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kentuck Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-04-08 10:37 PM
Original message
The body language and tone of the two candidates tonight ...
There was something "different" about Hillary and Obama tonight. Hillary changed the tone of her entire speech tonight. She was more low-key, not loud, and seemed to be more conciliatory in the tone of her remarks. She let it be known that the Democratic Party would be together. Her speech was very effective, in my opinion.

Obama gave his standard stump speech with a few new lines thrown in but he looked like he just had the keys to the free world thrown in his lap. I wondered if he and Hillary might have had a little talk before their speeches tonight?

I think Hillary has finally come to the realization that if she loses both IN and NC on Tuesday, especially if she loses NC by a wide margin, that it is over. She will not have a chance to catch Obama in the popular vote nor the delegate count. I think she and Obama have come to an "understanding".
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John Q. Citizen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-04-08 10:40 PM
Response to Original message
1. That would be nice, but iI wouldn't bet on it. Hill is always different in front of
Democrats in general compared to her supporters at her events.
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Stephanie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-04-08 10:42 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. Democrats might ask her to take a stand on the issues
I can see how that might throw her into a quandry.
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DJ13 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-04-08 10:41 PM
Response to Original message
2. Hillary is back to using her quiet "I need you" speaking mannerism from NH
I saw her speaking that way earlier today from Indiana.

All she's missing are a few tears.

It screams insincerity after the dirty campaign she's run the last 2 months.

(Worked in NH because she was still trying to run a positive campaign back then.)
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kentuck Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-04-08 10:44 PM
Response to Reply #2
4. Maybe?
But it just seemed like there was something different about both of the candidates tonight?
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goclark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-04-08 10:55 PM
Response to Reply #2
10. The 29 faces of HC
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NanceGreggs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-04-08 10:48 PM
Response to Original message
5. I know what you mean ...
Saw a clip of her "will work my heart out for Obama if he's the nominee" statement the other night, watched her body language and her facial expressions. Said to my husband, "She has finally accepted that she's lost."

Rumour has it the SDs have made their votes known to both campaigns; this could be the result of exactly that having taken place.
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kentuck Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-04-08 10:50 PM
Response to Reply #5
7. Something is going on...
I sense.
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Shine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-04-08 10:58 PM
Response to Reply #7
17. Hmmm....I hope you're right, kentuck
:hi:
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BklynChick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-05-08 06:33 AM
Response to Reply #17
46. i'm suspicious, she usually has that tone right before she's about to pounce. don't trust her.
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NanceGreggs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-04-08 11:07 PM
Response to Reply #7
20. Me, too.
A few posters here commented on this today - mentioned that "In it to win!" has been dropped from the repertoire, along with a few other phrases that have been mainstays in her stump speeches.

I think it's finally over - and if she does campaign for Obama, it will go a long way in not only healing the present divide, but undoing some of the incredible damage she's done to her own career.

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kentuck Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-04-08 11:10 PM
Response to Reply #20
25. She finally sees the "possibility" of losing.
If she loses Indiana in a squeaker and North Carolina in a blowout, she knows that is the end of the road. She has been one helluva fighter!
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Beausoir Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-04-08 11:13 PM
Response to Reply #20
29. "the incredible damage she's done to her own career" Yes, how DARE she damage her career by running
for President?!?!

How dare she "damage her career" by beating the pants off a man in every large state?

You, Nance, have a VERY strange view of women and careers. Truly Donna Reed time. Back to the 50's with you.
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NanceGreggs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-04-08 11:26 PM
Response to Reply #29
37. The damage was not in the running ...
... the damage was in using kitchen sink politics, lying about sniper-fire, telling voters that McCain was a better bet for the presidency than a fellow Democrat, dismissing Obama's career as "a single speech he made in 2002" - the list goes on.

I came into this primary process as a long-time admirer of Hillary's, and although I supported Obama from the start, I was confident she was going to go all the way. And I certainly didn't lose any sleep over that probability.

