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Obama spanks Poor Little Lying Hillary with her new ad about Single Payer

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zulchzulu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 04:03 PM
Original message
Obama spanks Poor Little Lying Hillary with her new ad about Single Payer
The Bill And Hillary Truth Contortion Circus Tour continues with a new ad saying that Obama "opposes" Single Payer. She is either the most stupid, inept tripe around, has a bad hearing problem or is just a liar. Lemme guess...

Anyway, here's the Obama Smackdown...

From the site:

Fact Check: Obama Consistent in His Position on Single Payer Health Care
January 21, 2008

Rhetoric: "Today, he opposes single payer health care, and attacks Sen. Clinton for proposing a plan that covers everyone"

Reality: Obama Has Consistently Said That If We Were Starting From Scratch, He Would Support A Single Payer System, But Now We Need To Build On The System We Have

If Obama Were Starting From Scratch, He Would Support A Single Payer System. The New Yorker wrote, "'If you're starting from scratch,' he says, 'then a single-payer system'-a government-managed system like Canada's, which disconnects health insurance from employment-'would probably make sense. But we've got all these legacy systems in place, and managing the transition, as well as adjusting the culture to a different system, would be difficult to pull off. So we may need a system that's not so disruptive that people feel like suddenly what they've known for most of their lives is thrown by the wayside.'"

If Obama Were Starting From Scratch, He Would Support A Single Payer System. "At a roundtable with a handful of invited guests at Lindy's Diner in Keene, Obama said if he were starting from scratch, he would probably propose a single payer health care system, but because of existing infrastructure, he created a proposal to improve the current system."

If Obama Were Starting From Scratch, He Would Support A Single Payer System. Obama said, "Here's the bottom line. If I were designing a system from scratch I would probably set up a single-payer system...But we're not designing a system from scratch...And when we had a healthcare forum before I set up my healthcare plan here in Iowa there was a lot of resistance to a single-payer system. So what I believe is we should set up a series of choices....Over time it may be that we end up transitioning to such a system. For now, I just want to make sure every American is covered...I don't want to wait for that perfect system...The one thing you should ask about the candidates though is who's gonna have the capacity to actually deliver on the change?...I believe I've got a better capacity to break the gridlock and attract both Independents and Republicans to work together." <http://iowa.barackobama.com/page/community/tag/Ames>

http://factcheck.barackobama.com/factcheck/2008/01/21/fact_check_obama_consistent_in.php

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Unsane Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 04:04 PM
Response to Original message
1. He should release a counter ad
About her Iraq war waffling
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 04:21 PM
Response to Reply #1
26. He should have one with all her lies
Because she hasn't said one true thing about him.
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TwilightZone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 04:05 PM
Response to Original message
2. So, in other words, he doesn't support a single-payer system.
He supports working with the one we have.

What was the problem again?
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 04:06 PM
Response to Reply #2
4. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
TwilightZone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 04:10 PM
Response to Reply #4
8. No, he proposes making adjustments to the system we have, not dumping it for a single-payer system.
Pretty clear.
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Barack_America Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 04:12 PM
Response to Reply #8
9. So you're a Kucinich supporter?
Isn't he the only one proposing a true single-payer plan?
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John Q. Citizen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 04:20 PM
Response to Reply #9
25. Kucinich has the only single payer plan.
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zulchzulu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 04:15 PM
Response to Reply #4
12. Obama supports universal healthcare without fining people and forcing it down their throats
Yes, he'd like Single Payer if we could start all over again. Is that thought over your head?

He also thinks that making people have to pay a forced extra $800+ when they don't have the money to do it is kind of a shitty idea.

Do you know many people who can just add another $800 monthly bill to their budget? And the worst part about the healthcare industry lobbyist approved Clinton plan is that she thinks they will lower their costs out of the goodness of their heart.

Hillary already tried to do the healthcare reform dance and failed MISERABLY and also caused the Democrats to lose the Congress because of her big mouth. Her ideas are like an old circa-1992 8-track in the dumpster as far as I'm concerned.
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TwilightZone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 04:49 PM
Response to Reply #12
34. If one does not "support" single-payer healthcare...
Edited on Tue Jan-22-08 04:49 PM by TwilightZone
then one "opposes" it.

He does not support single-payer health care. He supports keeping the current system and making changes to it.

Since he supports keeping the current system, he opposes switching to single-payer health care.

Support is the opposite of oppose.

That invalidates your entire OP.

Is that clear enough for you?
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zulchzulu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 05:28 PM
Response to Reply #34
36. It's not that simple, my friend
I am for single payer healthcare.

I also know that in order to get single payer healthcare REALLY brought about, we need to bring it in incrementally. We need to do it without mandates and penalizing individuals for not getting coverage.

We need to whittle away at the very powerful healthcare insurance and pharmaceutical industries and perhaps do some reform with the FDA as well as allow people to buy drugs from anywhere in the World as long as the drugs are monitored for safety.

To just say you are for single payer healthcare and want to get it overnight is not going to happen. Let's legalize hemp while we're at it.

The hurdles that we need to get single payer need to be dismantled screw by screw, part by part until we get it at last.

Obama wants single payer like just about everyone else. That's why he said that if he could start from scratch, he would try to get single payer. But he also knows how legislation is passed and until you have clear majorities or have convincing leadership abilities like Reagan did to get those on the other side to vote by a large majority to get it through.

