I can't believe we're being insulted for 'overreacting' to this.

Not here... on other forums. Where it's 'safe' to talk shit about people without worrying about them talking back.

*sigh*


edit to add: And yeah some are overreacting... but pretending it's nothing... that's not right either.

*SIGH*

Fuck it.

until we see a cross burning on our lawn or someone has called us something less than a child of God because we are black.

I am pissed.

It's a RACIAL issue now? Can a Hillary supporter SNEEZE without being called a racist?

its not so easy to view people on a message board...has nothing to do with race sorry...;-)

And... failed.

Oh well.

:hug:

:)

Sorry... but I just can't tell anymore.

:hug:

agreeing that Clinton's comment was way over the top there has to be something to it.

How many were just STUPID?

New York Senators.

Presidential Candidates.

Campaigns that continue on until June.

But...but...

A WOMAN can't compare herself.....to a MAN!!!!!!!

:eyes:

The sexism ASTOUNDS me. And it's not just MEN displaying it, either. That's what's saddest of all.

She compared her campaign to someone else's-- in her same job from her same state, also running for the presidency.

Her point was that his campaign went ON, and would have gone on longer had he not been killed.

But you guys make it all about OBAMA.

Your heads SHOULD explode, because there's apparently nothing but gas up in there.

Where's the sexism? Point it out for a gas head, please.

And since RFK was killed....that MUST mean that HRC wants BO waxed.

She was comparing HER campaign to RFK's. She wasn't even TALKING about BO.

Team O doesn't think a WOMAN is "allowed" to compare her campaign to RFK's. Because she's a GIRL, see? GIRLS can't BEEEE Kennedys!! At least not the "Presidential" ones!!!!!

The only KENNEDY type allowed in this race is the GUY (can't say BOY to go with that GIRL above--because the faux outrage crowd would be on me).

McCain is NOT "campaigning on." He's WRAPPED UP the nom. Why would he say that? He isn't campaigning for his party nom, he's not a Democrat, and he's not from New York.

If he could find himself a GOLDWATER reference, that might work--because see, they're both from AZ. And they're both Senators. And they're both REPUBLICANS.

RFK was still battling McCarthy--FOR THE NOMINATION-- when he was killed. Clinton is still battling Obama. And here comes JUNE.

:eyes:

Let us say Edwards said it. Hillary is out, Edwards is in her place.

Could we condemn Edwards(or any man) for the statement?

CHALLENGING him for what he said. IF he were ALSO THE Senator from NEW YORK. See--he isn't, so the reference isn't quite as spot-on with JE making the remarks. If he WERE, though, everyone would say "Ah, yes, here he is, going ON TO CHICAGO, only it's Denver this time, and he's going to get ready for a floor fight...gosh, what similarities, both Senators, both from NY, both challenging the 'presumptive' nominee....WOW. That IS similar!!! Because, ya know, it's coming up on JUNE, and it was JUNE when RFK won California and was getting ready to go ON TO CHICAGO..."

They certainly would make the OBVIOUS assumption, like anyone who isn't prejudiced against a woman comparing her campaign to a man's that went down the EXACT same way, damn near, that EDWARDS was comparing HIMSELF to RFK. Not threatening harm against anyone else.

Of course, such comparisons are impossible to comprehend by those who feel women cannot be compared to JFK OR RFK, and who assume that the only Kennedy comparison allowed in the campaign is to OBAMA.

The remark had NOTHING TO DO with Obama. Only stupid people -- so much for those college educations -- who actually think she was talking about OBAMA=RFK when she was actually comparing HERSELF to Bobby, think that.

And I'm not the only one who says this. RFK's NAMEWSAKE SON said it, and said the Obama fans who were freaking out about this were WRONG.

RFK Jr. has said that Team Obama is wrong to be offended, that they MISCONSTRUED. As they did.

Of course, that ruins the foot stomping pout-rage. Next they'll start trashing RFK Jr....because he has "no right" to speak for his family.

any day of the week and twice on Sunday... BUT

This is not about her being compared to... but her comments that were very insulting.

Perhaps, when the heat of the campaign wears off, and you have time to finally GET IT, you just might

And I am a woman... but... nobody misconstrued what she said, she SAID IT... just like ... her comments about Tuzla

And it reaches a point that those gaffes are more than just mispeaking

was Anointed Obama. She was comparing HERSELF and her campaign to RFK. Obama wasn't even part of the discussion.

They ASS-umed. And sexism played a role in that. If you talk about one man, why, you MUST be comparing him to another MAN.

FWIW, women can be sexists. The ones who call Clinton names like bitch and Shrillary most assuredly are. They probably have self-esteem issues, too.

RFK Junior says you are WRONG.

So don't listen to him.

I don't really care.

as I said, someday, well after this campaign is over, you might get it

Not one second before

By the way Obama is not a saint, and neither is Hillary... hell's bells the way things are in this country Jesus Christ would not make
it beyond the early days since he's a damn lefty....

but HOPEFULLY you will get it... soon.

Or not so soon. I really don't care

but you are also assuming that everything is hate of women and sexist... when in reality not ALL is that way.

because people will automatically assume that any reference she makes to a man has to be CODE for her opponent.

When this campaign is over, odds are good we'll all "get" President McCain.

And none of us will "get" happy over it.

Sexism isn't necessarily HATE--it's a sense that women are not as deserving of men, not as equal as men, and shouldn't go outside their accepted glass ceiling parameters. It's an ugly thing, just like racism.

