Nader argues that Howard Dean -- the former Democratic presidential contender -- was a factor in the low turnout for the Nader mini-convention in April. Just hours before that event, Dean urged Oregon voters to ignore Nader and support Democrat John Kerry. The 70-year-old Nader said he hopes Dean won't try to interfere with his June 26 gathering.

"I thought what Howard Dean did was unnecessary extracurricular activity," Nader told The Associated Press in a telephone interview.

"We hope he will not be casting negative aspersions on our effort to be on Oregon's ballot."

In an interview with The AP, Dean said he's not planning to weigh in again on Nader's upcoming Oregon event. But he said his message to Nader's supporters in Oregon hasn't changed: "You better vote for John Kerry, because otherwise we end up with four more years of George Bush," said the former Vermont governor, who has a strong following in Oregon. "This is not the year for a third party."

http://www.tdn.com/articles/2004/06/20/oregon/news02.txt
-----------------------------------------------------------

Awww, wah-wah poor little baby. Does anyone else not feel sorry for Nader.

And Dean is right on in his statements, as usual.

LOL... Our boy Ralph!

Dean was "far too conservative" for most of the Nader folks I have run into. Some of them liked Kucinich a bit. Apparently some will at least listen to Howard Dean.

I had heard that the Oregon turn out was 1/10 of what it was in 2000. Go Howard Go!

election ...he might have credibility....but he does nothing notable to my eyes in between.....so why anyone would think he can help is beyond me......Jimmy Carter has done more out of office than nadar

with us far-left folks. He dethroned Nader as the hopeful, truthful voice of the left, and King Nader is not pleased.

win the 2000 election by saying there is no difference or not too much difference between bush and gore ?

Ralph is a wealthy fraud and hypocrite. He's more like Bush then his supporters are willing to admit.

There's the only guy responsible for your problems.

Nader has enough Republican support as it is.

needs to DROP DEAD!!!

Dean revitalized the party and you Ralphie Boy wanted to destroy it!

that's but one more reason to looove Dean :loveya:

That mean Dean guy is getting in the way of his plan to "punish", "hurt", "wound" the Democrats once again.

Stick it, Ralphie!

Nader's closest adviser (and nephew), Tarek Milleron, when asked why Nader was contending even in battleground states: "Because we want to punish the Democrats, we want to hurt them, wound them." - http://www.villagevoice.com/issues/0418/levine.php

...so the Democrats blame Nader, but Nader blames Dean, and Dean blames Bush.

I don't know, I think I'm gonna go with blaming Bush.

ever think YOU'RE the reason Gore got fewer voted in Florida than he should've?


moron

He hasn't stopped since the primaries started, and we're so lucky to have him around.

is a has been dirtbag. Thats why he's not on the ballot. He should shut up ang go away. He's an embarrassment to America, and a major reason Shrub* is president. People are not going to forget that, and they're not going to be fooled into wasting their votes again.
P.S. Ralph drop fucking dead!

just go the hell away!!!


Well-played Dr. Dean, well-played.

Ain't it?

but there is nothing wrong with Nader telling people that Kerry and Bush are the same? Go away Ralph!

voters in 2000 that there is no difference between democrats and republicans, * wouldn't have enjoyed being installed as president. This is karma blowback for what he did.

I love that Howard Dean!

Them's the breaks, Ralph. Live by the sword, die by the sword...

:shrug:

"Kafoury noted that Kerry had tried to court Republican Sen. John McCain of Arizona as a possible running mate.

"That should be a wake-up call to people who think John Kerry will pull the plug on this war if he gets elected," Kafoury said. "There's no stronger supporter of this war than John McCain."

Nader, who suggests Kerry pick Edwards or Gep (both of whom supported the war) is pissed for Kerry supposedly courting McCain? :eyes:

I don't know that it was really his fault. Maybe a lot of people just aren't really all that interested in Nader. Maybe the Republicans can lead you to the pitcher but can't make you drink the Kool-aid. But anything that Howard did to help is much appreciated.

(edited for Freudian typo)

And it's good to see people realizing that you ought not to sing Kumbaya by the fire when the fire is your house burning.

:hi:

I love it.

This is just so great.

Dean is awesome. He's done exactly what he said he would do -- support the nominee completely!

And he's pissing Nader off....This just makes me like Dean all the more! And I didn't even support him in the primaries.

I don't know where he will end up, but Kerry owes him, big time; and, he also owes Clark. I am really amazed at the talent this election has brought forth. I know they are all capable of great things.

They can shore up his left flank.

What a slug Nader is

People not turning out because of that...well that's pretty embarassing I guess.

END THE PROGRESSIVE MOVEMENT THROUGH HUMILIATION!!!! LAUGH AT CANDIDATES, AVOID THE ISSUES!!!!

There is something seriously twisted about all of you who act like Nader is the Anti-Christ.

DESTROY MORE SANE POLICIES THROUGH LOSING THE ELECTION!!!! VOTE FOR SOMEONE WHO WON'T WIN, AVOID REALITY!!!!

There is something seriously twisted about trying to change things by keeping someone in office who's responsible for them.

Which should have happened in 2000, I should sell my soul by voting for a candidate that has promised 20,000 more american troops in Iraq, minimum! Yeah, right.

Which would I rather have: Bush - will screw you and tell you that he's screwing you.

-or-

Kerry - will screw you gently and pretend it isn't happening at all.

Frankly there is a third option. And a forth.....

This is not an attack, this is a serious question. What have you done to change things? Have you help build a third party (more then just voting for a candidate)? Have you gone to any democratic meetings to push your views on the issues?

