1988 Jackson won AL, DE, DC, GA, LA, MI, MS, SC, VA, VT, PR and the caucus portion of TX and AK

the contest is far from over. Jackson, like Obama excelled in the caucus states.

"By March of 1988 Jackson and Michael Dukakis, the uptight governor of Massachusetts, were neck and neck. Jackson thought he had a good chance of winning in Wisconsin, thus showing he could win a primary in an industrial state with a big slice of white working class voters. Jackson spent much time in the state, particularly on the picket lines outside the American Motors plant, scheduled to shut down. Jackson compared the struggle in Kenosha to the struggle in Selma in the 1960s. In the polling before the Wisconsin primary Jackson had a substantial lead. His hopes were dashed. In the last hours, in the privacy of the voting booth, many of these white working class voters jumped to Dukakis. This was the moment the wind went out of the Jackson campaign.

...
So although Obama has pulled even and on some counts is ahead in delegates pledged to him thus far, these numbers are far from conclusive.
...
Hang on until the big primaries in Ohio and Texas on March 4. Here Hillary is still seen as having the advantage of organized labor in Ohio and of the Hispanic vote in Texas. By and large union members are for Hillary, as John Edwards sadly discovered. Bizarre though it may seem, given Hillary's record as a corporate lawyer, there's a class divide between her and Obama. Hillary has the support of the white working class. She has also had a commanding edge in winning the votes of white women and people over sixty. These are very formidable assets."


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This primary contest has just begun kidz!!!

They were wrong.

Let's be a bit more careful this time.

This meme is getting old.

eom

:thumbsdown:

By the time Jackson won most of those contests, he was Dukakis' only remaining opponent. The candidates with a legitimate shot at becoming president-Gephardt, Simon, Babbitt, Gore- has fallen by the wayside. They weren't heavily contested races.

I'll also point out that Obama has won primaries in Connecticut, Utah, Illinois, and Missouri, as well as high-turnout caucuses in lilly-white places like Maine, Washington, Idaho, Kansas, Nebraska, Alaska, Iowa, and Minnesota.

Your analogy is crap.

How about Gary Hart's campaign in 84 or any other competitive race that has been held in the past? I'm sure analogies could be found. Though I'm not going to do it, because the past in politics is never prelude to the future.

It's kind of clear to me that the thinking about Obama solely as a black candidate is far from over. To me, he's just a candidate. As is Hillary. Two strong capable Democrats in a tight race.

This meme is getting old. Besides that - hes already won states Jackson didnt.

Jesse was not part-time "community worker" for 2 years, he was a national activist over an entire lifetime. He was an American hero, not a charlatan.

such crap. Obama was not a part time "community worker" for two years. That's bullshit. So let's post some facts:

Obama received his B.A. degree in 1983, then worked at Business International Corporation and NYPIRG before moving to Chicago to take a job as a community organizer.<24> As Director of the Developing Communities Project, he worked with low-income residents in Chicago's Roseland community and the Altgeld Gardens public housing development.<25> He entered Harvard Law School in 1988.<26> In 1990, The New York Times reported his election as the Harvard Law Review's "first black president in its 104-year history".<27> He completed his J.D. degree magna cum laude in 1991.<28> On returning to Chicago, Obama directed a voter registration drive.<28> As an associate attorney with Miner, Barnhill & Galland from 1993 to 1996, he represented community organizers, discrimination claims, and voting rights cases.<29> He was a lecturer of constitutional law at the University of Chicago Law School from 1993 until his election to the U.S. Senate in 2004.<30>
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barack_Obama

I voted for Jesse Jackson in 1988, but he wasn't a hero to me, and Obama is a far more impressive candidate. Quite frankly, Jackson's comments about "hymietown" didn't say hero to me.

The meme of declaring people by ancestral origins then putting it as old standby that "one those just kind of slipped through when nobody was watching too close".

No folks, the best of slick and slippery are not hanging out with the oppressed camp, they are well seated in the catbird seats of the establishment.

The segregation and degradation is entrenched into US vocabulary and expected to be accepted as normal business. The alternative to it is being ignored or inventing your own (like hip-hop) The people who think others are much different because of how they look on the outside might be in for a awakening.

the schedule in 1998 was completely different. It's been frontloaded this year in a way that's unprecedented. Feb 5 was as close to a national primary as we've ever seen. 30 states have already voted and by tomorrow you can make that 32 plus DC. Furthermore, Obama has won more primaries than Clinton, and more contests than Jackson did.

It's not just beginning and it's absurd to claim that it is.

an overwhelming number of people came out for obama. You didn't see an overwhelming number of undecideds being sway to obama in the caucus states. Hillary had less voters show up! This entire argument has no foundation whatsoever.

As for states, please. Obama has already won 20 out of the 30 states that have voted in the primary thus far!

These posts are nothing more than sheer desparation. HRC supporters are trying to explain away Obama's victories anyway that they can.

isn't there a closer model to Obama's success so far, than Jackson's doomed campaign?

I'm not an Obama girl, but you must see that his appeal goes beyond states with heavy black populations.

It's clear the Clinton campaign is pushing this meme again; trying to marginalize Obama's success and pin him as the 'black' candidate. Williams discredited Obama's appeal to white voters and even said "Obama can't have it both ways", in that he can't get the black vote and not be the black candidate. Stupid.