Hate requires energy. Sexism is an attitude, and it is LEARNED. And some people don't even want to admit they've absorbed the lesson well.

I missed that post.

If you talk about RFK in a comparative manner, why, your allusion HAS to be to a MAN!!! And the "Kennedy" man is...OBAMA!

No one from Team O saw that HRC was comparing HERSELF to RFK. They assumed that you can only compare a MAN to RFK, and thus, since RFK was killed, ergo, she wanted him HARMED!!!!! Oh, the POUTRAGE!

No one who didn't like Clinton saw that the comparison was HRC-RFK, except those with at least half a brain working. And they were RARE. It was way too easy to talk about "blood on her hands" and "If anything happens, it's HER fault!"

Even if you are a Senator, like RFK, from NY, like RFK, running an insurgency campaign, like RFK, against a presumptive nominee, like RFK, that would have ended in a floor fight, like RFK, had he not been killed. .... you still can't, apparently, compare yourself to RFK, if you're a "girl."


The only Kennedy comparisons "allowed" in this campaign involve Kennedys and Obamas. No Clintons need apply, they're the great unwashed in this Team Obama fantasy.

Why is this all about sexism for you? I don't get it.

You seem to have dismissed any rational interpretation and become rabidly man-hating about the incident. It's strangely delusional and borderline hilarious.

say "How DARE Hillary say that--she wants Obama HARMED!"

When she was comparing RFK to HERSELF. Which would mean, if she wanted ANYONE harmed, it would be HERSELF.

You don't even know who the fuck I am. Your "man hating" remark was uh, pretty er, STUPID. And a bit of a sexist assumption, too, frankly. It would be a serious challenge for me to be one of those. More difficult than apparently you realize. You don't know a thing about me, I see. I'm not inclined to tell you anything either, because I don't really like you very much. I find your commentary meanspirited and immature, actually. And boring, which is the worst sin.

If you think that pointing out SEXISM is only the province of "man hating" women then you really DO have a problem with this issue. Odds are you don't even realize it. Men actually can, and DO, point out sexism. And WOMEN can be sexists, too.

When people, like people did here, fail to see what Clinton was doing, and ASS-ume that she was comparing OBAMA to RFK, instead of comparing HERSELF to RFK, that's because of an ugly thing called SEXISM, which can infect BOTH genders--really.

YES, both MEN and WOMEN can be sexist.

FWIW, Use of the word RABID and the gratuitous tosser "rational interpretation" don't cut it. My remarks were not rabid, and my interpretation was quite rational. It's your cheesy snarky efforts at retort that are irrational. It also wasn't strangely delusional, nor borderline hilarious.

It's a dead serious issue, sexism. It's why women make, on average, about a quarter less than men for doing the same work. It's why women aren't promoted when they are more deserving. It's why there are sexual harrassment laws on the books now. Funny, you seem afraid to confront your own inner sexist, you make light of the topic when it actually is a VERY serious one that impacts productivity across the workforce and keeps over fifty percent of our population down. I don't think that's funny, myself.

But hey--it apparently is a subject that makes you uncomfortable, so you push your discomfort off by making those absurd and insulting comments towards me.

Sorry. Your efforts to be cruel miss the mark. I don't really care about you, see, so your opinions, such as they are, are pretty meaningless. If I did, I'd be a bit sorry for you, that you have such low self esteem that you try so hard to put down others to try to build yourself up.

You try to dismiss anyone who doesn't see this in the same way by saying EVERYONE is sexist who looks at history and feels extremely queasy to hear an assassination as an excuse. She cannot win without cheating. So she should stay in the race for that reason... just in case.

Do the republicans have a stand-by candidate in case of assassination?

This remark comes on top of hard working Americans, white Americans and the argument made that bubbas won't vote for Obama and therefore Hillary must be allowed to game the rules so that she can run. This remark comes on top of her threat to take her campaign all the way to the convention and divide a party because she does not have the grace to know when it's over. This remark comes on top of her attempts to lie to the public about the popular vote or to even pretend it has any bearing on how primaries are decided. This remark comes on top of her claim that only she should be able to count any delegates in MI... how totally absurd has her entire campaign become?

So the remark has a context that has NOTHING to do with sexism.

In fact, I am so sick of females who scream sexism any time Hillary is mentioned. She was the heir apparent and she blew it. SHE is the one who couldn't win on her own merits because, frankly, the time of the Clinton democratic party is past. No one I know wants to go through another 4 or 8 years of Clinton crap.

People have simply had it with her and want her to accept that she cannot force her way onto the presidential ticket. This last comment was the one that sent people over the top.

Even prominent bloggers who have been her supporters throughout her candidacy are now calling for her to withdraw from the race. Are they sexist too?

That they are WRONG to be OFFENDED.

See, he gets it. HRC was comparing HER campaign to RFK's.

Obama wasn't even IN her picture.

Yet you go running after the guy with a gun. It's almost SICK, what came to YOUR minds.

It didn't come to RFK Juniors--and he should fucking have a sense of the situation, doncha think?

Every "prominent blogger" (that isn't actually true you know--you made that shit up--every PRO OBAMA blogger, you mean) is a fucking sexist, who cannot fathom a WOMAN comparing her campaign to a MAN's --even if that woman and man share the same senate seat from the same state, and are both INSURGENTS battling a presumptive nominee in a contest that could end in a floor fight.

Wow, no similarity THERE, is there?