Again, I really want to know what you have done. I am all for more choice, but it seems that a lot of people only act on this at the voting booth. To me, that is the least anyone can do.

Thank you.

Moreover the Democratic party in the state of Indiana is laughable (except of course in Bloomington). Have I been to meetings, yes. Do I plan on running for office when I get out of college, yes.

When I have a forum in which my view can be heard, I make them known - hence my being a part of DU. Through what forum do you suggest that I tell John Kerry that he is a watered down version of a republican and that he has missed the progressive vote entirely?? If I tried that at any such meetings in Indiana or even here in the DU Many people become critical because I might mention the word "Nader." But the truth is that many of those who jeer know very little about the man or what he stands for. Or they get hot and bothered because they believe the democratic party is still liberal. it isn't, and reform from with in has not worked since I was born!

I asked what forum I have for telling the above metioned things to John Kerry, there is only one. The ballot box in November. Mine will read: Dave Matthews or Ralph Nader (unless someone more promising comes along).

The point is the message. Do I believe that matthews would be elected?? Of course not.

...that you don't know how to follow instructions.

There is no set of rules for voting, if that is what you are talking about...... (there is a set of qualifications for being president, I know....)

and if you break them, your vote is not counted.

Why do you let other people's criticism stop you from voicing your opinions? If you want to change the Democratic Party, you're going to have to fight to do it.

If you won't stand up for yourself, no one else is going to.

by not voting for a candidate I don't believe in at all. All I am saying is, my ideas are often not taken seriously because of a stigmatism against the word "Nader" or against radical change.

We have a secret ballot in the US. No one gets to see who you vote for. If you want to fight for your beliefs, you're going to have to do it in public, and you're going to have to face opposition.

All I am saying is, my ideas are often not taken seriously because of a stigmatism against the word "Nader" or against radical change.

If you want to have an effect, then you're going to HAVE TO confront that. If you want to help affect change, then it's YOUR responsibility to find a way to be taken seriously. And here's a hint: It would help if you take their concerns seriously instead of dismissing them as a "stigma"

I've gotten my neighbors, including some in the 80's and 90's, to stop talking about what a "great team" Bush* has, and replaced it with talk about "war for oil" and how Bush* is a Nazi. It didn't happen because of the way I vote. It happened because I'm willing to put my beliefs out there.

So many of the people who talk about changing the Democrats have never even worked with the Democratic party...

Gore won, and the ballot recount would not have been an issue if Nader wasn't going around lying about this idea that there's no difference between the parties.

Anyways, you bring up one thing and splinter over that - that's why this "progressive" vote (in quotes because they aren't making any progress - I don't mean to knock other people who call themselves progressive that aren't voting for Nader) is called the "high-maintanence" vote by me and never gets pursued. You have to do everything "perfectly" (except lying or union-busting or referring to abortion as "gonadal politics", of course) or you're exactly the same as the other candidates.

would not have been an issue if Gore were capable of winning his and Clinton's home state, or if Jeb Bush hadn't tampered.

But did you here a uproar from Gore or the DNC? Nope. Where were the protests or media coverage. No where. The Democrats really took that one laying down.

Where's the echoing call for an end to the electoral college??? Where's the campaign to investigate Jeb and Harris?? Why doesn't the DNC do something? Because they aren't interested in progress.

Which brings me to your other point. You seriously believe that because Kerry has a chance of getting elected his "progress" is the only progress that matters?? That's just another version of "you're either with us or against us."

Moreover don't doubt that a small, motivated group of people can change the world, indeed they are all that ever has.

Nothing you bring up has anything to do with anything practical.

Yes, John Kerry's progress is the only progress that matters. Only he or Bush* will win.

What's your plan?

1. What do you want and...
2. ...how will you get it.

What I want: www.greenparty.org/platform.html

How I will get it: Wake up the democratic party by letting them know they cannot obtain my vote without taking the issues I believe in seriously.

...you're kidding me. Gore still won the election. You're pretending like it was clear he was gonna lose by some big-enough margin to justify voting for Nader.

of the democratic party in 2000 (and now).

During the debates I watched gore and bush agree on the basics of 37 of the 40 topics. Would it have mattered if gore won if bush and gore agree on 37 out of 40 issues? And when they did disagree it was on "timing"... (and now I have to watch Kerry promise 20,000 new troops to a war based on lies?!?!?)

Of course it would have mattered, I am exagerating, but you are kidding yourself if you believe that Al Gore (or John Kerry) are either progressive or liberal (the supposed core of the democratic party).

:crazy:

Dean!!! My day just keeps getting better. First Rowland resigns then I hear how Dean is flexing his political muscle and sticking up for Kerry and knocking Nader down!

I do not see what Nader is complaining about.

And, is using his political influence to keep him off the ballots. However, he bitchs at all democrats that call him a spoiler for putting Bush in office. lol

By the way, welcome to DU.
:party:

YEEAAAAAAAARGH!

:bounce::bounce::bounce::bounce:

Just get over it, Ralph!

I think St. Ralph is self-destructing...

about "unnecessary extracurricular activity" and "casting negative aspersions"
:nuke: :wow: :nuke: !
Thank you very, very, much Dr. Dean for aiding the eradication of this illness.

Ralphie now has to go blame Howard Dean for telling Democrats not to sign his petitions.

Snarf

Like running as a third-party vote splitter isn't?

Leave now while there are still a couple of minute shreds of your legacy left intact.

You are in serious jeopardy of undoing all the good efforts you've made throughout your entire life.

Just pack it in, for everyone's sake. Has the concept of "greater good" been lost upon you altogether?