Some of us think it's a STRATEGICALLY STUPID move to keep harping on this baby

Not that we don't want to attack Palin.

We do.

Not that we want to play nice with Republicans.

We don't.

But there are far better ways to attack her which will lead to real people and real voters questioning McCain's judgement in choosing her.

Attack her for being a far rightwing extremist on social issues and energy policy.

Attack her for "troopergate" which has the potential to actually be a credible story.

Attack her for having no experience and qualifications to run this nation, a virtually laughable choice by John McCain.

But don't pursue a bizarre personal story with no foundation in fact. It gives rightwing news outlets, such as Fixed News, the opportunity to report that "far leftwing blogs" are pushing a ridiculous, crazed character assassination story, which then enables them to portray Palin a victim of the nutty, evil blogosphere.

Fixed News runs at gyms, bars, doctor's offices and beauty salons. Independents watch it, and the story they will take away from this is that internet bullies are attacking Palin's innocent Downs Syndrome baby.

Attack her, by all means.

But attack her with substance and credibility.

Or attack her with potential scandals that could potentially resonate.

Don't attack her with absurd personal rumors that could backfire on our candidates.

The point of this campaign is to elect Barack Obama and Joe Biden, remember?

Think like smart strategists, not screaming children.

Which issues need more buzz?

(Sorry about the 'gate's... faster way to list them all.)

this is a bad idea but human nature is what it is.

we need to hammer on the other issues.

Sorry!

Okie dokey

:shrug:
It just makes more sense to kick threads that are talking about her environmental record, positions on issues etc. and let the baby ones sink, if this is your view? Instead of starting thread number 3555566 about the baby, while scolding others, which imo does not help.

Most people don't respond well to scolding. I think the baby thing is stupid too, so I kick threads about her positions on issues. These generalized scoldings perhaps targeting a small, vociferously trollish minority on DU, but which are addressed to all of DU come across as attention-seeking and condescending. If you want something to die out, stop kicking threads on it. Scolding rarely works..

And I will follow my own advice and not kick any more of these baby threads and this IS yet another baby thread.

It is WHO they are.

isn't "scolding". But I realize you're very angry about being called out on past issues, so let it all out.

Classic example.

that you are willing to stay and take the heat for being reasonable.

Yup yup yup and absolutely.

Besides, if the baby story is true, the National Enquirer will figure it out. For us, it's a waste of time.

This goes to the issue of credibility. If she lied to protect her daughter, but then took the fundie credit for "carrying pregnancy to term," she is as much a liar as she has been on trooper-gate.

:think:

Coincidence. GOP types trying to stir the pot on a divisive, irrelevant issue?

to be won...is when not a soldier dies....

Use COMMON SENSE, REASON, and LOGIC

McCain and Crew can get revenge, make themselves HEROs by joining the GOOD GUYs...

McCain/Palin should make Themselves real Heros and join Obama by conceding in the interest of National Unity

Better than bitter defeat

Play the Odds as they do in Texas Hold um Poker

He has it in his hands to GET UNITY to fix the Nation...and himself at the same time...History would do him GOOD

why try to stem it. I like the new media hounds of our citizen reporters.

But the flying while in labor/only three days off after giving birth story is open for criticism and conjecture, because this is the story that Palin uses to brag about herself. Palin and the GOP want to make her mommyhood a central feature of her qualifications to be VP--and some of us are saying, maybe she's not as great a mommy as she portrays herself. We are playing on HER field--bearing children is one of her rationales for being VP. So it's fair to examine that.

DUers are simply trying to vet it. I believe it is plausible for a variety of reasons which I would be happy to share with you.

However, if it IS true, she is shown once again a remarkable lack of judgment. Her abstinence only education stance would have failed and in a most personal and profund way.

IF this is true, and I personally do believe it could be, she put that daughter through Hell and back. Poor parenting. Poor judgment.

AND, speaking of poor judgment, she announced to the entire world that Track would be deploying to Iraq on 9/11/2008, thereby endangering his entire unit.

Poor parenting. Poor judgment.

And, don't get me started on the flight from TX after her water broke. Allegedly, of course.

and then show that it showed very poor judgment to fly to make a speech so late into her pregnancy. That is a legitimate criticism. No need to speculate on whether or not she is the mother of the child.

:kick:

by stoking curiosity and furthering the narrative.

Rec.

the people screeching about this baby stuff come off as unhinged nut jobs. I don't give a shit if there are a bazillion
threads about it because I don't believe in stifling discussion BUT, IMO, it's BORING esoterica and akin to going off the deep end like some 9-11 truthers often do. Besides, Obama is going to win anyway without focusing on this rumor.

Yeah, because they never work? :eyes: Those "Obama is a Muslim" rumors did have some affect. At the very least, this puts McCain's camp on defense in their race to define Palin to the American people.

in 2004 that disputed Kerry's Purple Hearts? Some Swift boaters with band aids or something?


:sarcasm:

Gloves Off. Fuck Palin.

Only 65 days left until the election. We should hope that she has to spend a few of those days talking about Grandma-gate.

if there is anything to the story the Enquirer will open their check book and get to the bottom of it.

send your tips to the enquirer.