If you think the billion dollar industries like healthcare insurance and the pharmaceuticals are going to just lay down and take it, you don't know how much power they have.

We're all on the same side when it comes to wanting single payer. The difference is just how we do it versus just doing political theater and getting nothing actually accomplished.

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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 04:07 PM
Response to Reply #2
5. Deleted sub-thread
Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 04:13 PM
Response to Reply #2
10. BINGO
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Barack_America Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 04:16 PM
Response to Reply #10
14. And neither does Hillary and neither does Edwards.
Good god, don't people read anymore?
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TwilightZone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 04:17 PM
Response to Reply #10
18. Personally, I thought that "But Now We Need To Build On The System We Have"
was pretty clear.
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Barack_America Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 04:20 PM
Response to Reply #18
24. It was clear, unless you're hell-bent on confusing it...
Which is the way some people here approach a lot of issues.
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merbex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 04:06 PM
Response to Original message
3. The youtube culture we are in now has risen up and bitten him in the ass
The ad put together by the Clinton campaign is devastating and he can spin till he falls down dizzy but that ad shows he had a different position in 2003
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durrrty libby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 04:08 PM
Response to Reply #3
6. Which ad is that? I'd like to see it
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ccpup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 04:15 PM
Response to Reply #6
13. here ya go
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rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 04:21 PM
Response to Reply #13
27. oh my---that will be an OUCHIE
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durrrty libby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 05:11 PM
Response to Reply #13
35. Ha! Hypocrite thy name is Barack. Thanks and the one she is running
in SC is really the best "I'll Look Out For You"


Her ads are always so succinct
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zulchzulu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 04:08 PM
Response to Reply #3
7. If by "devastating", you mean bullshit, you are correct
Yeah, all the young YouTubers are big Shrillary fans...

:rofl:


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soundguy Donating Member (205 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 04:16 PM
Response to Reply #7
15. Don't You Guys Get Off soon? N/T
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Proud2BAmurkin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 04:14 PM
Response to Original message
11. You can't campaign on single payer and then campaign on something else too.
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zulchzulu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 04:16 PM
Response to Reply #11
16. A quiz for you: count on your fingers how long ago 2003 was
Another question...did you make it through college? I'm curious.

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rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 04:17 PM
Response to Original message
17. hey z..z.. Both sites are from Obama's website--got any OUTSIDE non-biased facts?
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zulchzulu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 04:19 PM
Response to Reply #17
21. Debunk what was there
Betcha can't...

:rofl:

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John Q. Citizen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 04:18 PM
Response to Original message
19. Neither Obama or Hillary or Edwards supports single payer. Hill's attempt in
the early 90's wasn't single payer nor is her current plan.

Neither is Obama's or Edward's.

I wish they would all endorse the Kucincih/Conyers single payer plan, currently introduced into the US House of Representitives, but hell hasn't frozen over yet so I guess we will just have to let the insurance industry tell us what we get.

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Barack_America Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 04:24 PM
Response to Reply #19
29. Shhh. You'll confuse them with facts. They don't know what to do with them...
besides twist them as they see fit. lol
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CoffeeCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 04:18 PM
Response to Original message
20. ...but the facts don't matter to the Clintons...
Edited on Tue Jan-22-08 04:20 PM by TwoSparkles
They're professional film editors and they will rule the world
with their powers of distortion!

Who gives a rip what Obama actually said. Oh please!

We do not waste our time with what a candidate means.

It's about how effectively you can make it look like they said something they didn't !

Get with the program!

It's win at all costs!

Destroy! Deceive! Disembowel! Go Hillary! You go Girl!!!!!!!
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Cha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 04:19 PM
Response to Original message
22. All of the above..
If the media would expose her like they didn't expose bush then people might think twice about electing all of the above.
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HughMoran Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 04:20 PM
Response to Original message
23. I've had enough
of this putrid spin.

:hi:
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Barack_America Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 04:23 PM
Response to Reply #23
28. Please define how correcting a misstatement is spin?
Or are you sick of Hillary's spin?

Are you accusing factcheck of spinning?

I don't get it.
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HughMoran Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 04:29 PM
Response to Reply #28
31. The embellishing adjectives
I am sick of it :hi:
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zulchzulu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 05:32 PM
Response to Reply #31
37. Hey! Good name for a band!
:smoke:

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Cha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 04:25 PM
Response to Reply #23
30. Yes, hilary's spin is quite putrid..
thanks for pointing that out.
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HughMoran Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 04:29 PM
Response to Reply #30
32. Thanks for jumping in
:hi:
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Bitwit1234 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 04:39 PM
Response to Original message
33. Why are these posts allowed and you can't post negative about HIM.
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bvar22 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 05:34 PM
Response to Original message
38. BIG problem for Obama here:

"'If you're starting from scratch,' he says, 'then a single-payer system'-a government-managed system like Canada's, which disconnects health insurance from employment-'would probably make sense. But we've got all these legacy systems in place, and managing the transition, as well as adjusting the culture to a different system, would be difficult to pull off. "


The Problem for Obama?
He ignores a successful, efficient, and effective single payer system that is already in place!
No need to build a new infrastructure or start from scratch.

Simple EXPAND the already successful single payer system....Expand MediCare.
Americans are already "used to it". (Just TRY to take MediCare away from a Senior..I DARE you.)
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