Sooo...Barack Obama is going to Iraq. Are WE paying for this?

This is just a question of MONEY. I would ask the same thing about Clinton, and I DID ask the same thing about every other Congressional Yahoo who figured he/she needed some "Iraq Face Time" to boost his/her "Cred."

If he wins and goes next year, fine. As a matter of fact, it's a sucker bet that any president will spend some time in the Middle East, but right now, he's a Presidential Candidate, and we are PAYING for his flight, his Secret Service Entourage, and the endless hours of MSM coverage before/during/after what is essentially at this moment, a junket.

Just curious, and as I said, I've asked this question every time Joe Schmuck from Podunk felt the need for sand.

Let asshole (Bush) go to Iraq, he caused it.
And McBush - screw him calling Obama out. Obama didn't start this war.
McBush is just hoping that Obama will get killed.

Obama should instead hold public hearings on the humanitarian crises in
Iraq, instead of being dragged into a dog and pony show.

Families of five Britons held in Iraq speak out

LONDON (AFP) — The families of five British hostages being held in Iraq pleaded for their release in a BBC interview Thursday on the first anniversary of their kidnap.

The group was seized by about 40 gunmen wearing police uniforms at the finance ministry in Baghdad last May 29.

They have been identified as IT specialist Peter Moore, who was working for a US management consultancy, and four security guards with Canadian firm GardaWorld who have not been named.

"Please, please release my brother, he's a father, son and brother to myself, we miss him dearly," a woman named only as Lisette, the sister of a hostage named Jason, told BBC radio.

...
http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5jSb4Ln9IobXhQZ-2poP3hkIscZ7A

EXACTLY the kind of response I'd hoped for. Too bad you're almost the Lone Ranger.

I think he's well out of his league with the relatively simple things, let alone the tough stuff.

Actually scratch that first claim. He can barely put one sentence together.

maybe the archives aren't working.

I'd complain if YOU went and we had to pay for it.

Just a cost saving Idea for the future.

Hillary Clinton went to Iraq, and she's not even going to be president.

:shrug:

You running out of "astute" observations? Maybe John McCain will pay for it. He's the one who suggested that he and Obama should go together.

Expensive Photo Op.

Maybe Senator Obama can do something about all these expensive junkets when he gets into office?

Now THAT was charitable of me.

oops

But you don't know or care about that one. We pay for these Congressional overseas trips all the time.

What the hell good can LaHood do in Lebannon? what a jerk.

It's part of his job to go to Iraq. Senators Kerry, Dodd and Biden have also travelled to Iraq and Afghanistan as part of their job on that committee as well.

which he likely will. why go now? what good will it do?

:shrug:

so ... help me out here. Why then do you care when he goes?

IF he doesn't get elected, will he go next year? Probably.

Then why go now? I would ask the same thing about anyone we are paying for a trip to Iraq.

(I think I'm having Deja Vu)

there are others on that committee. seems double occupancy might save a buck. I'll munch to THAT.

Maybe he can pay for it all with the war money he saves us. Consider it an investment.

AND, a penny saved is a penny earned.

I mean, if it's a non-primary issue to you, you should have posted this in GD. And yet you didn't.

:banghead:

SAVE a buck or two. Just a suggestion. What is with you people? Saving money is BAD?

n/t

:rofl:

Or did you forget that fact in your rush to find something to bitch about?

This isn't an issue. I'm just curious. I think I know the answer, and would like this sort of thing be it Lieberman, McCain, or ANY democrat curtailed in the future.

We're kind of broke, aren't we?

We're rollin' in dough, man.

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

Maybe we ought to curtail this sort of thing in the future.

I'm willing to chip in. Anyway, whether Obama goes to Iraq or any other junket, the amount of money spent is really a drop in the bucket. Try to focus on the big picture. The idea is to win the presidency. You can't end the occupation with McCain as president.

COMPARED to what we are spending in Iraq daily, because a lazy Congress voted for the IWR, it amounts to very little

Senator Everett Dirksen. A kind and gentle man.

