I think that HRC is a nice woman.All I could think about when she referenced the wounded soldier

was that your politically motivated vote on the IWR helped to bring them the pain and agony they are going through right now.

I'm sorry, as nice of a person as I think she is inside, she exhibits poor judgment and a lack of foresight that is very troubling. Those could have been my colleagues as a veteran, or my own children that she could have been visiting in the new wounded warriors facility and how would I feel, if my loved one was there knowing that she could have worked to try and stop bush like many of her colleagues in congress did and could have voted NO on that resolution.

The sentiment expressed by Mrs. Clinton rings hollow for that reason.

I'm sick of listening to the same old bullshit here.

She did, too, but pretended to believe him to save herself political...Big backfire there.

My Dem. Senator, Wyden, voted against the IWR. She could have, too. She made a bad choice -- and it was a huge one. Why should we trust her judgment?

There's a reason why his poll numbers are at 19%

I just think her poor judgment on the IWR is a big reason she will not win the nomination. It's not the only reason she won't be the nominee -- but it is a huge factor.

There were many courageous members, mostly Democrats, who stood up to Bush. With principle and honor, they voted NO on IWR:

United States Senate
Daniel Akaka (D-Hawaii)
Jeff Bingaman (D-New Mexico)
Barbara Boxer (D-California)
Robert Byrd (D-West Virginia)
Lincoln Chaffee (R-Rhode Island)
Kent Conrad (D-North Dakota)
Jon Corzine (D-New Jersey)
Mark Dayton (D-Minnesota)
Dick Durbin (D-Illinois)
Russ Feingold (D-Wisconsin)
Bob Graham (D-Florida)
Daniel Inouye (D-Hawaii)
Jim Jeffords (I-Vermont)
Ted Kennedy (D-Massachusetts)
Patrick Leahy (D-Vermont)
Carl Levin (D-Michigan)
Barbara Mikulski (D-Maryland)
Patty Murray (D-Washington)
Jack Reed (D-Rhode Island)
Paul Sarbanes (D-Maryland)
Debbie Stabenow (D-Michigan)
The late Paul Wellstone (D-Minnesota)
Ron Wyden (D-Oregon)

United States House of Representatives

Neil Abercrombie (D-Hawaii)
Tom Allen (D-Maine)
Joe Baca (D-California)
Brian Baird (D-Washington DC)
John Baldacci (D-Maine, now governor of Maine)
Tammy Baldwin (D-Wisconsin)
Xavier Becerra (D-California)
Earl Blumenauer (D-Oregon)
David Bonior (D-Michigan, retired from office)
Robert Brady (D-Pennsylvania)
Corinne Brown (D-Florida)
Sherrod Brown (D-Ohio)
Lois Capps (D-California)
Michael Capuano (D-Massachusetts)
Benjamin Cardin (D-Maryland)
Julia Carson (D-Indiana)
William Clay, Jr. (D-Missouri)
Eva Clayton (D-North Carolina, retired from office)
James Clyburn (D-South Carolina)
Gary Condit (D-California, retired from office)
John Conyers, Jr. (D-Michigan)
Jerry Costello (D-Illinois)
William Coyne (D-Pennsylvania, retired from office)
Elijah Cummings (D-Maryland)
Susan Davis (D-California)
Danny Davis (D-Illinois)
Peter DeFazio (D-Oregon)
Diana DeGette (D-Colorado)
Bill Delahunt (D-Massachusetts)
Rosa DeLauro (D-Connecticut)
John Dingell (D-Michigan)
Lloyd Doggett (D-Texas)
Mike Doyle (D-Pennsylvania)
Anna Eshoo (D-California)
Lane Evans (D-Illinois)
Sam Farr (D-California)
Chaka Fattah (D-Pennsylvania)
Bob Filner (D-California)
Barney Frank (D-Massachusetts)
Charles Gonzalez (D-Texas)
Luis Gutierrez (D-Illinois)
Alice Hastings (D-Florida)
Earl Hilliard (D-Alabama, retired from office)
Maurice Hinchey (D-New York)
Ruben Hinojosa (D-Texas)
Rush Holt (D-New Jersey)
Mike Honda (D-California)
Darlene Hooley (D-Oregon)
Inslee
Jackson (Il.)
Jackson-Lee (TX)
Johnson, E.B.
Jones (OH)
Kaptur
Kildee
Kilpatrick
Kleczka
Kucinich
LaFalce
Langevin
Larsen (WA)
Larson (CT)
Lee
Levin
Lewis (GA)
Lipinski
Lofgren
Maloney (CT)
Matsui
McCarthy (MO)
McCollum
McDermott
McGovern
McKinney
Meek (FL)
Meeks (NY)
Menendez
Millender-McDonald
Miller
Mollohan
Moran (Va)
Nadler
Napolitano
Neal
Oberstar
Obey
Olver
Owens
Pallone
Pastor
Payne
Pelosi
Price (NC)
Rahall
Rangel
Reyes
Rivers
Rodriguez
Roybal-Allard
Rush
Sabo
Sanchez
Sanders
Sawyer
Schakowsky
Scott
Serrano
Slaughter
Snyder
Solis
Stark
Strickland
Stupak
Thompson (CA)
Thompson (MS)
Tierney
Towns
Udall (NM)
Udall (CO)
Velazquez
Visclosky
Waters
Watson
Watt
Woolsey
Wu