Naaaaah....no similarity. Because she is a GIRL. And only OBAMA is allowed to be compared to ANY Kennedy, because Chris Matthews says so. So quick, get out the weaponry. Of course, if you pulled the string, the one needing the vest is HRC, because SHE's Bobby, GET IT?????

Take it up with RFK Junior. He gets it, and he SAID SO. This is faux poutrage on the part of Team Obama. Flopsweat desperation--a "much ado" exercise from the acolytes. Anything to beat the bushes and motivate the unthinking.

Shameful. You just didn't bother to look, or you did, and you ignored it anyway to suit your political purposes.

You guys should apologize to RFK Junior, IMO.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=6104130&mesg_id=6104130

this link is to a thread that notes both MyDD and LeftCoaster have been long-time Hillary supporters - go read their blogs before you continue to lie to yourself.

your comment is bat shit crazy to claim that "every prominent blogger is sexist." even those who supported Clinton throughout her campaign? Or to claim that I made up the statement. That's bat shit crazy too.

I did read what RFK Jr. wrote. You cannot know what he thought or didn't think, unlike your claim to be clairvoyant. I know what he said and I would hope and assume that any Kennedy who is a public figure would also downplay Clinton's remarks.

Clinton lost. No one forced her to say the MANY things she has said that, to me, are beyond the pale. I had no use for her after March and her McCain comment.

Your post doesn't change a thing about that moment or others that I noted in my earlier post. Please don't embarrass your fellow females who don't support Clinton by making hysterical claims. I was really stunned to see you calling me a liar when you could have easily verified my comments for yourself.

http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2008/05/rfk-jr-says-no.html

So RFK Junior is a big fat bullshitter, eh? Please. You people had preconceived, sexist notions, and you were wrong.

Case closed. But you DID manage to rile the dumber of your number, who cannot read for comprehension, so it wasn't a total loss, I suppose.

Go back and read what I wrote. I corrected YOUR "every prominent blogger" assertion to reflect only the PRO OBAMA ones. That's NOT "every prominent blogger" FWIW.

I can't believe how many people here don't know their own history, and get offended when people like Clinton dare to mention it.

The truth shall set you free...unless you don't want the truth, you just want to "BELIEVE!!!!!!!!!!!!"

:eyes:

What's with the "fellow females" shit? Don't embarrass yourself by making halfassed assumptions. But wow--you made one, AND used the "hysterical" word TOO. Amazing. Without SHAME, either.

Double whammy--and you think calling you on sexism is out of line? None so blind as those who will not see, apprently.

I never said RFK Jr. was a bullshitter. and I have no idea where you got that, but I will assume you pulled it out of your ass along with most of your other comments.

I said, I will repeat S L O W L Y that I would assume he and any other Kennedy would downplay her remarks. You said you "knew what he thought." I said you knew what he said.

If you change your post after someone has replied to your original one, you really cannot argue something after the fact. Not that that would stop you from doing so.

Yes, I assumed you were a female but I find it even more outrageous that you are a male and you are accusing females of sexism because they do not support your candidate. Yes, I was waiting for you to jump on the use of the word hysteria, dr. freud, but I purposely used it because it describes your posts.

And no, I am not ashamed of it. I have lived my life as a female and been sexually harrassed at work... physically sexually harrassed. I have been told that I couldn't or shouldn't do this or that because I am a female. I have done work in which I purposely did not disclose my gender because my work was received better that way. I'm not blind to this world.

So you are really over the line with your hysterical comments, yet again. And I am sick of them and you because you can only hear what you want to hear... just as you accuse others of doing. It's time for me to pretend you no longer exist here because you are a waste of my time and energy. This is simply ridiculous. I hope you flame out soon.

I haven't changed my posts. When one does that, it's apparent--there's a red EDITING line at the top of the post.

And you're simply being rude. I can read for comprehension, so you can cut that SLOWLY crap.

Sexism has little to do with support for a particular candidate. Some people are one or two issue voters. I know sexist old ladies who have "notions" about women's "proper" roles who are strong Clinton supporters. So you see, your assertion about candidate support isn't accurate.

There are sexists in all walks of life on all sides of the aisle. It's ingrained in our society, like racism. It affects over half our population and denies them full opportunity.

And it's WRONG. But it does exist, and it exists on this forum, too.

You give me a laundry list of the affronts you have suffered--and yes, you HAVE suffered, unfairly, too, if that list is accurate--and yet you cannot understand what I am saying. Or what RFK Junior was saying. He was VIGOROUSLY supporting the Senator. Not being polite or downplaying--he was telling the Obama supporters that they had it ALL WRONG. And they did. And the reason they did is because they couldn't make the connection between the female candidate comparing herself to the male late Senator, even though the similarities between them were staring them in the face. They automatically assumed that when Clinton said RFK she meant OBAMA. Not herself.

And that was sexist.



Have a nice day, now.

the assassination then? If she was talking only about her own campaign, she could have just said that RFK's campaign had gone into the month of June, so hers should too. What purpose was there in connecting that idea with the assassination?

I'll be *really* interested to hear your answer. Spin away.

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have gotten it ALL WRONG and that they are WRONG TO BE OFFENDED.

I'd say I'm right. The outrage came because NO ONE could IMAGINE a woman comparing her campaign to RFK's.

And the fact that they couldn't imagine it is an indictment against them. It's SEXISM.