A lot of inner city kids might argue with us on this.

It's a waste for ANYONE to go there, especially now.

Let's see: bombs? CHECK. dead babies? CHECK. dead soldiers? CHECK. sand? CHECK. crazy factionalism? CHECK.

I have just completed the checklist for every politician who wants to waste our money with a trip to Sunny Iraq.

I don't get it.

The obvious explanation is because mccain is calling him out on it.

Of course the obvious answer is, pointing out what a sick joke mccain made out of himself and lindsey graham, when they visited Iraq, trying to portray how safe it was, which of course it was pointed out that was not the reality

Personally, I agree with you, there is no need for him to go to Iraq at this time, but not because of cost, but because it feeds right into the repukes hands

Besides the cost, the Right will make hay of this, and God forbid, he could get hurt.

THAT would really further the cause of World Peace, wouldn't it?

The hidden costs of 500 MSM idiots trailing him, THEIR protection, food, everything....

You could pay the SS of a small town for the rest of their lives with that.

Since when are troops paid by the hour?

If they aren't protecting HIM, then they are doing the job of the troops that are.

I honestly don't know.

why should any politician ever go anywhere? They can just talk to you and find out all the vital information necessary to form an opinion on foreign policy. Because you know what's going on in Iraq how? How's that oil law doing by the way?

what mccain is trying to say is that in order to understand the problems of Iraq you need to go there

That is bullshit

When lindsey graham and mccain visited Iraq, they presented a distorted picture on how safe it was. It was later pointed out what a fraud that was

That is all I was saying, and if Clinton was doing it, I would question it as well.

should not visit foreign countries because of something John McCain said?

that little market that McInsane had his photo op at?
you know the one where he says how peaceful everything is and
there are blackhawk helicopters overhead protecting the son of a bitch?

Did you hear about McCain's 2007 stroll through a market in Iraq?

During McCain's 2007 visit, he wore a bulletproof vest. Attack helicopters circled above, sharpshooters stood ready on rooftops, and 100 soldiers in armored Humvees protected him on the ground. And for good reason - the market was bombed several times in the year before their visit. Yet, McCain said of this market (implying the streets of Baghdad are safer now than they were before):

"There are neighborhoods in Baghdad where you and I could walk through those neighborhoods today. . . I just came from one."

A year later, in 2008, McCain visited Iraq again. This time, it was too dangerous for him to visit the same market, even with the heavy security measures of the year before. Yet, with security conditions even worse than before, McCain gave this rosy (if not reality-based) statement about Iraq:

“Anybody who believes the surge has not succeeded, militarily, politically and in most other ways, frankly, does not know the facts on the ground.”

http://www.john-w-mccain.com/100-years-in-Iraq.html

of the Members of the Congress who have visited Iraq since McCain's photo-op? This is ludicrous. A country we spend billions of dollars on fighting a war with and no one should visit it because McCain and Bush have photo-ops there?

Considering that Bush is "Commander in Chief" and the decider of whose
hotel gets bombed or shot at, it would be insane for Obama to go to
Iraq just because McInsane wants him to.

All these junkets are ridiculous.

If he's going as a senator, then the Illinois tax payers are paying for it. Since he has spent so little time as their senator this year, I think they deserve to get something for their money.

If he's going as a presidential candidate, the campaign is paying for it. I'm sure you know where all his campaign money comes from. And I'm sure that those financing the campaign would like him to go anywhere that he thinks might help him win.

To be less cynical, maybe he truly wants to see/hear/feel what the troops are doing over there, and I think he should. If he's going to talk about Iraq so much, this will give him more credibility with the troops themselves (my fiance is one of them).

I don't want anyone going to Iraq.
McCain's wonderful safe trip to a market ended up costing those shop owners their
lives the week after.

Plus McCain had a few helicopters and a squad of soldiers surrounding him.

McCain is an ass who just wants to get Obama killed.

NOBODY should be going there now. NOBODY should be going there PERIOD. EVERYONE should be LEAVING there last week.

the market buying rugs.

