Palin - Did or did she not try to ban books?

Factcheck.org says not. I can't keep track any more, but I could have sworn that I read it in a reputable news source. Anyone know?

At some point in those fractious first days, Palin told the department heads they needed her permission to talk to reporters. "She put a gag order on those people, something that you'd expect to find in the big city, not here," says Naegele. "She flew in there like a big-city gal, which she's not. It was a strange time, and came out very harshly against her."

Stein says that as mayor, Palin continued to inject religious beliefs into her policy at times. "She asked the library how she could go about banning books," he says, because some voters thought they had inappropriate language in them. "The librarian was aghast." That woman, Mary Ellen Baker, couldn't be reached for comment, but news reports from the time show that Palin had threatened to fire Baker for not giving "full support" to the mayor.

http://www.time.com/time/politics/article/0,8599,1837918,00.html

That's doing.

:eyes:

so she couldn't replace the good librarian with a religious nut.

So the true story is that Palin tried to ban books, but was unsuccessful.

She asked about it and got pissed at the librarian.

There was NO attempt to take one book off the shelves. This is the kind of false bullshit we need to stay away from. Go after her on the lying about bridge to nowhere, the jet on ebay business, and troopergate. Those are legitimate.

But, if you go around saying Palin tried to ban books you will not be taken seriously because it's flat out not true. She did not do it.

This story will only gain traction as being an Obama-created smear which will backfire. We don't need it.

who would not agree to ban books.

This is pointless, if you can't see what happened from all the reports nothing will convince you. Palin is a very dangerous person, as this story demonstrates.

You may have the last word.

That's all. Nothing more. The librarian was reinstated, too. This does not make her dangerous. What makes her dangerous, IMO, is her absoluteness on abortion and abstinence-only education.

Not some question about banning books.

Twisting the truth serves no one.

According to coverage in the local newspaper, the Frontiersman, Palin asked the librarian at a meeting "if she would object to censorship even if people were circling the library in protest about a book."

The report quotes the librarian as responding, "I told her clearly I will fight anyone who tries to indicate what books can go on the library shelves."
...............

The local newspaper reporter who covered the controversy, Paul Stuart, claims he was later told by the librarian that Palin wanted three specific books removed from the library.

In her statement to ABC News, the librarian said, "I am unable to dispute or substantiate the information Paul Stuart provided to you."
.................

After she got her job back, Baker spent two more years in Wasilla before leaving for a library job in Fairbanks.


She would not address her reasons for leaving Wasilla, but friends say she felt badly treated by Mayor Palin.

http://www.abcnews.go.com/Blotter/story?id=5766173&page=1

Palin clearly realized the stupidity of such a move and she backed down.

I'm innocent of wrongdoing?

Interesting concept.

Asking a question is not the same as doing. You can't see the difference? :wtf:

would you be open to banning books?

Librarian said no fucking way, librarian was fired shortly after.

Palin asked for her resignation but the people came to her defense, and the matter was dropped. That's my recollection, anyway.

Probably with no loss of pay for the time that she was "fired".

it. The Librarian said NO! Then Palin either called for or was thinking of calling for the Librarian's resignation, a flap ensued, and the matter was dropped.

It never got to the point of any discussion of particular books.

But the whole story shows how nutty Palin is.

I was just corrected about my statement that the Librarian wasn't fired (I guess she was, and rehired right back) -- but I don't want to be less than accurate so I'd appreciate it if you could tell me where I'm off. Or if you have a link, I could even read it myself. :7

any specific books, but has made very limited comments.

The reporter does recall that Palin wanted three books removed.

that same librarian. It never got beyond that, but that's scary enough for me.

Basically, when she was elected mayor of Wasilla, she met with the librarian on two seperate occasions and asked her "What would you do if I asked you take certain books off of the shelves"? The Librarian on both occasions said she would not take them off the shelves. Palin then asked "What if people were protesting a certain book in the streets, then would you take it off the shelf"? The Librarian said "NO, in fact I would involve the ACLU".

Palin then fired her as part of a mass firing of all of her reports - and then re-hired her. Some say she was "forced" to re-hire her due to backlash - but that can't be proven.

Also, there was never a specific book or book list discussed - it was all very hypothetical.

town librarian, who was saved only by strong community support.

what she (the librarian) would do if Palin asked her to ban books, and the librarian said she wouldn't do it. The librarian was later asked to resign because she didn't fully support the mayor.

So, technically, all she did was feel out the librarian on the issue of book banning, which isn't the same as actually banning books.

I think. Someone correct me if I'm wrong.

Snopes has it all written out.

It's scary enough to sane Americans that she wanted to.

is false, which it is not.

Facts don't matter.

was to ask the town Librarian "how would someone go about getting some books removed". Then she attempted to fire the librarian when she was told that there was no procedure for removing books at the mayors request. She fired some other city workers for "not having supported the mayor" (although this was only a few days into her tenure). There was an "outcry" from the public over these firings (Unclear in what form this "outcry" took). She rehired the librarian... and shortly after a city manager was hired to run day to day operations for the town.

These are all the facts.

