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Can we have a little discussion about Palin's religious beliefs?

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LeftyMom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 04:55 PM
Original message
Can we have a little discussion about Palin's religious beliefs?
Edited on Fri Aug-29-08 04:56 PM by LeftyMom
I think there's some reflection there about who she is, what she believes, and why she's not qualified to represent anybody, well, sane.

Let's start with the basics: She's Assemblies of God. Same as John Ashcroft, the Bakkers, Jimmy Swaggart and Benny Hinn, if you're wondering why that sounds familiar. The AG is the most prominent Pentecostal denomination, which means members routinely "speak in tongues" (babble which they may believe to be divinely inspired) are "slain in the spirit" (feinting or falling down after a blessing) etc. As you might have guessed by Hinn's membership, they're big believers in miraculous healing, though not generally anti-medicine. Rapture theology is a big part of their belief system as well (officially, not as an unofficial infiltration at the congregation level, as in many mainline protestant churches.)

As far as women go, they preach the usual fundamentalist stuff about women being "helpmeets" (they're using that word wrong, but whatever) to their husbands and that he should lead the family as Jesus leads the Church, though the AG is one of the few conservative churches to ordain women, and deserves some credit for that. Some AG churches, especially in rural areas, may be more restrictive and discourage women from cutting their hair, wearing pants, etc and and may encourage them to "cover" in public, wearing scarves or old-style hats on their heads for reasons not dissimilar theologically or socially from muslimas wearing of headscarves. Other churches may have relatively modern teachings on women, though there's generally an emphasis on marrying young and having lots o' babies for Jesus.

The church has its origins in the split of white Pentecostals from the racially inclusive Church of God in Christ to establish their own denomination.

Anyhow, here's their own words about what they believe:

http://ag.org/top/Beliefs/index.cfm
http://ag.org/top/Beliefs/Statement_of_Fundamental_Truths/sft_full.cfm#2
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Breeze54 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 04:57 PM
Response to Original message
1. She believes that 'creationism' should be taught in schools!! ... "nuff said!!
Edited on Fri Aug-29-08 04:57 PM by Breeze54
She's a freaking wacko! :crazy:
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LeftyMom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 04:59 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. Yes, the AG is in favor of biblical literalism, except when they're not.
Like most churches, it comes down to this: the bible is literal and infallible when it's convenient.
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here_is_to_hope Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 05:47 PM
Response to Reply #1
18. Your are just mad cuz
yer Jesus rode a slow Dinosaur!




Do I need one?
:sarcasm: :hide:
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Overseas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 06:50 PM
Response to Reply #1
24. That is alarming to me as well. And the rapture stuff. //nt
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-30-08 02:30 AM
Response to Reply #1
32. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
cliffordu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-30-08 02:36 AM
Response to Reply #32
33. Except when they think blowing up the planet brings back Jaysus and
all the non believers get the hot lead enema.


Go prosthelytize yourself.
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obamican Donating Member (28 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-30-08 03:05 AM
Response to Reply #1
35. So we're courting evangelicals?
And Obama has proposed 500 million extra dollars to faith based charities; and you're attacking AOG?

Not everyone in AOG is crazy.

They are very passionate christians.

There are very many passionate Muslims; if you started attacking them; it would be called racism.

The whole thing is silly. Attack her personal beleifs; her positions. Do not attack her because she's associated with a church that has a generally acceptable repute in the christian world.


