I am so over the top repulsed by the tactics of the Clinton fans on this Reagan Obama linkage

Folks for the love of whatever you believe in. Its a friggin abstraction. It is about what it takes to build winning coalition.


It has nothing, Nada zilch to to with anything approaching an adoration of Reagan or his policies.


But of course most of you know that,,,,,, you just are practicing the art of divide and conquer perfected by your candidate.


She is not worthy to follow the footsteps of FDR Harry Truman JFK, LBJ RFK, Hubert Humphrey, George McGovern Jimmy Carter, Teddy Kennedy, Walter Mondale, Gary Hart, Paul Tsongaa, Her husband, Al Gore or John Kerry.

You wonder why people do not like Hillary...It is divisive crap like this that goes on day after day...It is utter bullshit.

You know it is.


You folks spewing this crap need to read a damn history book...need to open your eyes long enough to see the pure ugliness of this particular theme.


We are all Democrats. We all want to win. Stop practicing republican tactics on your friends and colleagues.

But a thread was just pointed out to me by a friend. I agree with you. This is more pretzel-twisting.

and the chic left is in denial that he's further right than Clinton.

to win the nomination, if one is qualified to be the nominee that is.

Obama thinks catsup is a vegetable yet?

McCain and Cheney as the final damnation. Their last common relative was hundreds of years ago, but this shit matters, you know? :eyes:

and you don't say a word.

And by that I mean how quickly Obama got to the bottom of that flier and fixed the problem...not your post.

Notice how when Obama's supporters screw up, he corrects it quickly. Yet, when Hillary's supporters (i.e. Johnson) screw up, she brushes it off by saying "He's apologized for that", when indeed he has not.

Shall I provide the link to Johnson's comments, for fairness sake?

Need I provide the link to Jesse Jackson, Jr.'s quotes.

Because I then have to drag out all of the other unfortunate and uncorrected quotes that have come out of the Clinton campaign in the past 2 weeks. And I'm sick of looking at them.

And FWIW, I think that Jackson's comments were out of line. Would you also agree that the comments of Johnson, Cuomo, "imaginary hip black friend" advisor and Bill Clinton have been out of life? That the comments of Hillary Clinton were unfortunate?

No, of course you wouldn't. Hillary and her supporters, don't admit mistakes.

Don't act like your hands are clean.

but I loathe Reagan, and I don't like Obama's using him as a reference for anything in this primary. Leave Reagan to the Republicans thank you.

just watch the context in context.

http://news.rgj.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080115/VIDEO/80115026&oaso=news.rgj.com/breakingnews

Missing ya! :loveya:

Now we have Obama pandering to Reagan, too.

Frankly, it's disgusting- and Obama ought to apologize to all the people hurt by the policies that resulted from all the senseless Reagan adulation.

perfectly good pissing match.

*tsk

Accuse Bill Clinton of being anti woman for using the phrase one man one vote http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x4087561

Bring up Monica - http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=4084377&mesg_id=4084377

Claim Hillary campaigned in MI with BS evidence - http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x4085426

:popcorn:

simple question yes or no?

Newsflash: Obama & Clinton supporters are for the most part rude assholes. Including you and me.

Supposedly Bill is painting Obama as the establishment candidate....unless you follow the links to what he really said..

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x4084231

Tell YOUR friends and colleagues to stop adulating Republican Ronald Reagan and his infectious presidency that buried this country and its coming generations in such enormous debt.

And at the same time condemning the Bill Clinton presidency as having "accomplished nothing" when that is an outright lie - see my previous posts about the 20 million new jobs, three balanced budgets, payments from the surpluses on the national debt, and leaving his presidency with a projected 10 year surplus that would alleviate social security shortfalls - if any.

Rejecting Bill Clinton in favor of Ronald Reagan is an indicator of ignorance of recent presidential history.

were you around when Reagan swept into power with a HUGE plurality of the vote? Yes, I find his policies despicable but the man had a mandate and the backing of the American people. I remember this very vividly both in 1980 when he trounced Carter by a huge margin and in 1984, my first vote for Mondale, how massively he defeated Mondale. (I think Mondale won one or two states). Reagan had a huge assed mandate that has not been seen for quite awhile. That does not believe I agree with his policies, because they were deplorable, but he was able to win a huge margin of voters Repubs and Dems.

When Clinton won in 1992 he had won with a 42% (somewhere around there) majority of the vote. I remember vividly after Clinton won the Repubs crowing that he did not win the majority of the vote therefore, not having a huge mandate with the American people. He beat Dole by a bigger margin in 96, but again, not with the same amount of support that Reagan garnered.

I watched the clip and all I saw was Obama putting elections and wins into historical perspective. He is an analytical type of guy so I don't buy for a second that he was swooning over Reagan. He even stated he disagreed with Reagan's polices. His main gist was talking about periods in our history when people get fed up with government and want sweeping change, and he sees this time as a paradigm shift in our politics. I did not see him fawning over Reagan or dissing Clinton.

Mandate? Plurality defines mandate? Reagan didn't have a goofy billionaire running as a third party candidate. That's beside the point.

You say: "all I saw was Obama putting elections and wins into historical perspective?" "Historical perspective?" You mean like Hillary putting MLK and LBJ into hysterical, I mean, historical perspective?

Yeah, I get your point.

are going around the bend a bit and becoming completely irrational for their fervor for Clinton. I support Obama, but my world will not end if he loses.

yet attacked him because he said the word Ronald Reagan. He was pointing out that there are times in history where theres been a generational shift in politics and perceptions and that Reagan was there for that shift moreso than Bill Clinton was. Now if anyone wants to dispute this fact and tell me that Bill Clinton was there to shift the course of the country in way that significantly altered history please feel free.

Barack Obama will win because he has his finger on the pulse of America.

The End.

The stoopid shit.

They hear Ronald Reagan, and they freak....to the point of never getting to the context of the entire point. Its a pretty superficial way of operating.

and you'd think that those who professes of being Liberal, meaning open to new ideas would at least take a listen. Instead, they only listen to what they want to, and steal soundbytes on the rest and actually believe that they are informed. :shrug:

the entire thing, and then I commented.

That's the difference.

This place is bullshit echo chamber.

Reagan was a disaster from the October Surprise through Iran-Contra.

Yes, I do know my history. No, I am not a Hillary supporter.

well said.

"But I think, when I think about great presidents, I think about those who transform how we think about ourselves as a country in fundamental ways...And, you know, there are circumstances in which, I would argue, Ronald Reagan was a very successful president, even though I did not agree with him on many issues, partly because at the end of his presidency, people, I think, said, “You know what? We can regain our greatness. Individual responsibility and personal responsibility are important.” And they transformed the culture and not simply promoted one or two particular issues."

At the end of Reagan's presidency, most of the Democrats that I know were ready to hang themselves out of hopelessness and despair. Our country had turned from a vibrant prosperous and hopeful evolving democracy rife with change into a stagnant, indebted semi-fascist state. The culture was transformed from a burgeoning altruistic society into an "it's all about me and only me" society.

And Reagan was not a great president. He sucked. He laid the foundation for our current struggle with fascism and is largely responsible for Bu*h being able to topple so many democratic safeguards and institutions seemingly at will.