The list of books being passed around as "books Sarah wanted banned" is bogus and is likely an operation of Rove/McCain/Palin dirty tricksters trying to obscure the original facts with false and misleading details. Provably false details such as including books not yet published when the incident took place. Prove the details false and then claim that entire story is false. Sort of like a memo that Dan Rather used in a story on GWB. The story was accurate but the memo was a forgery and provably so (and, surprise, proved within 24 hours of Rather's use of the memo).

Have I told anyone recently how much I *hate* these bastards. (props to Mike)

And yes, Palin did try to ban books at the Wasilla library. She didn't get around to making an exact list of books to be banned, but she did try to fire the librarian that objected to her book-banning proposal.

a couple occasions. The librarian was indeed fired but was rehired after supporters came to her defense. The firing came about, along with several other people who lost their jobs, because Palin demanded loyalty.

The list smacks of Rove. Put out a list so it can be debunked and then the real story is ignored.

related the firing to the librarian's stand about censorship.

But you need a media that's asleep at the wheel for that to work.

Lucky for them.

The "list" is irrelevant; it's bogus.

It is inarguable fact, acknowledeged by ALL parties involved, that she approached the librarian on multiple occassions asking how she would respond if she were asked to ban books. It is inarguable fact that she terminated this librarian after the librarian responded that she would resists any effort to ban books, and that she was re-instated only after public outcry. It is fact according to the ABC article on the matter cited below that Sarah Palin WAS involved in a church-based effort to ban a book from local bookstores.

Any idiot would conclude she has tried to get books banned, given all of the information.

their archives online and even republishing some of those old articles. It's been pretty easy to verify.

The ABC article is the first that I'd read about Palin being involved with a church that was attempting to ban a particular book from bookstores.

The librarian is NOT denying it. It sounds like she was merely responding to a question about whether specific titles were mentioned by Palin.

:nuke:

and fired the librarian for saying that such a thing isn't happening and then ended up bringing her back.

I don't think it actually went there but she made her intentions known.

See this Time article:

"Stein says that as mayor, Palin continued to inject religious beliefs into her policy at times. "She asked the library how she could go about banning books," he says, because some voters thought they had inappropriate language in them. "The librarian was aghast." That woman, Mary Ellen Baker, couldn't be reached for comment, but news reports from the time show that Palin had threatened to fire Baker for not giving "full support" to the mayor."
http://www.time.com/time/politics/article/0,8599,1837918,00.html

"It would be a shame if something was to happen to all them nice books back there."

Palin's church at the time, the Assembly of God, had been pushing for the removal a book called "Pastor I Am Gay" from local bookstores, according to the book's author Pastor Howard Bess, of the Church of the Covenant in nearby Palmer, Alaska.

"And she was one of them," said Bess, "this whole thing of controlling information, censorship, that's part of the scene," said Bess.

Did she succeed in banning books? No.

Did she issue a specific order to ban specific books? No.

Did she... and this is the question... TRY? YES.

The only debate to be had is how far she went in "trying". And she went just far enough to make her decision whether it would be feasible, and then acted against the person resisting the possibility. She tread carefully in such a way to afford a (very thin) level of plausible deniability.

She repeatedly asked the librarian how the librarian would respond to such a request. The librarian responded that she would resist it. The librarian was fired (and re-instated after public outcry).

Now, she says she fired every town department head. I'd like to see proof of that. Okay, though, let's say she did. She has also said she fired them for "lack of support". The next question is: Is this ethical, or even legal? Another question is: Were there any other records of any official dealings whatsoever with the librarian; because if not, then her resistance to book banning could be the only thing upon which Sarah Palin based the her judgement of "lack of support" (other than voting for the other guy, which as I said, can hardly be ethical, and is possibly illegal).

And as others have pointed out here, contemporaneous newspaper stories connected the firing and the attempt to ban books. And the ABC story posted says Palin was part of an effort by her church to ban a specific book locally. And another party involved states unequivocally that there were 3 specific books mentioned (by Palin), and the librarian gives a "no comment" to that (would neither confirm nor deny it).

People, this is pretty clear, if the media would just do their job.

TRYING to ban books does not necessarily mean issuing an official order to do so, or going on record with a specific list of books she wanted banned. She did not do those things.

But she did most definitely TRY to have books banned.

:thumbsup:

And she also tried to fire the librarian she discussed this with when she sensed she wasn't her kind of librarian.

http://www.frontiersman.com/articles/2008/09/07/breaking_news/doc48c1c8a60d6d9379155484.txt

WASILLA -- In the wake of strong reactions from the city's library director to inquiries about censorship, Wasilla Mayor Sarah Palin on Monday was taking pains to explain her questions about censoring library material were “rhetorical.”

Library Director Mary Ellen Emmons last week said Palin broached the subject with her on two occasions in October - once Palin was elected mayor Oct. 1 but before she took office on Oct. 14, and again in more detail on Monday, Oct. 28. Besides heading the Wasilla City Library, Emmons is also president of the Alaska Library Association.

snip:
Emmons drew a clear distinction Saturday between the nature of Palin's inquiries and an established book-challenge policy in place in Wasilla, and in most public libraries.

“I'm not trying to suppress anyone's views,” Emmons said. “But I told her (Palin) clearly, I will fight anyone who tries to dictate what books can go on the library shelves.”

more at link

Perhaps she should spend more time at the library.

:nuke: