This may come as a shock to some people, but black people haven't been always treated well

by this country or by white people. I know, shocking. So if certain people are sometimes critical of America and whites thats probably why. Now that doesn't justify blanket hatred of America or all whites but I don't think that's what's going on here.

How would you feel about someone who continually treated you like crap? I mean really...

calm down, you are reading something I didn't say...

calm down, I agree with you, and I never said there were such people. Hence "but I don't think that's what's going on here."

They've managed to convince even some Obama supporters that Wright is a loony who hates whitey and America. And even if they aren't convinced, they inadvertently help spread the lie.

Not all sexists are male. Not all orientation-superiority types are straight.

Things exist in an analog way, and those who won't admit their own bigotries and assumptions are either woefully deluded or outright deceptive.

Sometimes people don't even know their own prejudices, but it's worse when they allow themselves to have them because they're either downtrodden and deserving of being a bit bent out of shape or they fancy themselves of some superior culture trying to beat the barbarians back out the gate.

When people talk in superlatives, it gets a bit silly.

After all, Louis Farrakhan supports Obama for nothing but his policies; he'd be just as fervent in support for the guy if he was a Korean Jew. Those of us not as pristine in our souls just have a hard time understanding this magnanimity, so go easy on us for our tainted primitiveness.

If your header line had the word "black" substituted for "white", it'd be alerted far and wide and it would have deserved it.

you can't deny that Wright has been saying critical things about America, as everyone does at times. Parents are critical of their children at times despite loving them more than anything. I never said he hated whites or America however.

just meant that they used Wright as a campaign issue and now everyone has no choice but to take a side on an issue that means nothing. What Wright said has no bearing on the political landscape. The only reason it's still in the news is they have very little to attack Obama with.

One guy we recently voted to kick off of a leadership team because of his anti-white racism. He was attacking US, and we tried to tell him we were his choir.

as well. It may be easy for whites to avoid blacks, but the reverse is damn near impossible.

I get your point.

:sarcasm:

Just trying to predict some of the reactions from the usual suspects.

probably.

a segregation platform and voted against civil rights bills. That changed when he became majority leader, and at that time, the country was going in a different, better direction.

an equivalent to "I gave at the office" concerning civil rights

instead of saying racism is "so last century" as I read on another thread this morning.

What a piece of work this country is.

And Pennsylvania exit polls show they are still out there - even in the dem party.

I am critical of America and I'm a white person. I can't imagine how black americans must feel sometimes. Just think about slavery and how you would feel if they were your ancestors. I'd be pretty damned pissed. I think it really speaks to Obama's character that he is so inclusive and big-hearted.

.... I sweartagod sometimes it feels like I'm nearly white person who thinks black folks are actual people just like me, differing only circumstantially and historically.

Those differences can be interesting in some contexts, but in a conversation about feeling-triggers, not in the least. Being treated like shit pisses ALL people off. There's no need to "wonder" how black folks feel about it.

Or are you talking about black people in general?

which I HOPE no one will argue with me on. Don't you think that history influences Rev. Wright?

there's that story about the teenager who walked to the hospital with her her newborn still attached to her, planeta, etc. and how do some respond on the forum boards (ABC, et al)...oh groan, another baby for the taxpayers to take care of. These same people who would condemn her to hell if she had had an abortion, or even dumbed the baby. Calling her an illegial immagrant right off the bat, and why do "those people" have to have so many babies.

I mean really....!!

I sure know what you mean...guess these people never heard of Jim Crow.

This story is in the Houston Chronicle. And I know if I head over there to read the comments, that is what most of them will be saying about the girl because she is hispanic.

just had to bring up the bleeding Alamo. The Alamo!!! As in, we won it, it's ours. Just think, the birth of a baby someone just has to bring up the Alamo.

And I think the vast majority of Americans understand that. This is why I think Wrightgate, Michellegate, Flagpingate, Ayersgate, etc. are huge problems for Obama in the general election.

Most voters can understand why a black person might be especially critical of America, therefore, a black candidate FOR PRESIDENT has to work extra hard to convince them that, despite the history of his race, he is nevertheless patriotic and pro-American.

Obama is a biracial person who seems to have set down his roots in a militantly "separatist" (to use Michelle's term) black millieu. This makes him unelectable. A black man has every right to be angry. The electorate also has every right to reject such a black man who seeks to become the nation's President.

Considering all the blood shed and the fact that blacks served their country in Europe during WWII and came home to Jim Crow.

to whom?

What you may (or may not) understand is that the category of "white people" that currently exists is a social construct that did not come into being unto well after the turn of the 20th century. So, ironically enough, by saying "white people" as a group have done this or that, or deserve some other group's resentment, you are really doing a favor to those who have actually profited (and in some case, continue to profit,) from structural racism by deflecting attention to "white people" as an undifferentiated mass--people whose ancestors in many cases were not even consider "white" during the worst excesses of slavery and Jim Crow. Needless to say, racism (especially structural racism) is very real and this sort of dialogue is messy, complicated, and entirely unproductive.

A better approach than assigning guilt (or excusing bad behavior against a group) based on skin color would be to address structural racism in this country (e.g. as embodied in the for-profit prison industry) head on.

Yet we don't see Dem men getting all upset about their plight.

when they compete with each other or allow themselves to be pitted against each other.

they just don't run into them that often.

as a black man in my 20s, I didn't know that Jesse Jackson had won the South Carolina primary twice in the 1980s. That is, until Slick Willie was happy to educate me on that little fact. Thanks Bill! Something that should be a proud moment in black history will always have this Bill Clinton footnote by it. He also never apologized, but had Hillary apologize to a black newspaper organization for him. That's like a teenage boy vandalizing a car and then his mom later comes by to say sorry instead of the boy. Minority groups don't want to be treated superior to other people, just somewhat equally and always with respect. Apparently that was too much to ask for from the Clinton camp this election season.

got over it and moved on with my life. I don't blame my present on my past.