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Obama would have won by even more in Iowa if Edwards was out of the race

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zulchzulu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-11-08 10:06 AM
Original message
Obama would have won by even more in Iowa if Edwards was out of the race
Edited on Mon Aug-11-08 10:06 AM by zulchzulu
Just when you thought we could move on from the Edwards scandal, we now have former Hillary Clinton staffers like Wolfson and Carville saying that if Edwards had dropped out, Hillary Clinton would have been the nominee.

This is not only petulant, desperate and specious, but it is also incredibly incorrect.

Wolfson commented:

Obama won 37.6 per cent of the vote. Edwards won 29.7 per cent and Clinton won 29.5 per cent, according to results posted by the Iowa Democratic Party.

"Our voters and Edwards' voters were the same people," Wolfson said the Clinton polls showed. "They were older, pro-union. Not all, but maybe two-thirds of them would have been for us and we would have barely beaten Obama."

http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/story?id=5553013&page=1


First of all, Hillary Clinton's Iowa campaign was not fully in track until late in the game. As one who spent a good deal of time personally in Iowa before the caucus, people who supported Obama or Edwards were not supporters of Hillary Clinton. To say or imply that if Edwards was out of the picture that they would have gone to Hillary Clinton is based on abject hallucinations.

Secondly, Wolfson's assessment is like saying that the a football team woud have easily beaten the other if it hadn't snowed that day. It is curiously subjective and intellectually dishonest to assess.

If John Kerry had stayed in the race, would Hillary have dropped out? One could say so and argue such a point.

If Bill Richardson was a Swedish woman with a Miss Universe body, he (or in this silly example, she) would have gotten the male and female vote.

If Dennis Kucinich looked like Robert Redford 15 years ago and had a booming voice like Huey Long, he would be the nominee right now.

As for Iowa and union endorsements, look no further that to Dick Gephardt in 2004, who had the absolute lion's share of union endorsements. He dropped out of the race on Iowa Caucus night.

This tattered "shoulda, coulda, woulda" garbage from Carville and Wolfson is sophmorically concocted and nothing more than the mutterings of congenital bores.



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BlooInBloo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-11-08 10:11 AM
Response to Original message
1. hahaha! Clinton people trying to make their candidate look better by trashing Edwards. Typical.
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elehhhhna Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-11-08 12:35 PM
Response to Reply #1
12. & still telling tales. Geez. HRC et al GO AWAY ALREADY.
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liberalmuse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-11-08 10:14 AM
Response to Original message
2. What is the point?
What's done is done. We'll never know, will we?

Kennedy ran for President even though he had numerous extramarital affairs under his belt. I'm glad he did.

I'll tell you what I've learned, don't ever have DUer's turn on you. They'll be MUCH worse enemies than Republicans. Some people here are heartless.
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LaurenG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-11-08 10:14 AM
Response to Original message
3. No, no, no. This is just the two camps refighting the primary wars.
Delusion and denial run deep in some staffers brains. It's over.
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Eric J in MN Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-11-08 10:22 AM
Response to Original message
4. I agree. Edwards and Obama split the votes of people who wanted..
..an alternative to Hillary Clinton.
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TexasObserver Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-11-08 10:40 AM
Response to Original message
5. Yes, definitely.
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ErinBerin84 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-11-08 10:41 AM
Response to Original message
6. Didn't Iowa have a lot of anti-war sentiment ? I think Obama still would have won as well.
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trumad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-11-08 10:44 AM
Response to Original message
7. Ahhh teh Irony
Hillary lost because John couldn't keep it in his pants---- couldn't Al Gore use the same excuse?
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BeyondGeography Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-11-08 10:49 AM
Response to Original message
8. Richardson would have been unstoppable as a Swedish woman, IMO
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Arnold Judas Rimmer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-11-08 12:44 PM
Response to Reply #8
16. Until she quit the race and joined ABBA
:rofl:
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JoFerret Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-11-08 11:00 AM
Response to Original message
9. Let's keep venom alive
by posting and reposting tripe.

(Better idea -work to get Obama and other dems elected.)
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zulchzulu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-11-08 11:06 AM
Response to Reply #9
10. Agreed...
I put 15 hours this weekend on grassroots stuff for Obama and the Dems. What Wolfson and Carville are doing is absolutely counterproductive to all of our efforts.

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zulchzulu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-11-08 11:51 AM
Response to Original message
11. Interesting blog flashback
Titled "Edwards, Rielle Hunter Alleged Love Child Sex Scandal: Clintons Behind Rumors
Some Say John Edwards, Rielle Hunter Sex Scandal Is Work of Clintons

http://www.bloggernews.net/112505

Then there's Politico:

What the tabloid’s readers, in politics and out, may not know is that a key owner of the Enquirer is a prominent New York investment banker and one of Hillary Clinton’s key backers, Roger Altman. Altman was an official in the first Clinton administration, and his name is often mentioned as a possible Clinton Treasury Secretary.

http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/1007/The_Clintonite_who_owns_National_Enquirer.html



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nsd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-11-08 12:39 PM
Response to Original message
13. Yes.
Also, Obama might have won NH -- and effectively closed out the race early -- if Edwards hadn't been around.

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barack the house Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-11-08 12:41 PM
Response to Original message
14. It always, if and maybe. He ran but it wasn't out of a plan to assist Obama,...
Edited on Mon Aug-11-08 12:48 PM by barack the house
bizarre. If Edwards ran he did as he felt he could win at the time not that he had some far out plan to change the primary result very peculiar conclusion .
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Marrah_G Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-11-08 12:44 PM
Response to Original message
15. Who the fuck cares? the primary is over, Obama won.
More shit to fight about instead of focusing on the GOP?
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zulchzulu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-11-08 08:19 PM
Response to Reply #15
17. Tell that to Wolfson and Carville
They are sore losers. Period.
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AtomicKitten Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-11-08 09:12 PM
Response to Original message
18. You are correct, sir.
Turns out the Clinton Kabuki Theater has one last performance in them before the convention.
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Life Long Dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-11-08 09:22 PM
Response to Original message
19. The media is playing it up for Clinton over this BS
Obama could have been saying what the OP is about all along but the media sings a different song. It was said that most Edwards supporters went to Obama. So what is the story?
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anonymous171 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-11-08 09:23 PM
Response to Original message
20. They are stuck in the late primary demographic slicing mode.
Early in the primary it was more about ideas and pandering and less about hard working white Americans.
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Top Cat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-11-08 09:32 PM
Response to Original message
21. I agree
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