They AUTOMATICALLY ass-umed that "Kennedy comparisons" somehow BELONG to Obama. That he owns the copyright. No one else can fit into that mold--not even if they are the Senator from the same state, running a 'come from behind' campaign against a "presumptive nominee" that might end on the floor of the convention--which would have happened, had not RFK been killed.

Ask RFK, Jr. He gets it. Amazing how many Obama fans just don't. And they don't even see their own prejudice.

That's what your candidate projected today.

To suggest that she should stay in the race because her competitor might be assassinated and she might still win...that's a sociopath. Apparently she thought it was ok to say because the last two times she said it she was not called out. No internal compass, no empathy, no center - she relies upon the reactions of others to guide her in how she should behave.

Her "retraction" was equally pathetic, and characteristic of a clinical sociopathy. How much leadership do you see there? I see nothing.

Countdown of Hardball, right?

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If at any time this was an opportunity for people to show their core decency, this was it.

are trying to say she's drawing a bead on the guy.

She was comparing her campaign to RFK's. BO was no where NEAR that discussion.

If anyone's sick here, it's the people doing the twisting of her words.

After reading the board, it's pretty clear that Hillary's method to dealing with this disaster is to send out her mouthpieces to the internet to stir up the "sexism" and "Hillary can do no wrong!" mantra's. Throw in a few "Obama supporters are crazy!"

Too bad basic logic and common decency are missing from her camp. Maybe even a bit of decorum and grace to know when it's time to exit for the good of the party. But no, she wants to burn the damn thing to the ground in a fit because she didn't get her coronation.

Sorry there "pal"--I've been here for YEARS.

I'm not a "mouthpiece." Which, BTW is slang for LAWYER, if you want to get technical. Of course, your intent was to suggest something closer to TROLL. And that's just NOT cool.

I think you might want to look a little closer to home if you are looking for a lack of basic logic and common decency, actually. To say nothing of an absence of grace or decorum. If there's a mirror on your wall, head over that way.

Making false accusations against long-time DUers says something about you. And what it says isn't terribly "pretty."

I'll bet it made you feel terribly smug, though, when you punched that SEND button.

That's what she just "put out there" in her application for leadership. She needs to stay in the race because Obama might be assassinated, and then she would win. That's about the gist of the statement. Her "retraction" is nothing but reinforcement of the notion, and proof of a complete lack of the notion of what it means to be a leader.

http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2008/05/rfk-jr-says-no.html

He's telling you that you have it ALL wrong. And he is in a position to know.

who has suffered enough over this.

where are the qualities of intelligence and leadership one would expect from a presidential candidate?

She drops a completely noxious idea into the mix about why she is still in the race and walks away, as if it has nothing to do with her. All this commotion on the web is a response to the vacuum of leadership and sanity she leaves in her wake.

Uh...uh...but she was talking about ....uh....OBAMA!!!!!!

NO. She wasn't. She was comparing HER campaign to RFK's, which is why his SON piped up to tell you, and others like you that YOU are WRONG. HE gets it. He is smarter than most people here, plainly.

You thought she was referring to Obama, somehow, even though she didn't even TALK about him or his campaign AT ALL, because you WANTED the controversy. Or some acolyte FED it to you, and you RAN with the bad idea.

And you maybe figured that "the girl" wasn't ALLOWED to compare herself to a Kennedy--that Obama owned that franchise, somehow, because Chris Matthew's tingling leg said so. If she was talking about RFK, that HAD to be code for OBAMA.

Sorry, no. It was code for CLINTON.

And Team O looks a bit sexist for thinking otherwise. That's the truth.

On behalf of all Obama supporters, let me apologize for our persistent victimization of Hillary. How could I or anyone have imagined that she was talking about Obama as the potential victim of assassination, when clearly she was offering herself up. My terrible sexist mistake.

The last choice is most unattractive and probably the saddest, as well--that way too many people are just really fucking stupid. POWER stupid. Stupid beyond the normal bounds of stupidity. And they think, if she's talking about a Presidential campaign in an historical context, one in which a MAN was murdered, why, it MUST be a MAN running for President NOW that she SECRETLY WANTS that to happen to!! It just MUST!!! Because she's EEEEVIL. Oh yes. She is. Never mind that she was talking about that campaign in reference to HER OWN.

:eyes:

Send your apologies to the Senator, not to me. On the day when you finally realize that she was maligned, and you mean it.

Is HRC adopting the role or are you placing her in it?

I have two daughters, and was raised by a strong single mom, a role-model grandmother, in the company of five successful and independent aunts. What is more obnoxious than the recent comment by HRC (which, admittedly, with a good explanation from the candidate could easily go away) is the notion that she has no role as a leader who must act and speak responsibly. Her supporters don't even seem to expect it, and any misstep on her part is turned again to demonstrate the victimization of women in our culture.

Needless to say, this whole aspect of the campaign is a counter-example to what I wish for my daughters to learn, and it is certainly the opposite of what I learned from my own family.

to attempt to victimize women.

I'm not doing shit. I'm just OBSERVING and commenting. Clinton is fighting back, and good for her.

I can't help YOU, if you don't know history. If you do know history, what she said is OBVIOUS. And responsible. It's stupid people and uninformed people who don't know the details of the RFK race, or SEXISTS who don't think a woman is permitted to compare herself to a man who don't 'get' it.