The guy who voted "present" over 100 times would have voted for the war if he had a chance since he voted exacty the same as Hillary since joining the senate, why would anyone think he would have voted different from Hillary if he was in the senate when the IWR was voted on?

get. Her vote for political purposes did assist bush in putting our troops in harms way. So did Kerry's vote. I didn't like that about him either. He did, however, admit that he was wrong and it was the worst mistake he ever made. Hillary has yet to do that.

and actively sold the war to her fellow politicos. Boo she said, WMD's, danger. She is responsible for more than a vote. She Sold This One Kids!

Bush could not have invaded without the IWR she endorsed.

George W. Bush is.

Of COURSE he did! Anyone paying even a tiny iota of attention KNEW that bastard Bush and his neocon puppetmasters were bound and determined to bomb the crap out of Iraq and take their resouces. What is infuriating is that people like Hillary gave him political cover instead of standing up and saying: "Hey, Asshole. Why are you attacking a country that didn't have ANYTHING to do with 9-11 and does not pose a threat to us?"

but it's not. Twenty-three other Senators got it right and one in particular, Robert Byrd, gave a moving, cautionary, prophetic speech warning his colleagues against ceding their Constitutional power to Bush. He warned about the administration's hubris, the lack of evidence for war, the lack of need for such a resolution, the uncanny time of the resolution (just before the 2002 midterm elections), the rush to war with all of it's consequences AND make no mistake about it the fact that voting for the resolution was voting for war!

He knew it meant war, we knew it, too, as did those who voted for it. We expected the repukes to vote with Bush but interestingly, on the Dem side, mainly those with POTUS ambitions did so. They went along to get ahead politically.

Iraq was never an imminent threat and never attacked us. To vote to give an idiot sole ability to Authorize the Use of Force Against Iraq shows abominable judgment at the very least. So you can excuse HRC all you want but IWR is part of the reason she's losing.

I was imagining the horrors she was describing and thinking "but you voted for this...".
I was out on the corner with my family banging a drum to tell people not to attack, and yet she voted for it.
How did I know what she didn't know?

magnitude. She'll say any fucking thing if she thinks it's gonna help her with the voters..and she'll say anything to try and bring Obama down.


How'd that work for ya in Wisconsin and Hawai'i, hi-la-ry?

you and i were against it but 80% of the american people had their head up their ass.

for her part in it. Maybe I'm old-fashioned, but I absolutely hate excusers and excuses. And I'm quick to forgive. But her stubborness, her triangulating, and her apparent arrogance when it comes to this issue is appalling, and it's why I finally chose not to support her. I'm SICK of that shit, and I can't understand why so many Dems decry that quality in Bush et al and ignore it or excuse it in Hillary.

it or excuse it in Hillary." So well put. Votes have consequences. Amazing how HRC and Team Hillary duck, dodge, deflect, dismiss, spin and triangulate that vote. The excusitis is precisely why I can't support her.

Where have I heard that before? :puke:

:sarcasm:

he might have voted the same as Clinton IF he'd actually been in the senate. This juvenile practice of blaming Hillary for every evil under the sun sounds more like Bush than it sounds like a smart Democratic position.

that was just the Clintons bashing Obama for supporting the party nominee - something they could never do, because everything is all about them.

She shouldn't have voted for the war. Further, when you say that obama said he doesn't know how he would have voted during the speech for Kerry in 2004, it was because Kerry has the "war problem" with his vote, even though he did acknowledge the mistake. Further, you take Obama's words out of context...he went on after saying that he "doesn't know how he would have voted"..he said he didn't think the case for war had been made.


Additionally, he was running for Senate himself when he made his comments in 2002 and "going to war" was popular then. It could have cost him dearly!

Hillary was certain that she would be the nominee of the democratic party at some point when she chose to vote as she did and for that reason, she decided it was better not to give the republicans something to use against her in the general election, than prevent kids from being sent off to an unnecessary war.

She voted for Kyl/Lieberman and didn't show up to vote for Telecom immunity for the same reason.

And do I think that Barack should have shown up to vote NO on Kyl/lieberman? yes. Short notice aside. However, Hillary made a point of flying back to vote YES on Kyl/lieberman. Again, political motivation instead of solid judgment on a resolution that has the potential of giving bush the loop hole he needs go start going after Iran from inside Iraq as the amendment condones.