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(One of) Bill's lies of the day yesterday about how Hillary pulled an "upset" in Nevada...

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jenmito Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-23-08 12:12 PM
Original message
(One of) Bill's lies of the day yesterday about how Hillary pulled an "upset" in Nevada...
He had the nerve to say yesterday, at a campaign stop, "Hillary pulled an upset in Nevada. All the organized forces were against her." No link, but they played the video this morning on MSNBC. He just says whatever he wants, true or NOT.
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jenmito Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-23-08 01:37 PM
Response to Original message
1. kick for attention
:)
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Proud2BAmurkin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-23-08 01:40 PM
Response to Original message
2. Her NV victory was stunning especially the fact that she won the Culinary votes.
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jenmito Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-23-08 01:44 PM
Response to Reply #2
4. She was EXPECTED to win. She'd been up in the polls by over 20 points and even the final polls had
her ahead. Bill patently LIED when he said all the organized labor was against her. They were all FOR her except for the ONE union who endorsed Obama too late to make an impact. Many of the members already made up their minds to vote for Hillary. To call it an "upset" is false.
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rinsd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-23-08 01:42 PM
Response to Original message
3. Largest union in the state was gunning for her.
She overcame them even winning quite a few votes from their rank & file.

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jenmito Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-23-08 01:46 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. They endorsed him too late. Many of their members already decided to vote for Hillary as was
Edited on Wed Jan-23-08 01:47 PM by jenmito
apparent by the poll numbers (not to mention the CNN debate in NV where she was applauded for everything she said and the others were booed for saying ANYTHING about her. BC lied in what he said.
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pampango Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-23-08 01:46 PM
Response to Original message
6. That's not a lie. It's just the spin that all campaigns use with every
primary/caucus result. There is almost always some way to frame a result as being a great comeback or surprise. If Obama had won there, he would have changed the specifics of the spin, but the depiction of a comeback or surprise would have been the same.
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jenmito Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-23-08 01:49 PM
Response to Reply #6
7. It IS a lie to say she had "all the organized labor against her." Flat out LIE.
Saying someone else would've lied is no excuse. That wasn't spin. It was a lie.
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pampango Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-23-08 02:02 PM
Response to Reply #7
12. I'll grant that ""all the organized labor against her" was not accurate.
My assumption was that he was merely trying to spin the fact that the culinary workers union had endorsed Obama and the Nevada Supreme Court had denied the teachers union lawsuit. Obviously, Clinton had the support of the teachers union, so all of organized labor was not against her.

Bill is about as good a spinmeister as there is, so I don't begrudge him a little "exaggeration" which, again, I think most campaigns do after votes are counted.
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jenmito Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-23-08 02:09 PM
Response to Reply #12
13. Thanks. But the fact that ONE union endorsed Obama, ONE WEEK before the caucus, was too
little too late. The members of that union already made up their minds about whom to vote for. Hillary had not only MORE than one union's endorsement, she also had the establishment on her side. He didn't spin her win. He LIED about it.
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Hello_Kitty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-23-08 02:25 PM
Response to Reply #7
22. Why would anyone in organized labor support the Clintons after what they did in NV?
Going on TV and making bogus claims about intimidation and voter suppression does NOT put unions in a positive light with the general public, Bill. That in addition to their Southern Strategy and divide and conquer the African American and Hispanic vote is NOT going to help us at all in the general. Thanks again, Bill and Hillary. :grr:
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Perry Logan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-23-08 01:49 PM
Response to Reply #6
8. Another false accusation debunked. If only some of this energy could be focused on Republicans!
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Metric System Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-23-08 01:52 PM
Response to Reply #6
9. Again,
an Obama supporter is SHOCKED that spin is being used in a political campaign? Can you imagine?!?
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jenmito Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-23-08 01:55 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. "Spin" and lies are two different things. n/t
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suston96 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-23-08 01:57 PM
Response to Original message
11. What's the deal with people here who insist on calling people's opinions....
....they don't agree with, lies?
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jenmito Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-23-08 02:10 PM
Response to Reply #11
14. So it's an OPINION that "all the organized labor was against her"???
No. It's a factual LIE.
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suston96 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-23-08 02:16 PM
Response to Reply #14
16. "Factual lie"? That's an oxymoron. No such thing as a "factual lie".
Most everyone agrees with Bill Clinton's opinion. Your pain, however, is understandable, as women and latino voters picked Hillary over Obama - as they also told their bosses and the union leaders where to go, pointing the direction with their middle fingers.
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jenmito Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-23-08 02:17 PM
Response to Reply #16
18. He lied about a fact. The fact HE claimed was that Hillary had all the organized labor against her.
Edited on Wed Jan-23-08 02:19 PM by jenmito
That was a lie. A lie about the fact that all the organized labor was NOT against Hillary. It's not an opinion.
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suston96 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-23-08 02:32 PM
Response to Reply #18
23. He did not say that "Hillary had all the organized labor against her."
You just said:

"He lied about a fact. The fact HE claimed was that Hillary had all the organized labor against her."

Your Op says: "Hillary pulled an upset in Nevada. All the organized forces were against her."

You changed what he said ! Get it? "Organized forces" is not "organized labor".

Now does that make you a liar? Or just uh, careless?
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jenmito Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-23-08 02:41 PM
Response to Reply #23
24. You're right. He said, "All the organized FORCES were against her."
Edited on Wed Jan-23-08 02:44 PM by jenmito
It makes me careless. Not a liar like Bill. What ARE "organized forces" besides unions and the establishment which was all for Hillary except one union?
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suston96 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-23-08 02:46 PM
Response to Reply #24
25. Bill Clinton never lies. That includes saying that he never had sex with that woman....
...BJs are not sex. But his finger may have lied.

He and Hillary both choose their words very carefully. That doesn't stop the media and others who want to from hearing and repeating distortions of what they think they said.
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jenmito Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-23-08 03:00 PM
Response to Reply #25
26. Yes he did...
and yes they are.

And they're NOT choosing their words very carefully. He said he was against the Iraq war from the beginning. Are you saying that's true?
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-23-08 02:16 PM
Response to Reply #11
17. She had Harry Reid and the state Dem Party
She didn't freakin' NEED anybody else. For him to say "ALL" the organized forces were against her is a lie. She also had the majority of the unions on her side. Those are the facts, not opinions, and facts are your friend, are should be.
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jenmito Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-23-08 02:19 PM
Response to Reply #17
19. Thank you.
:hi:
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sniffa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-23-08 02:13 PM
Response to Original message
15. It was a huge upset for her.
No one expected her to pull it off after being up only 25 points, and having the name Clinton.
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jenmito Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-23-08 02:20 PM
Response to Reply #15
20. Exactly.
:D
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robbedvoter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-23-08 02:22 PM
Response to Original message
21. The truth is: Reagan lost to unions (and women won for Hillary). No lie.
That union thing was so hyped, and open voting against your boss is sooo wrong!
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zulchzulu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-23-08 03:13 PM
Response to Original message
27. So losing 25% in polls and losing the delegate count is an "upset"
How can anyone trust Bill Clinton anymore when he lies so easily?
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jenmito Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-23-08 03:32 PM
Response to Reply #27
28. It's clear he'll say anything, facts be damned...
Edited on Wed Jan-23-08 03:33 PM by jenmito
I only HOPE people wake up before voting for Hillary! This will be a nightmare if she's our nominee, with Bill right there.
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