And FWIW, women -- even those who were raised by single mothers and had all sorts of 'female role models'--CAN be sexists, too. I know a number of them--they're elderly McCain voters, because they don't think a black or a woman "should" be President. Those role models don't always live their lives in such a way to guarantee a self-actualized viewpoint towards the women in our society. Sometimes, they are victims of sexism, too--at work, or in their personal lives. Ohter times, they perpetuate, for their own reasons, that cheesy, catfighting, "competing women" bullshit. In some situations, it can make what's bad, worse, because the child doesn't see these women treated respectfully by men in society. And as we know, children LEARN what they LIVE.

It is real shame that Clinton is "victimized" by people who don't know history or harbor a gender-based resentment towards her, and it is a shame that she must pander to the uninformed, the 'deliberate misconstruers,' the sexists and the morons. It's an unfortunate reality. She's too fucking smart, apparently, for much of America.

when she said people have been calling for her go get out since Iowa? Iowa??? Really, Iowa?

Why did she refer to Sen. Kennedy in her explanation, knowing she'd said this twice before?

And about Bill wrapping it up in June, really - after Paul Tsongas dropped out in March, it was over - Bill didn't have the delegates yet, but it was over.

She's pretty good at twisting her own words MADem - some call it lying.

Brown didn't bail out in March. Tsongas did, but Brown hung in there.

It wasn't as clear as everyone thought, not back then.

if we were the republican party, she'd have the nomination by now.

The entire discussion that everyone is so exorcised about was centered around a series of "IFs."

It's how thinking people strategize. Of course, the "concrete crowd" might have trouble with it.

that bothers people, rather than legitimate displeasure over a stupid, insensitive remark.

But then it wouldn't be DU without a bunch of people running around weeping and wailing and rending their garments.

QUITE another to imply that anyone upset over this is insane, stupid, etc.

You aren't even subtle.

And you didn't even hear what she said. You ass-umed.

Hillary took a huge lead, loads of advantages and turned it all into a political tragedy. Now, she is turning it into melodrama, day after painful day.

ENOUGH. It is not sexist to call Hillary on her continual poor judgment and bad behavior. That many FORMER supporters cannot be wrong.

She needs help because she is NOT dealing with reality well and she is REALLY fucking up the political realities. She is not as smart as she thinks she is, or we aren't as dumb as she thinks we are, or both.

I heard it. It is not the first time she has alluded to assassination. It is the third by my count.

Fuck her campaign. She should be answering questions in a Secret Service interrogation room. Any of us would be if we said the crap she said. Hell, school kids have had to answer to the SS for less.

She need help. If people REALLY loved her, they would make sure she got it. Jesus, no one to help the woman? No fucking wonder she is so screwed up.

.

And that "Obama supporters are WRONG TO BE OFFENDED" and that they MISCONSTRUED.

She was comparing HERSELF to RFK. He's heard her say it before.

Only stupid people can't see that. RFK Junior isn't stupid. He got it.

I really thought Obama supporters were smarter than they seem to be.

she started out inspiring - being the first woman and all...she brought tears to my eyes many times - then she started down a dark, dark road of misspeaks and this one hit many very hard. RFK Jr is a stronger than I am - this remark today has brought back many sad memories and tears!

And her remarks had NOTHING to do with OBAMA.

Funny how everyone thought it did, though--because a WOMAN shouldn't compare herself to ... a MAN. And of course, everything's ALWAYS about Obama..and of COURSE, she was wishing him ill...because she's so DARK and EVIL.

Come on.

What a load of spun crap. That's what RFK Junior was saying, politely, when he said that Team Obama was WRONG to be offended.

to RFK had NOTHING to do with Obama. And that is NOT an insult--it is a FACT.

Four POINTS:

--HRC was comparing her campaign to RFK's.

--Two New York Senators.

--Two Presidential Candidates.

--Two campaigns that continue on into June.

But hey, people who have a basic PREJUDICE in their heads and hearts cannot comprehend a WOMAN comparing herself to a man.

Why, the only KENNEDY COMPARISON that is ALLOWED is between MEN. Like JFK and Obama.

And because Clinton mentioned KENNEDY--even the one from HER state, whose KIDS endored her--why, she HAD to be "talking code" about Obama.

Because that's THE RULE--when you are a misogynist.

And you folks don't see it, and have absolutely NO SHAME.

I speak only in metaphors.

You fucking make me puke.

oh wait

the use of the assassination of a beloved political figure for political leverage. You disgust me. Welcome to my ignore list, asshat.

Take it from an old woman who has been in the fight for equality for a LONG TIME:
GROW THE FUCK UP or stop sniveling. You do not help the causes of women by your constant labeling anyone who disagrees with you as sexist. Honestly, you go on like a two year old trying to apply a word just learned to every sentence uttered

Give it up. Grow up.

You grow the fuck up. And admit when you're wrong. Because you are DEAD WRONG in this case.

HRC was comparing HERSELF and HER campaign to RFK's.


Not everything is about your litle crush, you know.

Go do the google. Read what the son of "On To Chicago" had to say. He said YOU are WRONG.

And YOU give it up. You're WRONG.

Get fucking serious. You howl SEXIST at just about ANY post critical of Hillary. RFK does not do that you insufferable fool. You may be having delusions. Might wanna see someone about that.

And what the hell is "Not everything is about your litle crush, you know. "? What the fuck are you blathering about? Thank goodness all HRC ditto heads are not as off the wall. She would be even more of a laughing stock if that were the case.

Little crush? Orange crush? :wtf: Are you thinking I idealize Obama the way you do Clinton? :rofl: I am actually an Edwards voter. Not everyone who does not favor Clinton is a kid groupie of Obama. Hell, it looks like there might even be some sort of persecution complex thing working for you to make such assumptions.