If he goes, he said it's to talk to the troops and generals on the ground. He didn't want to go with McSame because it would be nothing more than an opportunistic photo op. He also said something about not strolling around, but can't remember the exact phrase.

Personally, I think it's too risky - I worry that something will happen.

all he will see in Iraq is what McBush wants him to see.

All anyone needs to see are the injured soldiers at the hospitals here
and the coffins coming back to Dover.

I might even VOTE for him.

If you want McSame to win, vote for him or stay home. I'm not going to beg you to do the right thing with your vote. Me however, I'm rightfully concerned about not only the war, but the supreme court - so I'll vote for the nominee this fall.

Take my response lightly as it was intended.


"Sufficient unto the day is the evil thereof." Matthew 6:34

Why should Obama be any different?

"If Hillary Clinton jumped off a bridge...."

Well, you can figure it out.

My point was only why bother?

:evilgrin:

and Iraq is a central issue to that committee. Sorry that you failed to drum up a controversy here. Thanks for playing. Please exit stage left and pick up your parting gifts. :rofl:

Will Obama likely get to be the nominee? Yes.
IF he gets elected, he WILL go to Iraq.

Why go NOW? NOBODY should be going over there NOW. TROOPS shouldn't be going over there NOW.

A simple, civil, general question.

Senators make fact-finding tours in several contexts all the time, whether or not they are running for the White House or even re-election. You know that.

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

Why? What personal ox of yours did I gore?

I suggested he WAIT until he is president or if he doesn't make it, go with a couple of OTHER FRC members to save a buck and this is the end of the world?

What's WRONG with you people?

Care to fucking talk about IT?

I would think if the cost of an extra junket, especially one that requires about five times the Secret Service agents and material because they are protecting a Presidential Candidate is a little ill timed. Equally for that idiot McCain, and equally for Clinton if she did it.

IF he takes about 3 or 4 other members with him to save money, then I won't complain about it. Really.

I'm just a cheap bastard. Truly.

I'll think of you all while I'm safe, sound, warm and fed with the rest of my extended family. May you be so lucky, but I doubt it. Have a nice Depression.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=6166439&mesg_id=6170400

You're very quick to tell us all where we're going wrong, and very slow to look at yourself. I don't think you're a bad guy at all and have enjoyed a lot of your posts over the years here. But you're clearly in a foul mood about how this election has played out.

I'm not even close to the nicest guy here, but I'm not complaining about how I'm being treated either, nor am I hoping that others suffer while I'm comfy cozy with relatives because I didn't get the candidate I wanted. And do you really think that if McCain wins there will be any place that's truly safe? Obama was my next to last choice. How excited do you think I am? :shrug:

ridiculous..
you want the next president making decision and policy blind?

you and idiots like you, are ones who deserve all the lies bush has handed you.

that way Bush the decider can't have him offed.

Except for the ones that are paid for by lobbyists, that is...

Aren't we BROKE? I seem to remember something about that in the papers.

Then we'll all vote on it.

I'd just rather see us LEAVE Iraq, not GO there.

that you were personally picking up the tab.

Jeebus Tyler, is this your idea of a controversy? Senators are expected to travel to foreign countries, especially ones we are "at war with" ---

Is this the weirdest meltdown? Why do you suppose Tyler is so upset?

and about 30-40 others as well....hmm.

I vote for STAY HOME.

If so, now's a fine time to cry poverty.

damn you guys are soooooooooo bitter queen shillary was a failure...

:rofl:

Hint: The color of Obama's skin. He has no love for Hillary. Only hate for things of black skin.

You're a paranoid racist for saying that.

Slacker. I've read your screeds Mike L. Basically it is TOTAL SHIT.

Racist.

You are a scream.

Some of us think that's a good thing. :evilgrin:

Just a little money conscious these days.

Traveling is what Senators do. McCain had 6-8 trips to Iraq in the last few years.

Bush, on the other hand, flew Air Force One to do fundraising for McCain. That's a much more expensive trip than Obama's flight to Iraq.