Juan moonlights on NPR but is in tight with the Clintons and is a regular on Fox News. :puke:

I guess they'll be back to the black vote meme Wednesday morning.

productive. For one, that was 20 years ago and there is a completely different dynamic here in this election.

Narrow minded repugs might buy into this analogy, but the vast majority of voters (Dems, Independants, and even some Repugs won't). It's a different day with different rules.

History is repeating itself!



:sarcasm:

:rofl: :hide: :rofl:

why you trying to stir up another race shit Bill? huh! Why?

Is that the Maggie Williams style, the $50k Maggie Williams.

Nothing similar except that Jackson won a bunch of small states and he is also African American.
That is about it.

Jackson had NO elected office experience.
Jackson did not hold his own in most of the states he lost the way Obama has.
Jackson had a significant following but nothing like Obama.
There was never any point in the 88 campaign where there was any wide spread perception that Jackson could actually win.

From the same article above...
Gary Hart learned this the hard way in 1984. Hart had won his political spurs in a famous mutiny of the Democratic base, when Hart managed George McGovern's successful drive to the nomination in 1972. In the early states of the 1984 campaign Hart won a dramatic victory by ten points over Walter Mondale in New Hampshire. Short on money, Hart then aimed, exactly like Obama, at the caucuses to show momentum. After Super Tuesday, Mondale and Hart were neck and neck. Then Hart cleaned up in the caucuses, just as Obama is now doing. The two split the big states. Mondale won New York and Pennsylvania. Hart won Ohio and California. Then, in the weeks before the Democratic Party convention Mondale and the Democratic Party machine went into action at the various state conventions. Hart watched aghast as his hard-won delegates melted back into the smoke-filled rooms and emerged with Mondale buttons on their lapels. The coup de grace came with Mondale's efficient capture of the Super Delegates, who went to him almost en bloc.

Mondale was a former VP and had the Democratic establishment firmly behind him. He also had that "where's the beef" moment that took a lot of wind out of Hart's sails. Clinton is not capable of pulling off such a moment against Obama, imo, - not a comment on her attributes but the circumstances are too different. Obama is also way better financed than Hart was - he has enough money to hold his own in the scramble at the state conventions and for the super delegates. Most of the super delegates are only loosely committed now if at all - they are holding back to see how the wind is blowing and how their states go. No one wants to get caught with their pants down backing the wrong horse. Obama is also better financed than Hillary and rolling up wins will only enhance that. Money will play a big role in Ohio and Texas and a huge role in Pennsylvania. Obama also has an energized college youth base that could play a big role particularly in Pennsylvania in getting out his voters. He had them in California as well and they kept him competitive there for the delegate race even though Hillary easily won the popular vote. I also think we will see significant defections to Obama in Texas among Hispanic voters. There will be more time for Obama's edge in money to make a difference with Spanish media buys.

Results from the '84 primary season:

http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Agora/8088/Dem1984.html

In some cases, like Wisconsin, Hart won the primary, which was only a "beauty contest", but Mondale won the caucus which awarded the delegates. Jackson won in Mississippi and Virginia, but Mondale finished with more delegates. John Glenn was also winning delegates in the early contests, usually garnering 20% of the popular vote, but dropped out after Super Tuesday. Mondale sucked up Glenn's delegates too by the convention.

Cockburn incorrectly categorizes Mondale's near unanimous support of the 568 superdelegates as a coup de grace. In fact Mondale had almost all of them before New Hampshire. After California and New Jersey voted in June, Mondale was still 40 delegates short. He was able to secure the remaining 40 super delegates after losing California. So the superdelegates were really Mondale's ace in the hole, not a coup de grace.

Mondale was very close to getting knocked out on Super Tuesday. He won only in Georgia and Alabama. By contrast Hart won primaries in Massachusetts, Florida, Rhode Island, and caucuses in Nevada and Oklahoma. John Glenn withdrew after Super Tuesday, but he had won some delegates.

But Cockburn is correct that Mondale, who won only 20 states, was stealing delegates not only from Hart, but also from Jackson. Hart didn't complain too loudly about it because he didn't want to come accross as a sore loser. Jackson complained very loudly and some rules were changed for '88.

In short, Hart won the votes, but lost the delegates.

Now I am waiting for my shadow on DU to show up and write that Mondale "won the vote", when all the evidence is to the contrary. (He never cites any authority to back up his assertion...)

4....3.....2.....1....


:eyes:

The entire U.S. population has exactly the same sentiment regarding politics and race as it did in 1988. If not, lets try to make sure it does. Lets hammer home how big of an influence race..has always been...and should always be. It's our only chance!!

and it seems that there is a VERY good chance that his base will broaden further, especially when, after Tues, there will be that much more media attention to him.

I know some Hillary Clinton supporters won't appreciate me saying this, but a LOT of support for her can be laid at the feet of political inertia -- she is a well-known, familiar name. Voters like to vote for what they know, especially if, as here, Democrats seem to like both candidates. HRC and her campaign & supporters try to ride this issue for all it's worth (it underlies a lot of the "experience" meme -- confusing 'familiarity' with 'experience').

I would predict that in coming weeks and months, a larger share of white worker's votes and those of Latinos will start going to Obama. Hopefully, his gains will be enough to overcome the last key remaining "firewall" -- the Superdelegates' tendency to go with the POWERFUL Clinton folk over the 'new face'. This, and the same problem with unions did indeed pose difficulty for Hart, for Bradley and to some extent for Dean as against Kerry. The "smart" money tends to be status quo and to stand with the status quo.