HRC was not comparing herself nor her campaign to RFK. If you really believe that, I hope someone loves you enough to get to to some care.

He says you are WRONG.

You're the one "blathering" here--and you're talking nothing but crap.

RFk Junior SAID she was comparing her campaign to RFK's. He said it TODAY, in fact.

Call him up and tell him he's blathering, why don't you?

You are blathering and now seem to be foaming at the mouth.

be calling him "Kennedyesque" and oohing and ahhing about the 21st Century Camelot. And saying, "Oh YES, he IS like RFK...he draws the crowds, he's SUCH an ORATOR!!!"

You wouldn't be accusing him of wanting to wax Clinton. And if anyone suggested it, your crew would get all insulting and pile on with snark.

It wouldn't even enter your mind. Because you'd not have a problem with a MAN comparing himself to another man. But when HRC compares herself to RFK, you can't even SEE it. NO ONE did.

You actually THINK she's comparing OBAMA to RFK, because you have a sexist bias.

How many people here have said, on varying threads, that by her comments, it was apparent that she wished BO harm, or if anything happened SHE'd have blood on her hands?

Those comments by posters here indicated that they actually believed she was comparing RFK to BO. But she wasn't doing that. Not at ALL.

She was comparing RFK to HERSELF.

And that IS the truth. Even RFK Junior says you guys are completely wrong on this.

PS--Repeated use of the word "blathering" does not help your argument, especially when it is YOU doing said blathering. And, apparently, FOAMING as well. See, making snarky little bullshit comments like that don't turn lies into truths. They never have. And they just make you look, well, less than mature in your discourse. If you're trying to be cutting or snarky, that kind of grade school invective does not bother me, because those comments reflect on YOU, you see. And not in a terribly good way.

Here, read this: http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2008/05/rfk-jr-says-no.html

Ooops. RFK Junior will have to go under that bus, too, eh?

son disgust you too?

by using her GENDER as an excuse.

I'm perhaps willing to accept that she made a horrible mistake THREE FUCKING TIMES and she didn't really mean it in the way I understand it, but to claim that we are understanding it in a certain way because of mass sexism? Unbelievable.

Because how DARE a woman compare herself to someone holding the same job she is holding, from the same fucking state?

How DARE she compare herself to a presidential candidate who campaigns on through June?

Because she's just a GIIIIIRL.

What a pantload.

I'm not willing to accept that this many Obama supporters can be that fucking stupid. It was obvious that the comparison was RFK and HRC. But EWWWWW---Oh-BAAAA-MAAAH is "the NEW Kennedy!!" Therefore, it just HAAAS to be about HIIIIIM!

Team O is like a bunch of sick fucking groupies at times. And THIS is one of them. He doesn't OWN the Kennedy brand.

The only conclusion is that they are indulging in rank sexism and faux outrage to rally the sick little elements within their base.

is that her historical bookmark? Mention that Kennedy won CA in June---fine. But the assassination talk? Crazy. Pathological.

And it's not because she's a woman that it's a pathology. It's because she is a Democrat and an American.

He didn't end that campaign by stubbing his toe or having heart failure, did he?

How DID it end? Gee, the candidate was killed--which is why he didn't get to campaign on THROUGH JUNE. Would you be happier if she instead said "He had to stop campaigning because he went over the rainbow bridge?"

WTF is WRONG with people? Why are people so AFRAID of our history? You think "not talking about it" makes it GO AWAY?

Should we call slavery "a really lousy job" to not hurt people's feelings because some of our ancestors suffered under that condition?

If Hillary said dumb things because she is over-tired (as some here have suggested), you must be fucking exhausted.

That they MISCONSTRUED.

Gee, ain't that interesting...

RFK Jr. says it's all ok, so therefore it is. He's one person; he may be more entitled to his opinion than anyone else, but I'm afraid there are a LOT of people who don't agree, and they ain't all DUers.

You're proud that your sexist preconceptions made it IMPOSSIBLE for you to see that the comparison was between Clinton and RFK, apparently. You think that's "cool."

You still don't "get" that OBAMA was not part of her discussion at all. That she was comparing HER campaign to RFK's.

That's obtuse sexism, there, if you can't get it even AFTER RFK JR explains it to you.

I suppose her apology doesn't even make its stupidity apparent either, does it?

Because he agrees with me--You guys, he said, are WRONG.

Take it up with RFK Junior. I'm sure he'll accept YOUR apology.

as pointed out above, this was all a RACIST thing! :sarcasm:

Many states hadn't even voted in June when RFK was killed, and HRC knows enough about history to know that. She's a very smart woman.
So why was June significant? Because RFK was killed. THIS JUNE and THAT JUNE are completely different politically.


Makes me feel so sad.

That's why Bobby's last words were "Now it's on to Chicago".

THAT was the point.

And June was still JUNE. And the comparison was RFK-HRC.

But somehow, a crew of sickos are trying to bring Obama into the discussion, when it was NOT ABOUT HIM.

Makes me feel disgusted that you'd try to pile on in this fashion. It is offensive, and it's sad that so many people are such rank sexists in the 21st Century. Stunning, actuallly.

Take the sexism plank out of your eye and look at it. You will see it is labeled "sexism" with a "Misandrony" subtitle.

That feeling you experience is unconnected with reality.

