against you, are they really your friends?
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Stop Cornyn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 11:33 PM
Response to Reply #38
60. The point isn't that my gay friends would be disappointed in me; I'd be disappointed in me for
throwing my gay friends under the bus to vote for a candidate who would craft his reach-across-the isle bi-partisan agreement by trading their rights for some other goal that Obama finds more worthy.
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Anouka Donating Member (712 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 12:53 AM
Response to Reply #60
66. So you're basically beating yourself up for no reason
Do you actually know whether they would be disappointed in you, or are you making up their minds for themselves?

Are you martyring yourself?

Are they even really your friends?

Is this all in your head?


You need to talk to your friends. Don't symbolically commit suicide in their name. That's not the action of a friend. It's the action of a narcissist. Don't be so self-centered.




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annie1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 05:43 PM
Response to Original message
42. Same here, absolute opposite of hope...
Edited on Sun Jan-06-08 06:01 PM by annie1
Watching people fall hook line and sinker for this lightweight recycled hope/change/unity platform is just depressing. He uses mellifluous speech pattern and utters a couple of slogans and the masses line up to hear him utter the same bs that Bush sold people on in 2004. It's awful to watch unfold in front of my very eyes. It's surreal. I have no hope that people will ever get it right.
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Carrieyazel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 07:21 PM
Response to Reply #42
46. Great post. You concisely expressed everything I feel to the letter.
Obama is a loser if he's our nominee.
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Cameron27 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 12:46 AM
Response to Reply #42
65. I'm beginning to feel the same way,
it's like an unstoppable force of "hope." I need affordable health care among other things, not inspiration and sweet rhetoric. I'm glad Clinton's forcing the issue of voting records, and my "hope" is that this election will be decided on the issues, not on personality.
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ElizabethDC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 05:48 PM
Response to Original message
43. Indeed, me too.
I'm very, very concerned about the prospect of an Obama nomination. I don't think he'd be a very good candidate or a very good president. I think we can do better. At least, I hope we can.
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Tejanocrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 07:12 PM
Response to Original message
44. I feel the exact same way.
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Carrieyazel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 07:16 PM
Response to Original message
45. Your friends know what they're talking about. Obama is all talk, and no substance.
He'll get beaten in November.
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NMMNG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 07:41 PM
Response to Original message
50. You are not the only one who feels this way.
Many of us do. :-(


And the Obama supporters just don't get it, nor do they want to.


I guess we just need a glass of Instant Smile.
A Gram is better than a Damn.



Screw human rights.



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wiley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 07:54 PM
Response to Original message
52. It feels like Reagan all over again.
That's not hope.
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zulchzulu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 08:16 PM
Response to Original message
54. Are your friends equally as appalled at Edwards and Hillary for their gay stances?
Perhaps you remember when Edwards said he was "uncomfortable" around gays?

Then there's Clinton, who has homophobes on her web site and on her payroll. Add that her husband helped bolster homophobia by signing the very homophobic Defense Of Marriage Act.

Are your friends just plain McCarthyistic by not even looking at Obama's clearly very supportive dozen years of supporting LGBT rights and condemned McClurkin for one concert on one night in a small town with three other acts? They certainly know his record on LGBT rights and they still think the McClurkin event is an issue?

Your friends are phonies if they don't see the full picture.

I have a number of friends who are gay who fully support Obama. If your friends want to help get a Republican homophobe in power by voting third-party, then they can't whine about more legislation that will be imposed against them.

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bagimin Donating Member (945 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 09:21 PM
Response to Reply #54
56. don't confuse these people here at "Edwards Underground"
with the facts.
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robbedvoter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-06-08 10:20 PM
Response to Reply #56
57. You coined it! A keeper.
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bagimin Donating Member (945 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 06:46 PM
Response to Reply #57
71. gracias
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FreeState Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 12:29 AM
Response to Original message
62. I feel the same way here
I was just about to post on it hen I saw this. Thanks. K&R
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Stop Cornyn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 12:34 AM
Response to Reply #62
63. Thanks.
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Divine Discontent Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-07-08 03:08 AM
Response to Original message
68. I'm gay
I'm not really excited about Obama. He will most likely get my GE vote if he's the nominee. My best friend just told me he doesn't trust Obama but would probably vote for him over the repubs, and his Mom flat out said she does not like him and refuses to vote for him. So, there's some issues here. Of course, I have one beef with Obama for his snarky way of joking about Joe Biden NOT getting an AIDS test with HIM at the same time, woh, I'm not gay fellow black people in the audience, and #2, for the Mary Mary/Donnie McClurkin Gospel Tour invites, when these people are heavily anti-gay and talk about it frequently. It appeared like he was choosing them SPECIFICALLY for that, because of the state it was being done in.

Well, some good news, check out my general discussion post about Edwards 2 points back nationally according to Rasmussen Reports! (or see breaking news forum)
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