The damage that's been done she has done to herself. This was hers to lose, and she lost it - and it wasn't sexism, or the big bad media, or any other external force you might want to blame. It was her own statements that did her in.

And the fact that you immediately jumped to the conclusion that this was about her being female says more about you than it does me.
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merh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-04-08 11:32 PM
Response to Reply #29
38. She has hurt her political career by being negative and divisive
Edited on Sun May-04-08 11:33 PM by merh
by breaking the rules and by politicing without care for the party and the wins needed in November. It's not just about the presidency, it is about dems winning the presidency and maintaining control in congress so that the needed improvements in our government for our nation can be had.

IMHO, it has been women like hillary that have been the stumbling blocks for women in the professional world, their demeanor and their nasty back stabbing ways have made it harder for other woman who come up the ladder to be seen as equals. Yes, you can be a professional without being vicious and negative. If you would like a list of women who have done that I'll be happy to compile it for you.



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Beausoir Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-04-08 11:08 PM
Response to Reply #5
23. Wow! You can mind read now, too? You actually believe that Clinton has "accepted that she's lost"?
Your talents are amazing!

You are going to be a fun one to watch on Tuesday night.

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kentuck Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-04-08 11:13 PM
Response to Reply #23
30. You must admit...
the possibility is there that she might lose both IN and NC? If that happens, she is no dummy.
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NanceGreggs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-04-08 11:38 PM
Response to Reply #23
39. You know, everytime I post in a thread where you get involved ...
... I have this horrible feeling that I'm at a wedding, and have been mistakenly seated at the kiddie table. If you want to be part of the adult conversation, could you fake acting like one - it would be a refreshing change.
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Tesha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-05-08 06:49 AM
Response to Reply #23
48. You understand that this sort of argumentation wins neither the argument nor friends, right? (NT)
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-04-08 10:50 PM
Response to Original message
6. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
JVS Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-04-08 10:51 PM
Response to Reply #6
8. yeah, that's definitely something to watch out for.
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BeyondGeography Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-04-08 10:57 PM
Response to Reply #6
13. Shame on you, ignac70
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ingac70 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-04-08 10:58 PM
Response to Reply #13
15. lol...
that's the kinda stuff I'm talkin' about.
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BeyondGeography Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-04-08 11:07 PM
Response to Reply #15
22. That came two days after "I am honored, absolutely honored
to be here with Barack Obama."
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ingac70 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-04-08 11:12 PM
Response to Reply #22
26. I remember all to well...
that's when I realized that Hillary Clinton was only still in the race to be a stalking horse for John McCain.
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OzarkDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-05-08 07:31 AM
Response to Reply #13
50. Health care reform is too important
to allow another candidate to spin and distort the debate. Glad she called Obama out on his dishonesty.
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Cha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-04-08 11:12 PM
Response to Reply #6
27. Yeah, I'm not buyin' for a New York
second..prove me wrong, hilary. You don't get months and months of her traitorous crap and think she's concilitory from one JJ speech.
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emilyg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-04-08 11:14 PM
Response to Reply #6
31. Now isn't that nice. A woman calling
another woman a "B".
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Raejeanowl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-04-08 10:53 PM
Response to Original message
9. I Think If They Can Come To A Private Accord, Great
Whatever happens, one is going to need the other in some capacity for the GE and beyond. The party needs all of its talent to pull together at some point.
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ecstatic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-04-08 10:55 PM
Response to Original message
11. I didn't see it, but if HRC seemed subdued... maybe it's due to embarrassment
I don't believe Hillary was always this way... and the Gas Tax idea and "f*ck the economists" spiel just seems to represent rock bottom for her, IMO.
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TragedyandHope Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-04-08 10:57 PM
Response to Original message
12. The final curtain
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TexasLady Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-04-08 10:58 PM
Response to Original message
14. Im thinking you nailed it.
You expressed my thoughts exactly, whether the real case or not...