I'd think you'd be more concerned by that.

Or so I've been told.

Now don't go off on me. Just trying to keep it LIGHT today.

But you pick a funny place to question Obama on a day when you're "trying to keep it light."

(How's that workin' for ya?)

Congress members often travel to areas that are central to their voting... Anyone who is trying to become President needs to do that even more.

I don't see how it would ever be wasting money to tour an area that is so central to the policy decisions that will be pivotal in this year's election. And Obama has a reasonable case for going to Iraq just based on his committee responsibilities in the Senate.

Aside from all that, McCain was already slamming Obama for not having been to Iraq in a couple of years. If he didn't go, McCain would be describing Iraq as if it were Disneyland nowadays through the rest of the campaign.

This is an uncommon example of tax money being well spent. I don't see the basis for your issue with it.

...so I've no objection to his going. What I'd like to see, or rather not see, is him go there, look around, talk to troops and commanders, and there be no obvious "photo ops". This is of course in response to GOP needling, so contrast a real "fact finding" junket with the McCain staged photo op. And yes, it is a "junket", but seriously, this is your issue? With a presidential primary process that's cost what, half a BILLION dollars, and a General Election that will cost that much and more. With several billion getting "LOST" in Iraq, bridges collapsing, and cities sinking, this is the government spending you want to gripe about?

Ok, whatever.

It's for the greater good and i think needs to be done just once in this race. It would help considerably in his foreign policy creds and make him look presidential. It is money well spent

Otherwise, it's an unnecessary trip while we are borrowing trillions from China.

A. McInsane is probably hoping such a trip would get his opponent killed, and or
B. The entire trip will be arranged so that Obama only sees what they want him to see.

Obama is smart, his advisors are brilliant, and they are aware of A and B.

Its not about cost, its that the media won't report on what is happening
in Iraq.

Those that do end up having their hotels demolished by US tanks.

Although the OP comes across sounding critical of Obama - lets look at
the real picture - Iraq is a nightmare, McCain disrespects veterans, and a trip to Iraq
is dangerous and would not provide the truth.

I think people whose every other post is "LINK?" are proof of the existence of the "missing Link."

I saved my essays from the front pages in 2001-2002 by actually going page by page. Nothing else seemed to work.

Take my word for it? I hate ALL dumb things, including the dumb things that other candidates do.

Making observations on The Great One that do not come with the requisite holy balm are not allowed here.

He can do whatever he wants whenever he wants, as long as he tells us he wuvs us. <swoon>

Don't worry, the trip has been focus-grouped enough that he knows he can wrap it up in a big 'ol flag of "concern" and everyone will be just fine.

In this regard, he is much smarter than Hillary, who would fuck up a trip to the grocery store by saying she was pelted with eggs from angry chickens and had to take cover behind the Vanilla Wafers.

I would like some non-partisan condemnation of expensive congressional junkets. Anyone's.

Enough people from the other side have injected agenda already. Ammo is not needed.

I fear you won't find it in this particular climate, for neither side can see past their own particular set of blinders.

It has become a game now to see whose side can "win", and any and all tactics that are condemned on side A are perfectly OK if used by side B.

No one sees the warts on their side - they are too busy attacking the perceived ones on the other "team."

Rah-Rah-rah!!!

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

What, is their some kind of secret handshake that I missed or something?

When one views "your" community without a jaundiced eye one sees exactly what I said - two groups fighting like children over who is best, neither one actually looking at what their respective candidate have done in the past, but rather hoping that they will somehow be different than their histories indicate.

Sorry if that upsets you, but you can either research the candidates or read Alice In Wonderland.

Oh, and the whole respect thing was a bit overdone, don't you think? It's a message board and a political election, not a natural disaster.

P.S. Lots of people here know who I am - we met in the ditches of Crawford, or on the streets of D.C., or in the cold New Hampshire days during the primaries of '04, or in Ohio on Election Day.

Just because someone doesn't like your favorite team doesn't mean they hate the ballgame. They just want the rules to be fairer from now on, and until they are have decided to back the guys with the small payroll but the honest soul.