MADem. Comparatively speaking you make me feel much better. It takes not much to feel superior when confronted by some misanthropic irrational posters. Find a hole and stay MAD.

Try "grow up" why don't you?

Just more dirt on my sleeve to wipe off.

Wow, I am sure he is happy to know that. You should call him and tell him how happy you are that Hillary made those comments today. Perhaps you can all arrange a little tea party together. Serve crumpets. Then you can explain to him why 3 days after his uncle Ted went into the hospital, Hillary thought it was a good idea to remind everyone about his father. Or how his father's assassination is fair for political talking points these days. Especially a couple of weeks before the anniversary.

But don't invite Obama over. Because he is an inexperienced pimply-faced, milk on the lip boy who will probably get upset over the talk about assassination (you know how irrationally testy those Black folk are about assassination). Yep, better keep him in the kitchen where he belongs.

And thank you for the ignorance remark... wipe, wipe... It's a good reminder about how I have no pulse on people's understanding and how I should defer to the wisdom of the Elderly.

Soon another dinosaur extinction will occur.

That he made....oh.....TODAY.

Wow, it's funny watching you dig a big fat hole. Add a little more high dudgeon, while you're at it. Obama, one more time, since you are OBTUSE, was not part of that discussion. The comparison was between HRC and RFK. As RFK Junior knew. And as you still don't.

It's amusing to see someone persist in a false assertion, even when facts come to the fore from people in a plain position to know that make those assertions seem, well, stupid, idiotic...WRONG.

Keep digging, tell us when you reach the other side of the world. When you get there, google RFK's statement.

Perhaps he won't allow you into the tea party after all. You have such a sharp tongue.

I am happy to amuse you with my big, fat hole. A bit confused as to why I need a dudgeon, or even what a dudgeon is. Nevertheless, respecting the wisdom of my elders I shall endeavor to find out.

Perhaps you can enlighten me as to my false assumption? You seem to have such a keen sense of intelligence. Is it the assumption that Hillary made a political gaffe today? That she is losing the nomination? That her words today were.... untimely at best... insensitive at least.... and downright sinister if I have few shots of Rum?

I certainly would insist that my assumption that you are an axe grinder is correct. Also my assumption that you are someone carrying more than your fair share of hatred.

It would be easier to dig our this hole if you would kindly stop throwing your dirty, angry garbage into it.

He was polite, but he was also STRAIGHTFORWARD. He said you were WRONG.

I'm not at all angry. You're just being obstreperous, because you were completely wrong on this matter.

I also like your use of extremes in your language. "not at all" angry even when mad is emphasized in your name (with BOLD LETTERS, again). Or how I am "completely" wrong on the matter.

Your age, wisdom and passionate responses with BOLD LETTERS make me want to really pay attention to your words. So I will just admit that Hillary is a sweet loving, soon to be elderly lady who made an innocent mistake when she invoked RFKs assassination three times when referring to her hopeless campaign into June. After all, she is just a sweet, honorable woman and women never would use such vile tactics to gain the most powerful position in the world.

Thank you for your use of the word "obstreperous" as well. I usually hear it in reference to unruly children.... Then again, since it helps you to consider me a child unfit for your wisdom, I guess it must apply.

You should also know it refers to someone who is boisterous, as in using BOLD LETTERS to shout out their ideas.

You apparently don't know the difference between this and THIS. The first is bold letters, the second, caps.

But you do know one thing, it would appear--you have no life. And you like to waste time on the internets, picking fights over stupid shit.

But now, you bore me, because you are immature, and you aren't smart enough to keep me amused. And I do have a life, and better things to do than fuck around with you. I've made my points, if you don't like them, well, tough shit.

Go to bed. And if you are on a daily medication, do take it.

So long, Sparky!

:hi:

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She screwed up! She needs to get the hell out of the race now. She can't win

If the guy is shot, she'll get her call.

Re If the guy is shot, she'll get her call.

If God forbid anything happened to Barack Obama, people would always suspect she had something to do with it, and some would express their suspicions out loud. I still don't believe she had anything to do with Vince Foster's suicide, but some RWWs I know are still regurgitating their old conspiracy theories.

I think she just totally shot herself in the foot with this one--for the vice presidency or anything else.

from Americablog:

6:08PM Eugene Robinson just said "her apology adds insult to injury." I have the video coming up shortly.

6:00PM MSNBC's Keith Olbermann will have a "special comment" tonight about Hillary's horrific words. This is one not to be missed, I suspect.

He could not believe that people were being so nice to her, and that she apologized to the Kennedy family, but not to Obama.

she's guilty as fuck

guilty

I wouldn't say that if there was ANY OTHER conceivable explanation... I am not one to buy off on instant outrage...

this one is what it is...

Axelrod just got invited to comment and said he's sure she didn't mean it that way but WHAT ELSE could he say?

Matthews said the AP reported it that way and it's the only reasonable interpretation for any "journalist" his words.

and as far as KO disbelief goes, she has nothing for which she needs to apologize to Senator Obama. His name was not even mentioned. His campaign was not under discussion. She was talking about her OWN campaign, comparing it to RFK's. If anything, the comparison of how his campaign ended with correlate with HER, not Senator Obama!

  There are lots of Clinton supporters who are, again, finding themselves rethinking their position based on another horrible move by Clinton. The rest, the unthinking, unquestionings are piping up, trying to spin something that cannot be.

  With the exception of Writer, so far, who was pretty decent in disagreement.