I was really proud of both of them tonight. In fact, I have seen them both in a better light this week, with speeches and rallies, than I have in a while.

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Beausoir Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-04-08 10:58 PM
Response to Original message
16. Yes..I'm just sure that Obama talked her into quitting so he could have his delayed coronation.
Pass the bong.
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kentuck Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-04-08 11:01 PM
Response to Reply #16
18. I'm not sure it was Obama that talked her into it...
I think it may be the voters. Did you not see a different tone in her speech tonight??
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Beausoir Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-04-08 11:06 PM
Response to Reply #18
19. Snarf! She is focused on specific ideas as opposed to Hope! Change! and free unicorns for everyone!
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kentuck Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-04-08 11:07 PM
Response to Reply #19
21. It's good that someone has a grasp on reality.
Thanks.
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TheDudeAbides Donating Member (240 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-04-08 11:10 PM
Response to Original message
24. I dunno...Hillary lost her voice earlier today; could explain the low-key tone n/t
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emilyg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-04-08 11:16 PM
Response to Reply #24
32. They both must be very tired, too.
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RaleighNCDUer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-04-08 11:23 PM
Response to Reply #24
34. That's mighty careless of her -
she only found it in NH - after 35 years in politics.

To lose it again, so soon...
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faithfulcitizen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-04-08 11:12 PM
Response to Original message
28. I hope you're right, but I am very cynical about Hillary Clinton.
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kentuck Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-04-08 11:19 PM
Response to Reply #28
33. We must realize that the circumstances change with each primary...
The mountain gets much steeper. Hillary is a realist. Bill is the dreamer.
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TeamJordan23 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-04-08 11:24 PM
Response to Original message
35. Both looked a bit tired. I justcannot believe they have been campaigning for a year and half now. nm
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TeamJordan23 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-04-08 11:25 PM
Response to Original message
36. She may be realizing that Wright did not have a devastating impact. nm
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Wash. state Desk Jet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-04-08 11:40 PM
Response to Reply #36
40. well,don't pop those corks!
The Obama cult is still steadily fizzling out! It lost it's funk! I mean common now Tom Hanks! It's time for Obama to pack it in!Too much of Wright's sniper fire no doubt.
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Cha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-04-08 11:52 PM
Response to Reply #40
42. You've already popped yours.
WE'll be fine.
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Roxy66 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-04-08 11:49 PM
Response to Original message
41. I noticed it too. Her tone was definitely different.
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goclark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-05-08 12:01 AM
Response to Reply #41
43. Were her lips moving !if so, don't trust her nt
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livingmadness Donating Member (347 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-05-08 12:05 AM
Response to Original message
44. Haven't had a chance to catch the speeches yet
but from the snippets on AP-News, they're focusing on her 'we will come together ...' excerpt and definitely there is a change of tone. Resignation perhaps. Someone's had a chat with her. The recent Wright furore was the last hoorah I'm picking, and since Obama's numbers appear to be on the bounce back, I'd say its nearly all over bar the shouting. All that notwithstanding, Tuesday is of course critical - best of luck to the Clinton supporters, I'm sure we'll all be feeling nervous between now and then.
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Muttocracy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-05-08 12:50 AM
Response to Original message
45. it could be that the only way she'll get superdel. support is by acting nice. nt
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my3boyz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-05-08 06:33 AM
Response to Original message
47. Maybe Howard pulled her aside prior to the speech and told
her "It's OVER Hill! Go out gracefully!" Perhaps that is why they changed the speech order! LOL LOL LOL LOL I'm JUST JOKING!!!!!!!!!!!!!! No, Hillary is doing one of her acting jobs! She's trying out "nice" Hillary since her negatives went down (down for her...lol)in the latest CBS poll. It is all strategy! As the person above said, "If her mouth is moving, don't believe a word she says."
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AlinPA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-05-08 07:26 AM
Response to Original message
49. I missed it, but she has been saying that she is in it until the end, which means to me
the end of the convention.
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