I always thought elections were referendums on ideas - not beauty contests.

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

1.75 of your taxes will help pay for the trip. It won't break you will it?

3.75 million. The yearly budget of the premier free AIDS clinic in Atlanta, GA.

Seems a little silly when you put it in that perspective, doesn't it?

To the best of my understanding, his secret service "entourage" isn't paid by the hour. They're paid a salaried wage. If they are protecting him in Wisconsin or Baghdad, its basically the same thing. As for his flight, I'm sure if its a big issue, he can pay for it. As for "we are paying for...the endless hours of MSM coverage...", well, you're gonna have to expand on that one.

I'm not sure it makes sense for him to go because, no matter what he might say, it is a political trip. But the idea that the expense should be an issue seems to be a stretch.

AND they get paid EXTRA for "hazardous duty." At least the did when I knew a few in the 80's.

Add the plane, the fuel, BLACKWATER...

Why do it at all?

As for hazardous duty pay, I don't know if that's correct (by definition, all duty as a secret service officer is "hazardous" duty -- you are expected to take a bullet for your protectee for god's sake!).

So you've got the plane and the fuel. And maybe blackwater, but only if they get paid by the hour.

Why not Obama?

Not one post by the OP on who was paying for Hillary's trip when she went. Someone said the last throes were ugly but at this point they are quite funny.

There are over 200,000 Americans in Iraq, they (more than many) deserve to see the Democratic Candidate. Additionally, it is worthwhile for the electorate to see how the Candidates respond the reality of Iraq and not the media or propaganda version. Finally, I expect to him to be FULLY informed for the debates and not take away one of McCain's stupid talking points.

I also think it is admirable that he has refrained fro mgoing up to this point.

...give it a brake. He deserves to see first hand why our children are dying there and why we've already invested about $4 trillion on a fiasco.

a statement to the effect that he wasn't interested in being part of a "campaign stunt".

Hope that makes you feel a little better about the guy.

Peace,
sw

Ahem. Cough.

who the fuck cares about your precious nickel being wasted?

All of our Senators should be made to go over there and begin to put an end to this madness.

After all, a lot of these guys are the same bastards that gave Bush the authority to start this fucking war maybe now they'll end it if they are all forced and bullied to go there and witness the mess they got us into.

Fuck your outrage. Tell it to the Marines!

And I'd be asking the same thing of any other candidate who was putting schools and small businesses on the hook due to their inability to manage their finances.

Our tax dollars are paying for your social worker, after all.

I hear he's got a sweet connection in Miami and he's going to sell a couple kilos to this Caribbean dude....goes by the name of Cooper

Why are you trying to ruin your reputation on DU??? Is it worth it to trash the Dem nominee???

Edit: Where is your link stating that he is going to Iraq? Please don't tell me you are LYING to trash the Dem nominee. That is really low.

this country...repub, dem or indie..and not just in Iraq.

who went to Iraq? You seem very concerned about how your tax dollars are being spent. That is a good thing. You seem to be only worried about how they are spent by Obama though, that is why you are now in a flame war. Show me the threads where you complained about John McCain going to Iraq, or Lieberman, Pelosi, Graham, or any of the other dozens of senators who have been there this past year.

And for all I know Obama is paying for this trip out of his campaign fund. You haven't offered any proof that Obama is charging tax payers for this. Maybe you ought to wait till the deed is done before complaining about it.

Obama is (1) the nominee and (2) is on the Senate Foreign Relations Committee... surely you'd expect him to go to Iraq like other countries where he's been...

Get a grip.

or maybe his scary pastor will kill some white people to raise the cash. You just don't know with these silly Negroes!

:eyes:

would be a drop in the bucket compared to that.

campaign funds pay for travel and other such things. :shrug:

just like we pay for the autos that ALL reps drive.

or is it different because he is running for Pres?

Or threaten DUers.

:wtf:

it's not a fucking vacation.

That's the way it works, I guess.