PB

are stupid sometimes-

really stupid.

:hug:

I pity her- and those who believe she is infallable.

peace Redqueen~

blu

Yes, it grates.

If they don't understand why they should be outraged and very sad about Clinton's comments, they are to be pitied, imo.

.

Pity is not the emotion I feel.

I feel like there is much more danger out there for BHO than I initially thought.

It is outrageous. The thought is either he is no danger at all (ostrich with their heads in the sand) OR they don't think the threat will be followed through on (don't know/don't care how deep seated some racists' sentiment is) or have a willful disregard for BHO's life (it's just another dead expletive epithet).

None of these things make me feel pity instead it makes me want to get on my knees and pray for BHO's life and safety because it is something HRC has continued to say.

I DO pity them, though, regardless of what their rationale might be. Most, I believe, know exactly how appalling and despicable her current AND past statements have been in this regard but cannot bring themselves to admit it therefore they must demean others while ignoring what they know to be true.

There is a very small minority, to be sure, who also know exactly what she meant and will applaud her because she echoes their thinking, they are despicable and no pity from me for them at all.

given what the Kennedys are going through right now.

At worst...well, you know what it is at worst.

But of course, SOME of us are flies inhabiting the walls of her brain, and we "know" exactly what she meant by it, and if anyone else dares to think she meant it any other way than they KNOW she meant it, well, we're all sexists and misogynists. And if we're women, it's doubly bad.

Right. Yep. You bet.

which is why they are tying to put the flames out by insulting those who are insulted. This is no sweetie gate, huge ass gate, snub gate or finger gate, remember those? The hillbots were all over those like white on rice. Their candidate has no tact whatsoever and she just proved to the world that she doesn't. Even if you take Obama out of the equation, the simple fact that Ted Kennedy was diagnosed with a brain tumor and she knows this tells you the woman has no tact. Why make that comment with the family is going through hell right now? Add Obama into the equation and it is even worse. They know this which is why they are trying to put out the flames online but it is not going to work. The media is all over this and this is not going to sit well with Super D's. Hillary just done herself in for good. We all knew it was over but she would not leave the race. I don't think she will be given a choice after this comment.

are running around GD: P right now telling us to "calm down" too.

People saying she wants him killed or that he should fear what she might do are fucking hysterical.

It was a dumb, ugly remark, a strange little talking point that made no sense. And it was all but inexcusable. Suddenly I wonder what kind of crazy scenarios she and Bill have been discussing, but I'm afraid I don't really want to know.

"catastrophic event" they've been hoping for. I didn't realize they wanted it to be that catastrophic.

:shrug:

I'll talk all the shit you want.

.

If someone chooses to say its in extremely poor taste, cool.

If someone says she is staying in the race in hopes Obama will die, you are nuts.

The comments I have read are about 10% the former and 90% the latter. Hence the laughter.

They don't know what it means to live through those days -- and some of us had too many of them.

They don't know what we lost -- they've only ever known Bushes and Clintons.

But, I'll tell you one thing. That base of hers is going to have to turn itself into a pretzel to deny what they do know and what it means to them.

I understand perfectly well without having been a gleam in anyone's eye at the time.

They understand. They just don't care.

It matters that adults all around you sagged, even collapsed and maybe you realized for the first time that those giants could be as helpless as you were.

As for people not caring, their loss. So much their loss.

I was there in High School when JFK was killed, and at work when RFK and MLK were killed.

Don't tell me I don't know what it was like to live through those days. I know it very well! I know very well what we lost!

That does not change the fact that Senator Clinton did not advocate for the assassination of Senator Obama. She explained that he was still in the race in June, as is she. He was coming from behind, he had lost Oregon, and Senator Humphrey was favored. Sounds a lot more like she was making a comparison to herself, not to Senator Obama! Senator Obama never came into the question or the answer!

Everything is not always about BO!

It's about the people who worked their hearts out for Bobby.

You still don't get it.

Ciao.

would agree with you?

No, I don't get it. I know exactly what was lost during the 60s. And what we gained by the heroism of the likes of JFK, RFK and MLK. I worked for Bobby too. I cheered for MLK. I have a close friend, whom I admire and respect greatly, who happens to be an (now retired) ordained minister who was arrested in Alabama during a civil rights march in, I think, 1965.

No, I don't get it. What Hillary said was not about Obama. It was about the time line of the campaign, and that the only reason he didn't go further into June was because he was murdered. It had NOTHING at all to do with Obama. Nothing at all.

And by Ignore, I mean I usually tell them to fuck off with their lame attempts at requiring others to see the world as they do.

This is a highly legitimate story about Hillary and the RFK story. We know exactly what she meant, and we don't care for her rampant, out of control, egocentric campaign.

I happen to agree with him. http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2008/05/rfk-jr-says-no.html

Fucking jump on 2012...John McCain will be 72 1/2 yrs old on the very first day if he takes office on (Jan 20th 2009) and he's absolutely and completely nuts, just another puppet for the manipulating backstage neo-cons.... the republicans!!

Who will try not to make him seem cry (just for the fuck of it)...Time now for secret analysis - McCain is a complete imbecile, a basket case with tons of baggage.....Yes, indeed, McCain will make a fine republican (robot) president!

are all equally outraged over it. This is huge. And nothing is going to make it go away. In fact every time a Hillbot tells me to "get over it", it enrages me that much more.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=6108152&mesg_id=6108152





.

Is Skinner's opinion supposed to be everyone's opinion?