Thats just a logical fallacy of the grosest kind.
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Breeze54 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-30-08 01:48 PM
Response to Reply #35
37. She's a freak and you support her?
Enjoy that pizza!
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billyoc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 04:59 PM
Response to Original message
3. I couldn't tell from their literature if they're Young Earth Creationists, do you know?
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LeftyMom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 05:01 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. Yes.
VERY socially conservative and heavily involved in GOP politics.
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billyoc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 05:18 PM
Response to Reply #4
11. So their not just Creationists, but specifically YEC's? I don't mean to be a nudge,
but that's actually an issue with some voters.
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LeftyMom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 05:21 PM
Response to Reply #11
13. I don't know if they have an official stand on the national level
As I said elsewhere on the thread, the AG is not a very centralized church and local control can lead to a lot of variation in belief on the regional and even congregational level (the lack of national control also makes it a haven for weirdos and scam artists) but I don't know of any AG church leaders who aren't YECs.
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flvegan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 05:02 PM
Response to Original message
5. K&R
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LeftyMom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 05:05 PM
Response to Reply #5
6. That loony child molesting revival guy down in your neck of the woods is also AG.
Maybe we should play the "denounce and reject" card, since they had so much fun with it in the Primary. But she could keep talking without sleep between now and election day, and couldn't distance herself from every prominent AG whackaloon, scam artist or racist scumfuck, because they're the go-to denomination for all three, due to very low centralized control.
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Abacus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 05:08 PM
Response to Original message
7. "She's Assemblies of God"
Edited on Fri Aug-29-08 05:14 PM by Abacus
Yikes. I attended a private elementary school that was associated with an Assembly of God church and can confidently say that they're whacked.

Edit: #6 reminded me, We even had our own child molester, ousted a few years before I attended.
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derby378 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 05:10 PM
Response to Original message
8. Locking
No sects threads.

:hide:
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Greyskye Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 05:30 PM
Response to Reply #8
16. .
:spank:



:rofl:
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kestrel91316 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 05:13 PM
Response to Original message
9. She comes from Sandpoint, ID, home of neonazis galore.
She belongs to an essentially "whites-only" church. I asked it earlier, and I still want to know: WAS SHE RAISED BY RACISTS?
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depakid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 05:24 PM
Response to Reply #9
14. Those were my exact thoughts when I heard about that
Hopefully, we'll get some background that sheds some light on that possibility.
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kestrel91316 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 05:45 PM
Response to Reply #14
17. Sandpoint, ID always sets off alarm bells for me.
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depakid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 06:28 PM
Response to Reply #17
21. There's a reason why Mark Fuhrman retired there....
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kestrel91316 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 06:44 PM
Response to Reply #21
23. EXACTLY.
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LeftyMom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 07:40 PM
Response to Reply #9
29. This Kos diary from a local says her town in AK is also EXTREMELY white.
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/8/29/19534/4063/266/579434

"Demographically, the town is almost exclusively white. I didn't realize this, until I left and went to university in New Jersey. There is, or at least was, a stunning lack of diversity, even for Alaska. It is is extremely religious, primarily baptist judging from the many churches, tucked away into every nook and cranny. It is also extremely politically conservative, and is consistently a republican stronghold. Characteristically, it is also economically depressed, and is dependent on low-quality resource extraction, and the service industry, for the vast majority of local jobs."
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derby378 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 09:22 PM
Response to Reply #9
30. Does the name "Sheldon Emry" ring a bell?
I snatched up one of his Identity booklets nine years ago at a Preparedness Expo. Lots of crazy stuff at those things, including anti-Semitic literature, nerve gas recipes, quack medicine, field obstetric kits and medical ice packs "colder than Janet Reno's heart," the whole nine yards. More than a little creepy.
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Motown_Johnny Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 05:17 PM
Response to Original message
10. OK, now we need Rick Warren to hold a forum with the RC and the AG VP nominees
Edited on Fri Aug-29-08 05:18 PM by Motown_Johnny
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ismnotwasm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 05:18 PM
Response to Original message
12. I didn't know that about her
I used to kinda like AG church (I'm not religious, I didn't actually GO to their church)when I lived in a small town, they always had kid's activities and would pick up children to go fishing or whatever.