You have given this opinion in every post you've made on the topic, so why do you think you need to issue an official paper on it? We get it. You disagree. So what?

good thing I don't tailor my words to meet your approval.

You are free to move along and stop obsessing about those of us who ARE going to discuss this subject until we're damn good and ready to talk about something else.

getting the memo that you dictate what I write.

Cause you don't.

See ya.

isn't it a crime to falsify this kind of information? Wouldn't she be guilty of fraud (like insurance fraud)? I don't care on a personal level what she did. But if she isn't the mother, then it looks to me like she broke the law, and not one that's like speeding.

If not, they paid cash. If so, there are records.

My sympathy goes to the daughter, no matter what's going on. If she is the mother, I'm sorry she's been stripped of that identity. She's in the middle of a political and ethical maelstrom.

baby would go off the parents' insurance, which would certainly be rough on a young woman with a special needs baby.

Friends of mine had a daughter who waited until she turned 23 to marry her long term live-in boyfriend, because they had a baby when she was 19, and her parents' insurance covered all costs for the young maother and her baby until she reached the 23 cut-off age. Since the baby turned out to have a high risk of SIDS and needed a monitor during his first year of life, the fact that she and her infant son were on her parents insurance may well have saved him from dying from SIDS.

I wondered, with insurance coverage becoming more and more restricted, whether the expense of pregnancy and care for a Down Syndrome infant would be covered.

Your friends' daughter is fortunate that they have supported her under difficult circumstances. :thumbsup:

:nopity:

Please, O wise one, tell us how else we can play nice with Republicans, because that has worker out SO well in the past. We need your omniscience to help us know what should be "off limits" because ruggerson said so.

Give me a fucking break.

As long as the National Enquirer checks it out and if true, does to Palin what they did to Edwards... then we have the freedom to focus on the real issues... In fact the focus should remain on McCain--he is the real issue--Palin is almost a diversion... And then if the Enquirer drags the MSM into the slime--it's not our problem...

if (as i suspect) this whole stupid theory is shot down as patently false, what we end up looking like is a bunch of desperate conspiracy theorists who attacked her fundamentally on the basis of womanhood, giving the middle-of-the-roaders an opening for closing ranks around her as a woman unfairly attacked.

it's stupid and counterproductive and, unfortunately, a sad facet of the MO of democratic underground.

You are making the same mistake as the people who, upon reading DU in the Primaries, said "I think the 'Obama Posters' are mean and arrogant and he'll never get my vote!"

It's a stupid, unworthy logical fallacy and is simply used by people who were looking for an excuse to not vote in that direction anyway.

Okay? Enough with the posts conflating anonymous DU posters with the Obama Campaign. It's D-U-M-B.

instead of responding to something I didn't write.

I'm not saying we are the Obama campaign. They wouldn't touch this with a ten foot pole.

I'm saying that some in the MSM comment on what we, the blogosphere, write about.

If we obsess on something absurd, Fox News will inevitably report that "leftwing" bloggers are attacking Palin's Down's syndrome child.

Like it or not, the MSM reads Kos and us and then reports on what we're writing about.

Next time, take the time to read the OP before responding to it.

Right or wrong, you can't control what people do on the internet.

on Palin should start by questioning John McCain's judgement, his age and health by selecting her in the first place. McCain is the enemy here, start there and emphasize his total lack of judgement and lack of putting the country first.

I think McCain is pushing the babygate story so that we fall into the trap. Troopergate is the real story and there is plenty of proof she lied. Soon we will have Hannity and O liely talking about the wacko leftie bloggers who are trying to trash this woman. They will show endless loops of her family and will prove that the baby is hers. They will try to tie these rumors to Obama.

Most people at DU don't understand rural Alaska and the way health care works in this state. More than half the state does not live within driving distance to hospitals and they fly for care or talk to docs long distance. Many villages don't even have running water and would seem third world to people in the lower 48. These rural Alaskans are voters and Palin wants to keep them from seeing her as an elitist. These folks pride themselves on keeping life simple and think modern/white man ways are wrong.

Some people are questioning why Palin went to a small town doctor at a tiny hospital. The hospital Palin had the baby in opened in 2006 and is fully modern and high tech located in Wasilla, a suburb of Anchorage.

I believe she threw in the long plane ride after water broke to beef up rural creds and spice up the story. The doctor who delivered the baby was a highly respected family doctor who has delivered thousands of babies and fully qualified. This doctor has said she induced Palin upon her arrival so there is a discrepancy.

She probably did lie about the water breaking in Texas, but she is a liar not a grandmother.

Rather than simply bitching about "unfair" attacks?

home decor and gasp, the baby could be half eskimo, or other cultural differences, insults all Alaskans whom from what I can tell don't like her either. Stick to the facts that she has been a failure at every political venue she has tried so far and that she has ties to a religion that won't recognize separation of church and state.

The same urge that drove rabid Hillary and Obama supporters to attack each other (even though doing so was unproductive, even harmful to both candidates) drives people to pursue the craziest conspiracy attacks against Republicans, even when going down that road will end up doing damage to their own party.

Some people don't care. They can't help themselves. All you can really do is speak your piece and wait for the madness to pass.