Their take on the Chistain faith was fundelmentalist and very, very strange in it's own right. It's the proto-type for these "mega-churches" that seem to be infesting communities all over the place (Many of the mega-churches have questionable funding sources in dubya's administation)

It figures when all is said. She doesn't seem to be wrapped too tight, 'bout what I expect from them
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Ashy Larry Donating Member (900 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 05:27 PM
Response to Original message
15. Benny Hinn!
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AZBlue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 05:48 PM
Response to Original message
19. McCain/Palin REALLY IS a repeat of Bush/Cheney.
They're going down!
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Critters2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-30-08 02:25 AM
Response to Reply #19
31. Bush and Cheney are both United Methodist. nt
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undeterred Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 05:49 PM
Response to Original message
20. Speaks in tongues and doesn't believe in fossil fuels
If the earth was just created, there can be no fossils. But, but...
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noel711 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 06:29 PM
Response to Original message
22. I thought JOhn Ashcroft was an episcopal priest???
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LeftyMom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 07:03 PM
Response to Reply #22
25. No, he's Assemblies of God. His father and grandfather were ministers in that denomination.
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noel711 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 07:29 PM
Response to Reply #25
27. Sorry.. I was thinking John Danforth
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sampsonblk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 07:22 PM
Response to Original message
26. K & R - very good work, and very informative-nt
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aint_no_life_nowhere Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 07:30 PM
Response to Original message
28. Does she have prayer sessions in her living room with Crisco annointments like Ashcroft?
Edited on Fri Aug-29-08 07:31 PM by aint_no_life_nowhere
I wonder if she takes things as far as Ashcroft, who used to have his forehead annointed with oil (he chose Crisco) when something important happened to him in life. Maybe she's drenched in Crisco tonight, in fact.

I believe she is strongly in favor of home schooling and probably dislikes the secular public schools.
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mwb970 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-30-08 03:14 AM
Response to Reply #28
36. No wonder the Freepers love her so much.
She sounds like a 110% right-wing, full-bore Christian wacko who hits every cliche of conservative idiocy.
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Douglas Carpenter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-30-08 02:45 AM
Response to Original message
34. Sarah Palin: Dominionist Stalking Horse
On a personal note, let me say that I have frequently strongly defended Evangelical Christians on this forum and have condemned thoughtless bigotry based on peoples religious beliefs.

However, this is different. Sarah Palin seems to be deeply involved with extremist religious groups with a very dangerous political agenda.

I STRONGLY RECOMMEND READING THIS WHOLE ARTICLE AT DAILY KOS AND SENDING IT TO EVERYONE ON YOUR E-MAIL LIST AND POSTING IT EVERYWHERE AND ANYWHERE

From Daily Kos:



Sarah Palin: Dominionist Stalking Horse

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/8/29/163234/559/495/579213

Sarah Palin's connections that McCain doesn't want you to know about



There are quite a number of extremely troubling links between Sarah Palin and neopentecostal dominionists--enough that, in truth, she may be ultimately as much of a "dream candidate" for the dominionist movement as Mike Huckabee was. Even worse, she's running in a manner that has been frighteningly successful for dominionist groups since the early 80's--specifically, as a "stealth candidate".

snip: In a trend that has been recently documented by no less than Southern Poverty Law Center (in its recent report on the Joel's Army movement), the church operates a Seven Project-esque targeted recruitment campaign aiming at teens (this is common across the Assemblies and across "Joel's Army" groups in general; fully a third of the documented national-level front groups operated by the Assemblies target teens).

And...believe you me, Palin's church is definitely "Joel's Army".

Mike Rose, pastor of Juneau Christian Center (Palin's church), is noted to be connected with the "Third Wave Movement"--a movement in neopente dominionist circles that is the major theological home of "Joel's Army". In fact, he's quite closely connected with Rodney Howard-Browne, a major (in fact, for some years, the major promoter) of "Third Wave" neopente dominionism, and actively promotes this insanity in his church:

snip:" It also appears that Sarah Palin is a member of a misnamed group called Feminists for Life. FFL in fact engages in "cultural appropriation" of women's suffrage icons to promote a very woman-unfriendly agenda that--despite attempts to sound "not like those crazies in Operation Rescue"--would not only criminalise abortion but the IUD and hormonal birth control methods, and potentially everything outside the rhythm method (the term "abortifacient birth control" is a codephrase in the dominionist "pro-life" community for hormonal birth control--partly due to a unique urban legend claiming "the pill" and other hormonal birth control causes abortion and partly because of a unique definition of pregnancy beginning at conception rather than at implantation (the latter is what most mainstream OB/GYNs use) and thus making anything preventing implantation potentially "abortifacient").

snip:"One of the big things FFL promotes is deceptive "pregnancy counseling centers"--where pregnant teens are forced to essentially listen to an altar call on how "abortionists want to murder their children" whilst a pee-stick test clears--and if she tests "yes", she gets a hard-sell to keep the child or to check herself into a dominionist-run "halfway house for teenage moms" where she will ultimately be forced to sign her kid over. (Yes, there is an entire private adoption industry in the dominionist community--mostly focusing on adopting out the infants of poor teenage mothers who have been forced to give their kids up and who have been either scared into it or checked into such facilities by their parents.)

Ironically, FFL itself is rather a "stealth" organisation in and of itself--yes, even the dominionists admit this. Interestingly, despite their claims of being more "moderate" than most anti-abortion groups, very few real solutions are offered on how they intend to fund such things (which can be boiled down to "CHOOSE TO BREED").

Palin's links with Campus Crusade frontgroups

Palin's linkages don't stop there. In Kaylene Johnson's book Sarah: How a Hockey Mom Turned Alaska's Political Establishment Upside Down (2008, Epicenter Press) it's mentioned that Palin was head of the local Fellowship of Christian Athletes branch in her school--up to and including leading team prayers.

It is helpful to know a bit of FCA's past history to know why this is a matter of concern. FCA is, in fact, a known frontgroup of the coercive dominionist group Campus Crusade for Christ--yes, the selfsame Campus Crusade that has such close links to the Assemblies of God that it can be described as a "conjoined twin" of the Assemblies and the same one documented as having links to an ever-widening prosyletisation scandal in our Armed Forces. FCA also gets quite a lot of cash from de facto Assemblies funding-front Hobby Lobby--a chain, of note, that has bailed out a neopente university and has even funded paramilitary "Joel's Army" groups targeting teens.

The links between FCA and a particular Hobby Lobby frontgroup, Bearing Fruit Communications, are particularly close. At least one member of Bearing Fruit's board of directors (T. Ray Grandstaff) is a former Senior VP for Fellowship of Christian Athletes.

Regarding FCA itself, the group has been linked to dominionism in numerous ways; they are well known for "bait and switch" evangelism (in fact, they and Athletes in Action are among the two groups most frequently banned from public school campuses due to bait-and-switch "altar calls" marketed as anti-drug talks to the school administration). More info here. (Such tactics are a favourite of dominionist groups explicitly targeting youth.) It's also well known (and, apparently, explicitly by design) that Fellowship of Christian Athletes rather aggressively "dominionist-ises" any team they are let into (this tends to be bad even within the NFL, but even more so within FCA groups run in colleges and high schools).

Of particular note, FCA has close links with the US Air Force Academy religious coercion controversies (and is but one of multiple Campus Crusade frontgroups documented by Military Religious Freedom Foundation as involved in military religious coercion scandals), and the ACLU has had to fight them since the 60's because of religious coercion (in particular, Jewish people tend to be targeted, according to the anti-cult group Rick Ross Foundation); in addition, it is explicitly supported by dominionist groups, and explicitly partners with other dominionist groups targeting youth (including Chi Alpha (an Assemblies of God frontgroup), Campus Crusade for Christ, and even scarier groups like "See You At The Pole" (infamous for, among other things, nailing people's names to crosses and "praying" over them to essentially curse people in the name of Christ to convert or suffer) and Council for National Policy)."

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/8/29/163234/559/495/579213



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kath Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-30-08 02:38 PM
Response to Reply #34
38. Kck - thanks for your thread. People REALLY need to read up on these Dominionists - scary, scary
stuff.

How many people know that one of the largest "character" programs, "Character First!" was started by a whackjob Dominionist/Reconstructionist named Bill Gothard? It has its tentacles in a HUGE number of not only schools, but **city governments**. If your town is a "City of Character", it's been Gothard-ized.
EEK.
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